is it allright that technology is developing so slow ?

[Orxan]

I am playing as Nomadic Qara Qoyunlu and it seems impossible to do anything.army is too weak with this technology is going so slow

[spartakisteqc]

Unfortunately, yes. Nomads have a malus to research institutions spread and many aren't even Feudal at the start meaning that already start very backward. I would suggest you first to be extremely agressive early on when you're not too much at a disadvantage. The goal here would be take land in areas where the institutions will spread early. If you could get close to the Balkans, since Renaissance starts in Italy, it should spread there reasonably fast. Genoa also has a few provinces in Crimea initially, so it might spread there too. Even if you can't make it to there, the Ottomans usually get Renaissance relatively soon and so, you probably will be able to profit from that if you get to their border.

The second thing I would do is to accumulate as much cash as you can. This is because when embracing an institution, you have to pay for each province where the institution hasn't fully spread in it. The higher the development, the higher you have to pay (I think it's capped at 30 development).

The last thing that you can do is to invest your monarch pts in provinces to make it spread faster. The natural spread is increased by the level of development of the province and you also get some progress each time you invest monarch pts in the province for increasing development in addition of accelerating the monthly spread. I hope this will help.

Edit: I think that the innovative idea group has an idea that accelerates institutions spread. It could be a good idea to take it since it also includes an idea that reduces tech costs. Other idea groups reducing the cost of techs would be a good idea too. Aristocratic reduces military tech costs, diplomatic for diplomacy and administrative for the last one.

[Orxan]

Originally posted by spartakisteqc:

Unfortunately, yes. Nomads have a malus to research institutions spread and many aren't even Feudal at the start meaning that already start very backward. I would suggest you first to be extremely agressive early on when you're not too much at a disadvantage. The goal here would be take land in areas where the institutions will spread early. If you could get close to the Balkans, since Renaissance starts in Italy, it should spread there reasonably fast. Genoa also has a few provinces in Crimea initially, so it might spread there too. Even if you can't make it to there, the Ottomans usually get Renaissance relatively soon and so, you probably will be able to profit from that if you get to their border.

The second thing I would do is to accumulate as much cash as you can. This is because when embracing an institution, you have to pay for each province where the institution hasn't fully spread in it. The higher the development, the higher you have to pay (I think it's capped at 30 development).

The last thing that you can do is to invest your monarch pts in provinces to make it spread faster. The natural spread is increased by the level of development of the province and you also get some progress each time you invest monarch pts in the province for increasing development in addition of accelerating the monthly spread. I hope this will help.

Edit: I think that the innovative idea group has an idea that accelerates institutions spread. It could be a good idea to take it since it also includes an idea that reduces tech costs. Other idea groups reducing the cost of techs would be a good idea too. Aristocratic reduces military tech costs, diplomatic for diplomacy and administrative for the last one.

its really hard to make it with Qara Qoyunlu especially if you are beginner.after so many tries looks like I am doing it.

[spartakisteqc]

Yeah, they're a bit far away. If you can't do it, getting close to the genoese provinces in Crimea could do the trick or just bordering the Ottomans. They usually get in the Balkans and they get most institutions fairly quickly. You will have to accept that you won't be all the time up to date. Just try to get military as high as possible and you should do ok until you can get close to western nations.

[Strifeboy]

That feel when colonism institute is doing something dumb, 25 years and it stopped at catiline and is going through the whole Muslim world.

Its ether bugged or trying to screw me.

[spartakisteqc]

I hate the colonialism institution. It almost always spawn in Portugal and it takes ages to come in Germany, let alone further in the East. I think they should make it spread much more quickly or remove it and replace it with something less Europe centric.

[Solitus]

There is a way around that if you have the Common Sense DLC. Every time you develop a province, it increases the institution spread to that province and then stalls. The bonus also stacks the more you develop.

So when Colonialism starts, pick a province and start dumping monarch points into it. You can then "buy" the institution if you don't want to wait for it to spread to you naturally.

This works for all institution levels. I saw a video where a guy embraced the Renaissance as Ming by ~1460's.

[spartakisteqc]

It's a good idea, but it must be tricky to balance the expense in monarch pts with remaining technologically up to date. You might have to wait before taking national ideas if you do this.

