Weighing Forming Egypt vs Remaining as Mamluks Government Type

[Aluminum Elite Master]

First of all, been eons since I played as Mamluks, but figured it's a good time to try them out since the Ottomans to their north are a bit less OP now.

But this is interesting: since the Mamluks got their own government type a number of patches ago, I'm seeing that there's a bit more of a trade-off to forming Egypt than there used to be. What I mean is: Mamluks have *more* accepted culture slots in their government, and get the Circasian cultural power abilities, two things Egypt doesn't get. Further, Egypt moves to them to a monarchy-style system of consorts and heirs rather than the sort-of OP Mamluk system where I can often take a ruler that boosts army tradition +15%.

Hence, there's serious trade-offs now to forming Egypt (forming Arabia I may get to down the line, which bumps me up to Empire rank but is definitely worth it when I get there).



Long story short:

Anyone have any compelling arguments one way or the other? I'm almost tempted to skip forming Egypt and just wait to form Arabia due to some of the things I'll lose out on switching to Egypt.

[Mr.M]

...both are purely flavor, they dont really give anything (Egypt even being a downgrade with losing the government)

They both also give free Empire rank which shouldnt be hard to reach tho considering Egypt needs admin 20 - unless you play without DLCs

If you dont have Empire rank yet form Arabia, otherwise its purely for the sake of the color

[Aluminum Elite Master]

Originally posted by MrMonokel2000:

...both are purely flavor, they dont really give anything (Egypt even being a downgrade with losing the government)

They both also give free Empire rank which shouldnt be hard to reach tho considering Egypt needs admin 20 - unless you play without DLCs

If you dont have Empire rank yet form Arabia, otherwise its purely for the sake of the color

Egypt doesn't give free Empire rank, though. I checked and it is still just a kingdom if that switch gets made, unless that's out-dated info I found. Only forming Arabia boosts the government to Empire rank.

Egypt's main thing looks like the claims on Egypt's provinces and a temporary (20 year I think) monthly autonomy boost.

So, I'm still looking at it a bit. I do agree somewhat though that I think Egypt is looking like a slight downgrade so far, though.

[Rodi]

Mamluks into rum seems fun.

[Aluminum Elite Master]

Originally posted by 187:

Mamluks into rum seems fun.

Yes, that's what I am doing right now. It's 1699 currently, finally did form Arabia, and taking apart the Ottomans with the help of Hungry and Austria.

Originally posted by Ultrix Prime:

I believe your ruler also automatically gets +2 added to admin stats guaranteeing more admin mp throughout the game. This alone makes staying Mamluks worth it imo. Aside from that, it didn't used to get any unique ideas - not sure if that's changed. But all in all I think the Mamluks are massively better than forming Egypt for the other reasons you stated as well.

I did skip forming Egypt. I jumped to forming Arabia straight from the Mamluks, just to get the free Empire upgrade. Because yes, you're right in that Mamluks are better off than Egypt government-wise.

I am now trying to compare what Arabia actually gives. The empire upgrade I think I could have done anyways once I settled peace and got the last piece of the puzzle (Baghdad, from the Ottomans). I think I crossed the 1,000 dev threshold naturally at that same time for that upgrade.

The whole situation is just interesting because Mamluks didn't used to have their own government type. That's the main trade-off... the traditions/ideas I have, now that I am Arabia, are still the Mamluk ones, which is good. But trying to sort out now if even Arabia was that much of an upgrade (I formed them for the Arabian Coffee achievement, but aside from the achieve am still thinking Mamluks were maybe better).

[Aluminum Elite Master]

Yeah, the main thing really is the admin points. Monarch points are one of the biggest elements of the game, so looking at it, the Mamluks actually appear to be better than forming either Egypt or Arabia.

That said, I just looked in-game, and it looks like I can take the Tier 1 government reform to go back to Mamluk Government... I haven't tried it yet because I assume that that will end being Arabia (or Egypt, if I had formed them as well). Not sure on that part, as it looks like I can still go back to the Mamluk Government type via the tier 1 reform.

But again, ultimately yes, it appears like Mamluks get a decent boost to admin MP, and that probably is the best buff available.