HRE is invisible on map as Byzantium

[Comrade Maethor]

I just noticed that the HRE is invisible but still present. The whole UI for the HRE is gone, but if I right click on HRE members I see that they're a part of the empire. Even the map mode is blank.

[grotaclas]

Maybe you can't see the capital of the current emperor. This would hide the HRE button. But a blank map mode seems weird. Can you post a screenshot of the diplomacy interface of an HRE member with the HRE map mode with that country in the background?

[Carefreegold3373]

grotacles pls help me and tell the reason why my heir got vanished in the other thread

[Comrade Maethor]

Originally posted by grotaclas:

Maybe you can't see the capital of the current emperor. This would hide the HRE button. But a blank map mode seems weird. Can you post a screenshot of the diplomacy interface of an HRE member with the HRE map mode with that country in the background?

I should have prefaced, I am using Extended Timeline but I've never encountered this problem before anyway.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2852241602
As you can see, Austria is a member of the HRE as demonstrated by the icon, but the map mode is completely blank and the HRE interface is missing.

[grotaclas]

At which date did you start the campaign? Should the HRE have existed at that point?
Did you maybe look at different start dates before starting your campaign? Just clicking on the bookmark can be enough to cause problems.

The map mode is not completely blank. It shows some shaded provinces which look like they could be HRE provinces which are owned by non-members.

If your save is not ironman, you could make an uncompressed save and open it with a good text editor and look for the empire= section. It should list the tag who is emperor and some other information. Maybe it is still JMN (Jan Mayen) which the mod uses as a dummy emperor on the dates before the HRE exists.

[Comrade Maethor]

Originally posted by grotaclas:

At which date did you start the campaign? Should the HRE have existed at that point?
Did you maybe look at different start dates before starting your campaign? Just clicking on the bookmark can be enough to cause problems.

The map mode is not completely blank. It shows some shaded provinces which look like they could be HRE provinces which are owned by non-members.

If your save is not ironman, you could make an uncompressed save and open it with a good text editor and look for the empire= section. It should list the tag who is emperor and some other information. Maybe it is still JMN (Jan Mayen) which the mod uses as a dummy emperor on the dates before the HRE exists.

Started in 1444. I unzipped the save file and looked at the gamestate file. I couldn't find what you were talking about, only who the Emperor of China was and a bunch of preferred_emperor=

I did see this though:

 empire={
	hre_dismantled=yes
	continent=0
	imperial_ban_allowed=no
	internal_hre_cb=yes
	hre_inheritable=no
	allows_female_emperor=no
	emperor_has_revoked=no
	electors={
		TRI SAX PAL MAI KOL BRA BOH 
	}
	emperor_previous_rank=2
	imperial_realm_war=no
} 

Was the HRE dismantled somehow?

[RCMidas]

The HRE will be auto-dismantled if no viable emperor is available on the death of the previous one. But if you started in 1444, then Austria should already BE the emperor (as you indeed said was the case) without any possibility of a death having happened...

Hmm, I wonder if there's a legacy system in place for the Extended Timeline mod so that it can track who was supposed to be emperor at any given start date. If so, what may have happened is that it loaded in the emperor of an earlier start date for the purposes of tracking that legacy condition (maybe for who passed which reform, or that interesting "emperor_previous_rank" value) and when it set them to be dead so that the correct 1444 emperor was allocated, the HRE instead decided that between those two figures there WERE no viable emperors and it dismantled itself...but Austria was still marked as the HREmperor.

[Comrade Maethor]

Originally posted by RCMidas:

The HRE will be auto-dismantled if no viable emperor is available on the death of the previous one. But if you started in 1444, then Austria should already BE the emperor (as you indeed said was the case) without any possibility of a death having happened...

Hmm, I wonder if there's a legacy system in place for the Extended Timeline mod so that it can track who was supposed to be emperor at any given start date. If so, what may have happened is that it loaded in the emperor of an earlier start date for the purposes of tracking that legacy condition (maybe for who passed which reform, or that interesting "emperor_previous_rank" value) and when it set them to be dead so that the correct 1444 emperor was allocated, the HRE instead decided that between those two figures there WERE no viable emperors and it dismantled itself...but Austria was still marked as the HREmperor.

