Zoroastrian Persia vs Shia Persia

[Server Jester]

Im gunna try an Ardabil into Persia game soon, going for Shahanshah and This is Persia but I may also go Zoroastrian to knock out that Zoroastrian achievement but I am wondering: how viable is Zoroastrianism?
I know its great when combined with Religious ideas which practically gives you a casus beli on everyone, but staying Shia should give you that too, just not against....uh
Shirvan and Bahmanis?

[Ares]

Zoroastrian is basicly only worth it for that Monnument and achivement ofc, but it will take time before you get enough money to fully upgrade it. Once you do tho, you'll have +10 discipline, -10 fire dmg recieved, +5% land fire dmg, and -10% culture conversion cost. The rituals are ok. Will help with conversian and economy. Zoroastrian has +2 tolerance of the true faith. and +10 trade efficency. All zoroastrian provinces recieve -2% missionary strength.

Shia gives +5 morale, +100 chance of new heir. And you can choose a school, +10% shock dmg for example. and you can invite a scholar for another bonus. With the new estates, you can pick priveleges so that inviting scholars are free and don't require any releations to get them.
Then there's the extremely good Legalism vs Mysticism, meaning you can get -10% tech cost, +20% manpower and +20% National tax modifier. Or go Mysticism and get +10% morale of armies, +3% missionary strength and +20% fort defense. On Top of that you can trade Piety for -2 Corruption or manpower, so it's basicly free cash or manpower whenever you are att full and get an event that would otherwise waste the piety.

So Shia is clearly stronger overall. But if you want that achivement...

[Server Jester]

nvm i cant even get past the opening as Ardabil lmao

[RCMidas]

If you go Religious Ideas, then Zoroastrian is better because you will be the only nation of that religion and thus have a permanent CB against everyone. Plus you ought to be a Feudal Theocracy for mass claims against every adjacent province on a 5-year cooldown. That's a lot of adm points saved for coring.

[Malvastor]

Originally posted by RCMidas:

If you go Religious Ideas, then Zoroastrian is better because you will be the only nation of that religion and thus have a permanent CB against everyone.

I don't think there are many Shia nations to begin with- most Muslim states by far are Sunni- so this isn't that major an advantage. You'll still have Cleansing of Heresy against Sunni countries.

[RCMidas]

Bahmanis, Gujarat, Qara Qoyunlu, and a couple of minor Arabian nations; very true.

[Ares]

Originally posted by PunishedMuskovy:

nvm i cant even get past the opening as Ardabil lmao

I have done it a long time ago, i think you have to reset unthil QQ isent hostile towards you. Might be some other strat now tho that im not aware of, but getting QQ as an ally is very helpful.

[Server Jester]

Originally posted by RCMidas:

Bahmanis, Gujarat, Qara Qoyunlu, and a couple of minor Arabian nations; very true.

thought Gujarat was Sunni

[Server Jester]

Originally posted by Ares:

Originally posted by PunishedMuskovy:

nvm i cant even get past the opening as Ardabil lmao

I have done it a long time ago, i think you have to reset unthil QQ isent hostile towards you. Might be some other strat now tho that im not aware of, but getting QQ as an ally is very helpful.

in all my 17 attempts Qara was either hostile or domineering

[Ares]

Originally posted by RCMidas:

If you go Religious Ideas, then Zoroastrian is better because you will be the only nation of that religion and thus have a permanent CB against everyone. Plus you ought to be a Feudal Theocracy for mass claims against every adjacent province on a 5-year cooldown. That's a lot of adm points saved for coring.

The Shia nations are mostly close to you, but once those are eaten up, it's almost all sunni. Feudal Theocracy is pretty sweet. Claims on every none shia/zoro and that -20 dev cost in capital province is very strong early game when you need to dev in renaissance, and -15 constuction cost for 5 years, so you can save a lot of MP and cash. And now im itching for another Persia game thinking of this :P hehe.

[Ares]

Originally posted by PunishedMuskovy:

Originally posted by Ares:

I have done it a long time ago, i think you have to reset unthil QQ isent hostile towards you. Might be some other strat now tho that im not aware of, but getting QQ as an ally is very helpful.

in all my 17 attempts Qara was either hostile or domineering

Yeah it took me a lot of restarts aswell, and i don't know ofc if this strat works anymore.

Take the +25 releations with fellow belivers from the estate prievelege, and do a scornful insult on one of his rivals, and set your self as threatend by one of his rivals. And keep building releations with him. That can perhaps change his attitude, but i havent tested it.

If it doesnt work, and restarting some more times to get a diffrent attitude did'nt work, then ally up on those you can, that you arnt looking to conquer straight away to deter him from attacking you, the more allies you have the less chance that he will attack you.

[RCMidas]

Originally posted by PunishedMuskovy:

Originally posted by RCMidas:

Bahmanis, Gujarat, Qara Qoyunlu, and a couple of minor Arabian nations; very true.

thought Gujarat was Sunni

Correct, I looked again. I was thinking of Kashmir and somehow got very confused.