THE HRE is really annoying thing

[fat gaben]

hello am trying to form germany , and you know all germany states are in the HRE , and austria all the time is the protector of the hre and they are allied to scandavia and uk and alooot of superior powers making forming germany almost impossible !!!
any solutions?
also iam obliged to declare war also on austria when attacking hre states means am fighting austria allies also wtf !!!!

[fat gaben]

also when other hre states declare war on each other , austria doesnt do ♥♥♥♥ ?? why ? why iam the only one austria stands in my face !! ♥♥♥♥ austria -_-

[Matze3]

Originally posted by Spoderman:

hello am trying to form germany , and you know all germany states are in the HRE , and austria all the time is the protector of the hre and they are allied to scandavia and uk and alooot of superior powers making forming germany almost impossible !!!
any solutions?
also iam obliged to declare war also on austria when attacking hre states means am fighting austria allies also wtf !!!!

the emporer is only called into the war if you aren´t part of the hre and against his cities(don´t know the english term but german term is "reichsstadt")

[fat gaben]

Originally posted by Matze3:

Originally posted by Spoderman:

hello am trying to form germany , and you know all germany states are in the HRE , and austria all the time is the protector of the hre and they are allied to scandavia and uk and alooot of superior powers making forming germany almost impossible !!!
any solutions?
also iam obliged to declare war also on austria when attacking hre states means am fighting austria allies also wtf !!!!

the emporer is only called into the war if you aren´t part of the hre and against his cities(don´t know the english term but german term is "reichsstadt")

dude iam bavaaria? and a member of hre , you cannot form germany without starting as hre member

[c00lizz]

Originally posted by Spoderman:

Originally posted by Matze3:

the emporer is only called into the war if you aren´t part of the hre and against his cities(don´t know the english term but german term is "reichsstadt")

dude iam bavaaria? and a member of hre , you cannot form germany without starting as hre member

Yes you can, all that's required is Germanic Culture.

And if you are a member of the HRE the Emperor does not get an automatic call to arms unless you attack his allies directly or a Free City.

[Matze3]

Originally posted by Spoderman:

Originally posted by Matze3:

the emporer is only called into the war if you aren´t part of the hre and against his cities(don´t know the english term but german term is "reichsstadt")

dude iam bavaaria? and a member of hre , you cannot form germany without starting as hre member

yes with teutonic order it was possible... don´t know if you still can.
if you are bavaria he shouldn´t be called into the war except you attack a "Reichsstadt"... i think nuremberg is one so if you want to attack that city you have to wait till austria got very high war exhaustion or high debts

[Silent]

Originally posted by Spoderman:

Originally posted by Matze3:

the emporer is only called into the war if you aren´t part of the hre and against his cities(don´t know the english term but german term is "reichsstadt")

dude iam bavaaria? and a member of hre , you cannot form germany without starting as hre member

It's because you are attacking a free city. Some smaller one province minors are granted Free City status by the emperor of the HRE. Even with a claim, Austria will still defend them. One way to get around this is to check the allies of the Free cities. If they have any small allies that are not allied to any large powers and you are bordering them, then fabricate claims on them to drag the Free City into a war without Austria. Then after the war vassalize or take them instead.

[fat gaben]

Originally posted by c00lizz:

Originally posted by Spoderman:

dude iam bavaaria? and a member of hre , you cannot form germany without starting as hre member

Yes you can, all that's required is Germanic Culture.

And if you are a member of the HRE the Emperor does not get an automatic call to arms unless you attack his allies directly or a Free City.

i got it now , free cities..
last try i was prussia and almost conquered all eu but bcuz of my stupidity i left the hre and didnt know that , so that made it impossible to make germany however all left for me is 3 countries

[Matze3]

Originally posted by SilentAssassin:

Originally posted by Spoderman:

dude iam bavaaria? and a member of hre , you cannot form germany without starting as hre member

It's because you are attacking a free city. Some smaller one province minors are granted Free City status by the emperor of the HRE. Even with a claim, Austria will still defend them. One way to get around this is to check the allies of the Free cities. If they have any small allies that are not allied to any large powers and you are bordering them, then fabricate claims on them to drag the Free City into a war without Austria. Then after the war vassalize or take them instead.

ahhh free city is the english word.....

[Ficelle]

HRE is not a place where you expand a lot via conquest unless uber dominant.

AE is very high, so coalitions form fast.
The Emperor will always intervene as full belligerant (can call allies) if helping.
You can still conquer a bit here and there if you are opportunist, but slowly or be prepared to face massive coalitions.

Best way is to become the Emperor yourself, either by bedfiending or vassalizing some electors, while expanding mostly in another place.

HRE is mostly diplo game, unless able to bruteforce everyone at once.

[fat gaben]

Originally posted by Ficelle:

HRE is not a place where you expand a lot via conquest unless uber dominant.

AE is very high, so coalitions form fast.
The Emperor will always intervene as full belligerant (can call allies) if helping.
You can still conquer a bit here and there if you are opportunist, but slowly or be prepared to face massive coalitions.

Best way is to become the Emperor yourself, either by bedfiending or vassalizing some electors, while expanding mostly in another place.

HRE is mostly diplo game, unless able to bruteforce everyone at once.

so how do you suggest forming germany? if eu is not expanding area

[Matze3]

a mix of both ... war and diplo vassalization

[fat gaben]

Originally posted by Matze3:

a mix of both ... war and diplo vassalization

vassalization is impossible if the state is a voter or elector or even a member it gives -25 for a member which is the smallest amount if voter its -1000

[c00lizz]

You form Germany the same way you form any other nation. Conquer the required provinces, wait for the required tech. You just need to conquer a tad slower in the HRE. Influence ideas, Papal Controller and the Diplomat advisor helps MASSIVELY.

[Ficelle]

Force vassalization of OPM / TPM electors.
Sux balls of the others.
For Austria, you mostly have to choose if you play (false) friend or openly unfriend.
Raise of protestantism will also affect HRE a lot, new friends, new enemies.

You can also declare on someone not in the HRE to have another place to grow.
As Bavaria, will probably be a no CB declaration...who cares, take the stab hit and get some territories outside HRE to expand more freely.

[somnia et musica]

If you don't know HRE's effects, dont play a country like Bavaria... Unless you wanna lose, and even if you do, don't complain on forums, find your way out of the problem.