[Solitus]

Definitely a tricky balance, and I don't know yet where the optimal breakpoints are. It is a no brainer for someone like Ming who is going to take so long to get Renaissance; but not sure if it's as valuable for Brandenburg who is waiting for Colonialism.

[Exarch_Alpha]

Every neighbour of you is waiting too so if you fall behind in tech it´s because you did dumb decisions. Between development and war indemnties you should have zero trouble buying colonialism once it´s available. If you can´t it´s because you suck.

Instead of thinking "who I will conquer now to use my ADM?" you should be thinking "should I conquer, increase stability or develop provinces?" The game changed, change with it. Or fail.

[Darksinth]

massively developing a province is not adviced as a horde, because higher development causes your horde unity to drop down faster

[Darksinth]

I'm not saying the act of dumping monarch points into development is an issue. I've done the same thing as Vijayanagar to give me an even higher tech than most Europeans. But I would not advice it while you're playing a horde. As a horde you'll lose your horde unity (legitimacy) faster if you have higher development, so by buffing a province with development you're basically messing up your own legitimacy, instead of simply waiting for stuff to come your way naturally.

Mind you, if you're one beast of a horde player you can get away with it. But if you, like me, are struggling to maintain your horde unity and survive beyond 1550 as a horde than you best not mess around with developing provinces as a horde.

[Darksinth]

Originally posted by Ultrix Prime:

Originally posted by Belphegor:

I'm not saying the act of dumping monarch points into development is an issue. I've done the same thing as Vijayanagar to give me an even higher tech than most Europeans. But I would not advice it while you're playing a horde. As a horde you'll lose your horde unity (legitimacy) faster if you have higher development, so by buffing a province with development you're basically messing up your own legitimacy, instead of simply waiting for stuff to come your way naturally.

Mind you, if you're one beast of a horde player you can get away with it. But if you, like me, are struggling to maintain your horde unity and survive beyond 1550 as a horde than you best not mess around with developing provinces as a horde.

I still don't see a connection. Horde Unity decays and we use razing and looting to increase it. Increasing development isn't, afaik, related to the decay. It's true, I think, that the decay goes up once the nation has a certain amount of development. But there's no easy way of dodging that in any event. Constant wars with looting and razing solves the decay pretty well. The biggest threat to Horde Unity is staying at peace for too long, imo.

I believe the decay keeps growing with every x-amount of development, which is why I recommend not getting too much development and focus on reforming ASAP.

[Orxan]

Originally posted by Ultrix Prime:

I played QQ and didn't have any problems with tech.

Firstly, QQ starts with feudalism so it's not too hard to buy renaissance.

Secondly, you can invade Anatolia and develop land on the coastline so that colonialism and the rest don't take much.

Thirdly, tribes massively increase autonomy while giving manpower such that the embracement costs go way down.

Additionally, razing gives money and MPs anyway and this lowers development wherever you want, such as moving east.

Likewise, the horde CBs mean never spending diplo for new land. So diplo builds up and that can be invested into institution spread in western states closer to Europe.

Of all the hordes, QQ, imo, is best situated to manage and take advantage of institution spread.

I had no problem staying ahead of the Ottomans.

I guess I should have bought dlc for it first

[Orxan]

Originally posted by Ultrix Prime:

Originally posted by ✬Orxan ✬:

I guess I should have bought dlc for it first

Hordes without Cossacks is pretty difficult to play. You pretty much need to make a beeline for reforming into Muslim tech, imo, without Cossacks.

Even with Cossacks, it's a little bit of a balancing act.

Yeah I have noticed that you get bonuses with dlc.unfortunatelly I realised that after sales ended...

[Strifeboy]

Originally posted by Solitus:

There is a way around that if you have the Common Sense DLC. Every time you develop a province, it increases the institution spread to that province and then stalls. The bonus also stacks the more you develop.

So when Colonialism starts, pick a province and start dumping monarch points into it. You can then "buy" the institution if you don't want to wait for it to spread to you naturally.

This works for all institution levels. I saw a video where a guy embraced the Renaissance as Ming by ~1460's.

That does't work for colonism, 0% everyone in euro but the spain area in 25 years.