Then why does the game still have the HRE icon in the diplomacy screen for countries?

[RCMidas]

I don't know. The bigger the code, the more weird shizzle happens even in the most well-organised of games WITHOUT player modification. Throw in that as well, and anything could happen for no good reason whatsoever at any given moment without any prelude...more frequently than it might do anyway.

What happens if you start as a different country NOT Austria, and what happens if you start as Austria? All other parameters being the same, of course, for science.

[grotaclas]

Originally posted by Comrade Maethor:

Started in 1444. I unzipped the save file and looked at the gamestate file. I couldn't find what you were talking about, only who the Emperor of China was and a bunch of preferred_emperor=

I did see this though:

 empire={
	hre_dismantled=yes
	continent=0
	imperial_ban_allowed=no
	internal_hre_cb=yes
	hre_inheritable=no
	allows_female_emperor=no
	emperor_has_revoked=no
	electors={
		TRI SAX PAL MAI KOL BRA BOH 
	}
	emperor_previous_rank=2
	imperial_realm_war=no
} 

Was the HRE dismantled somehow?

That's the section which I was talking about. The first line makes it look like the HRE was dismantled. But I don't know how a dismantled HRE should look like in a normal save.

I tried to start in 1444 with the ET mod and the HRE looked normal. Maybe the AI managed to dismantle it between 1444 and your 1464 screenshot. And maybe there is a bug in eu4 or in the mod which prevented the dismantling to remove all members.

[Comrade Maethor]

Originally posted by grotaclas:

Originally posted by Comrade Maethor:

Started in 1444. I unzipped the save file and looked at the gamestate file. I couldn't find what you were talking about, only who the Emperor of China was and a bunch of preferred_emperor=

I did see this though:

 empire={
	hre_dismantled=yes
	continent=0
	imperial_ban_allowed=no
	internal_hre_cb=yes
	hre_inheritable=no
	allows_female_emperor=no
	emperor_has_revoked=no
	electors={
		TRI SAX PAL MAI KOL BRA BOH 
	}
	emperor_previous_rank=2
	imperial_realm_war=no
} 

Was the HRE dismantled somehow?

That's the section which I was talking about. The first line makes it look like the HRE was dismantled. But I don't know how a dismantled HRE should look like in a normal save.

I tried to start in 1444 with the ET mod and the HRE looked normal. Maybe the AI managed to dismantle it between 1444 and your 1464 screenshot. And maybe there is a bug in eu4 or in the mod which prevented the dismantling to remove all members.

RCMidas in this post said that there could have been a perfect series of events that led to the AI auto-dismantling the empire after no viable country could become emperor. But yeah, I think all we can do is chock it up to some weird occurrence, but even if the AI did auto-dismantle it idk why the HRE icon still shows up in diplomacy screens and why the map mode is blank besides the dashed Burgundian HRE provinces.

[RCMidas]

Protip Comrade: Between grotaclas and literally ANYONE ELSE when it comes to technical questions, always favour grotaclas' response. The best I can offer is "well, some weird unseen bug did this".

[grotaclas]

Originally posted by RCMidas:

Protip Comrade: Between grotaclas and literally ANYONE ELSE when it comes to technical questions, always favour grotaclas' response. The best I can offer is "well, some weird unseen bug did this".

In this case, I don't really know the reason either. It could be some weird auto-dismantling like you suggested. I don't think that it would happen immediately when starting a game in 1444 unless you look at other start dates or other saves beforehand. But it could happen due to some extended timeline event for example.

[Comrade Maethor]

Originally posted by grotaclas:

Originally posted by RCMidas:

Protip Comrade: Between grotaclas and literally ANYONE ELSE when it comes to technical questions, always favour grotaclas' response. The best I can offer is "well, some weird unseen bug did this".

In this case, I don't really know the reason either. It could be some weird auto-dismantling like you suggested. I don't think that it would happen immediately when starting a game in 1444 unless you look at other start dates or other saves beforehand. But it could happen due to some extended timeline event for example.

I mean I never noticed the HRE being gone at the start of the game, playing as Byzantium what was going on in Germany wasn't in my purview lol