Aristocratic is the best military idea

[Medicles]

+1 Leader siege
+33% National manpower modifier
+0,5 Yearly absolutism
+1 Diplomat
+1 Leader siege
+ 1 Leader without upkeep
-10% Military technology cost
+1 Leader siege

Perfect for early game. Did you know it has +1 Leader siege?

[bri]

It's been buffed a fair bit over the years while other groups have been crushed by the nerf bat...

[Medicles]

The buffs were needed then, because i am fairly sure that i ignored Aristocratic for the vast majority of my playtime.

[Sugar]

The problem with aristo is that it has no synergy with other idea groups in terms of policies. There's also the fact that aristo gives you nice bonuses but none of them are coherent with one another. They're just adequate by themselves.
Offensive + innovative gives you +1 leader siege and 10% siege ability, both of which idea groups are more or less a staple for any non-meme run.

[bri]

Eh, I can't remember the last time I took offensive (if ever); I prefer to go defensive and quality for mil groups in most cases. This is especially true if taking a mil group first as the + morale rules the early game...

[Sugar]

Defensive ideas are good, but they just don't synergize with anything nor give any good policies. Offensive has amazing policies with Innovative, Humanist and Religious with the latter being kind of situational.
Quality ideas by themselves are garbage. A naked 10% infantry combat ability changes nothing, but if you combined it with the Innovative policy and have ICA in your national ideas you get the so called "space marines". The Quality + Inno policy used to be a lot stronger before a few patches, but it got nerfed cus Florry teared open a new one on someone during a pre-release Emperor multiplayer session hosted by PDX.

[Raider Deci]

Defensive pretty much always for the first military idea. That morale boost helps so much

[Damedius]

Are we talking SP or MP?

SP Quantity and Offensive are the two best. In SP all you need is more troops and the money to be able to field them.

[Marquoz]

Originally posted by Damedius:

Are we talking SP or MP?

SP Quantity and Offensive are the two best. In SP all you need is more troops and the money to be able to field them.

Right. In SP, I never take a military idea in my first 6 groups. After that, I might consider it, but against the AI, military ideas are never necessary.

[tonypa]

Originally posted by Medicles:

+1 Leader siege
+33% National manpower modifier
+0,5 Yearly absolutism
+1 Diplomat
+1 Leader siege
+ 1 Leader without upkeep
-10% Military technology cost
+1 Leader siege

Perfect for early game. Did you know it has +1 Leader siege?

+1 Siege is unlocked after you finish the idea group. Not sure if that can be considered "Early game". I would say "Early game" only counts for first 3-4 ideas in each group. In that sense +15% Morale of armies from Defensive is "Early" as it is second idea, while Deus Vult from Religious is not as it is last in the idea group.

[Medicles]

Originally posted by Sugar:

The problem with aristo is that it has no synergy with other idea groups in terms of policies. There's also the fact that aristo gives you nice bonuses but none of them are coherent with one another. They're just adequate by themselves.
Offensive + innovative gives you +1 leader siege and 10% siege ability, both of which idea groups are more or less a staple for any non-meme run.

+33% National manpower modifier with Exploration, which makes it even better for colonizers.
-1 Unrest and +1% Missionary strength with Religious isnt too bad either.
Basically its own idea again with +1 Diplomat and +1 Leader without upkeep when having Diplomatic ideas.

Three useful policies are quite good for an idea group.

Offensive + Innovative are already two ideas for something i can have with one. Innovative is also not staple for a non-meme run. Innovative is meme. Administrative, Diplomatic, Religious/Humanist and Influence are absolute staples. Like Marquoz said, military ideas are not needed in the first ideas groups. Thats why Aristocratic is the best, because it helps you with other stuff than just military and still has significant ideas like Leader siege to make a huge difference.

Originally posted by tonypa:

+1 Siege is unlocked after you finish the idea group. Not sure if that can be considered "Early game". I would say "Early game" only counts for first 3-4 ideas in each group. In that sense +15% Morale of armies from Defensive is "Early" as it is second idea, while Deus Vult from Religious is not as it is last in the idea group.

Yeah, our definition of early game is different. Though it should be possible to finish Aristocratic quite early when focusing on military points.

[TheSaboteur]

*Ignores army tradition*

[Medicles]

Originally posted by TheSaboteur:

*Ignores army tradition*

I find the decay rather negligible, same as the cavalry idea.

[Anaverageguy41]

Originally posted by Marquoz:

Originally posted by Damedius:

Are we talking SP or MP?

SP Quantity and Offensive are the two best. In SP all you need is more troops and the money to be able to field them.

Right. In SP, I never take a military idea in my first 6 groups. After that, I might consider it, but against the AI, military ideas are never necessary.

Hard disagree there
But your opinion is your opinion

[Marquoz]

Originally posted by Anaverageguy41:

Originally posted by Marquoz:

Right. In SP, I never take a military idea in my first 6 groups. After that, I might consider it, but against the AI, military ideas are never necessary.

Hard disagree there
But your opinion is your opinion

My opinion is based on 3500 hours of play and every achievement, so it clearly works whether you "hard disagree" or not. You don't need military ideas to beat the AI, which is very bad at warfare. Taking idea groups that give you a better economy, or reduce coring cost, or improve diplomacy, or open up colonization, or whatever is far more efficient.
Military ideas would make wars a little easier--but I already crush the AI, so why bother? I'd rather use those precious idea picks on things that have a noticeable effect on the outcome of the game.

[Mr_MeGusta]

Would still rather go for Offensive Ideas for siege +1 shock and fire, and 5% discipline.