Best starting nation to eliminate the HRE?

[red1]

long time player here. looking for tips on the best starting country with the goal to eliminate the HRE. Early game hints appreciated.

[Marquoz]

By eliminate, do you mean dismantle? If so, I recommend France. Their combination of proximity and power is a strong one.

[Marquoz]

Here's a screenshot of me doing it a couple weeks ago, in 1479. I allied 5 electors and then attacked Trier, which was allied with the Palatinate. Austria defended Trier, I occupied the three necessary capitals, and dismantled the Empire. And then ditched most of my allies, lol. I only kept Bohemia.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3106534779

As for early game hints, I just played a normal France game. Fought a reconquest war with England ASAP for my cores, allied Burgundy and got the BI, took Diplo as my first idea group, etc.

[Damedius]

Poland.

Ally all the electors and rival Austria. Declare a humiliation war on December 11. Rush to siege down Wien. As soon as you do, hit the Dismantle HRE button.

Take the Indebted to the Burghers privilege and use all the Mercs, you need. Make Austria pay for it in the peace deal.

You could do something similar with Bohemia but you might as well just become the HRE Emperor.

[Persony Person]

Has to be France surely. You're big enough at the start that fighting the emperor and all the electors shouldn't be too overwhelming (after some minor blobbing to make sure England/Burgundy is no threat) and you're right next door to the HRE. Ally someone large to who is not on the same front as you, but near the HRE like Poland, Ottomans, Venice, Denmark etc. to make it easier, so you don't take the full brunt of HRE forces, and as many electors as you can.

Austria is almost certainly going to be a rival of yours. War dec Austria (or whoever the emperor is) and co-belligerent electors and as many nations through alliance networks as necessary until you have all the electors that aren't your allies included. Occupy emperor's and all elector's capitals and then delete the HRE. Done.

[Kapika96]

Austria. Destroy it from within.

You're easily the strongest nation in the HRE, have a lot of diplo slots and can easily ally major powers. As the existing emperor you can easily manipulate the election too so you could do the PU over Bohemia, take their electorship. Get a weak OPM near you elected, give them an electorship too to make the next step easier, and then ally any electors that aren't their allies/allies of allies, then declare on them and chain in all electors you aren't allied to, easily destroy the new OPM elector with your size, PUs and strong allies. Then dismantle the HRE, job done.

[monicaida25]

I have never tried to do a speedrun to destroy the HRE, but I would say that in addition to France and Poland, you have the Ottomans, especially since you have Super Mehmed II who can guarantee you military technological level 5 while the Europeans are still lvl 3

[Damedius]

Originally posted by monicaida25:

I have never tried to do a speedrun to destroy the HRE, but I would say that in addition to France and Poland, you have the Ottomans, especially since you have Super Mehmed II who can guarantee you military technological level 5 while the Europeans are still lvl 3

They would definitely be the strongest by themselves, if you keep mil focused you can hit tech 4 by 1447 and tech 5 by 1452..

The only thing I haven't tried is allying the electors as the Ottomans. It should be easy to get Bohemia and call them in to the war. Not sure about the rest.

Originally posted by Kapika96:

Austria. Destroy it from within.

You're easily the strongest nation in the HRE, have a lot of diplo slots and can easily ally major powers. As the existing emperor you can easily manipulate the election too so you could do the PU over Bohemia, take their electorship. Get a weak OPM near you elected, give them an electorship too to make the next step easier, and then ally any electors that aren't their allies/allies of allies, then declare on them and chain in all electors you aren't allied to, easily destroy the new OPM elector with your size, PUs and strong allies. Then dismantle the HRE, job done.

I can't believe I didn't think about this. Definitely the easiest nation to dismantle the HRE with.

[Marquoz]

Originally posted by Kapika96:

Austria. Destroy it from within.

Sure, but why? Austria is designed around being Emperor and does the game's easiest world conquest. Dismantle with a nation that directly benefits from doing so instead of harming itself. France with the Iron Crowned bonus is the obvious choice and I think that makes it "best" even if it's not necessarily the fastest (don't take the mission reward until you have a 15 year old on the throne, though). And you don't have to jump through any hoops to lose the title as France.

[Damedius]

Originally posted by Marquoz:

Sure, but why? Austria is designed around being Emperor and does the game's easiest world conquest. Dismantle with a nation that directly benefits. France with Iron Crowned is the obvious choice and I think that makes it "best" even if it's not necessarily the fastest (don't take the mission reward until you have a 15 year old on the throne, though). And you don't have to jump through any hoops to lose the title as France.

That's the only reason I didn't pick France. Just because you have to deal with England at the beginning. But if you aren't in a rush they are strong option to dismantle the HRE. As you annex your Appange, you can replace them by allying electors. Once you finish annexing all your Appange's, it should be relatively trivial to dismantle the HRE.

[sandestrom]

Austria.

[RCMidas]

You can't dismantle the HRE as its Emperor. That's specifically forbidden to prevent such shenanigans.

[Marquoz]

Right, you have to lose the title. It's doable, certainly, but unless you get lucky and die heirless, it does require some work. I think dismantling as France is about as easy, and you get the great Iron Crowned reward for your efforts while Austria just weakens itself.

[Kapika96]

Originally posted by Marquoz:

Originally posted by Kapika96:

Austria. Destroy it from within.

Sure, but why? Austria is designed around being Emperor and does the game's easiest world conquest. Dismantle with a nation that directly benefits from doing so instead of harming itself. France with the Iron Crowned bonus is the obvious choice and I think that makes it "best" even if it's not necessarily the fastest (don't take the mission reward until you have a 15 year old on the throne, though). And you don't have to jump through any hoops to lose the title as France.

If your goal is just to destroy the HRE and you don't particularly care about benefiting from it, then it's hard to look past Austria.

Sometimes doing silly things like that is fun even if it isn't strong. I once did a game where I started as France, conquered England, culture shifted and formed GB. Most likely not optimal, but fun nonetheless.

[Marquoz]

Originally posted by Kapika96:

Sometimes doing silly things like that is fun even if it isn't strong.

Oh, definitely, and I do them myself. From a pure power-gaming perspective, destroying the HRE as a Catholic nation is definitely silly. Taking it over and revoking is always the strongest play. But when the OP asked for "best," I approached it from the perspective of what nation benefits most from dismantling, not from who can theoretically do it quickest. And from that perspective, I think France wins.

[Myll]

Originally posted by Kapika96:

Austria. Destroy it from within.

You're easily the strongest nation in the HRE, have a lot of diplo slots and can easily ally major powers. As the existing emperor you can easily manipulate the election too so you could do the PU over Bohemia, take their electorship. Get a weak OPM near you elected, give them an electorship too to make the next step easier, and then ally any electors that aren't their allies/allies of allies, then declare on them and chain in all electors you aren't allied to, easily destroy the new OPM elector with your size, PUs and strong allies. Then dismantle the HRE, job done.

You "can" but it's simply a self-nerf, as if you waited until in-game to select "Hard" mode of the game, so while you can do it, the game play-through is now more difficult for Austria to carry out. If the only thing one wants to do is just one time in all their EU4 playing - to dismantle the HRE, then - ok, it's a way to do it, but don't do this if you actually want to play the game's entire timeline potential. Ha, if you do want a challenge, ratchet down to "Very Easy" and try to dismantle the HRE starting as Luneberg. I know, sounds looney (pun intended).