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討論區規矩與守則
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I find Codemasters do a great job too, the sounds in the new Dirt Rally game are fantastic, though not 100% accurate to every car. Their explanation is that some of these older vehicles are very rare and it's hard to find an owner who will let them use the car, put microphones all over the car and thrash it around a track. With that said, they managed to do just that with the Lancia Stratos and the thing sounds spot on.
Here are just some of the factors involved:
the pitch of an engine changes according to revs and torque load. If you record out an engine at a given torque and RPM you end up with a snapshot of the engine at that moment only - you cannot simply alter the pitch afterwards by processing and expect a realistic result. To fix this you need to capture the sound at varying pitches then blend them together while running the sound through a 'formant' processor that keeps the general EQ of the sound while the pitch changes. That's a serious algorithm needed, the kind you might find in a sophisticated DAW or Autotune.
Secondly, an engine sound is built of separate parts. You get the whine of the turbine as it kicks in, the hiss of hydraulics, the growl of the exhaust, not to mention the rumble of the road and hiss of the air. Tyre squeal, ambient noise, etc. all add to the headache of getting convincing sound. How do you record those parts out seperately? Good mic placement, but for some you just can't - you have to record them in one go and use specialist software to remove the frequencies you want to keep. The best software for this is called CEDAR and costs about six grand for the suite. Careful mic placement will get you somewhere, but at the end of the day to narrow down on the seperate sounds takes a lot of effort and money. An alternative is to cheat and fake it with foley (coke bottles opening for hydraulics sound, for example).
So you've got your engine sample out holding a steady RPM and torque. You now have looping issues. Each engine sound has to loop back on itself, but the problem is that a short loop can be heard repeating. The brain is good at picking up patterns, and the pattern of a one-second loop is easy to determine. Getting an engine loop that doesn't sound like a loop is quite hard - you either need a long loop, or you need a very bland, non-descript loop. Both solutions have their drawbacks.
After looping issues you have pitch issues. If you accelerate, pitch increases (though the formant of the noise stays the same or you'd get the famous Chipmonk effect.) How do you increase pitch while retaining the formant? Not easy - you need a seriously good set of algorithms, the kind used in professional audio DAW software. A decrease in pitch as you decelerate leads to a decrease in sample quality as well. Making many samples gets you some way to solving the problem, but how many is enough bearing in mind each one must be processed separately.
You can see now why in the world of aircraft sims, developers specialise in sound alone. It's tough to get right. Asseto Corsa did a stunning job of retaining the weird square-wave effect of the engine in the clip shown in an earlier post. Project Cars sound very, very generic. With some imagination (a clever use of distortion and phasing) the Project Cars sound could have got nearer to the real thing, but clearly the sound guy either couldn't be bothered, didn't have the skill, or had too much on his plate.
If you expect for a car to sound as what you hear on Youtube then, i believe there's no hope for you.
As a sound engineer in the real world (15 years experience and a degree) I have a great deal of understanding of recording and producing, though I don't work on car recordings at all but music. The video comparison shows a mic (low quality one but a mic all the same) placed in a position inside the P1. I don't know about how Project Cars is done but the AC recording was clearly done in the same way, microphone inside the cockpit.
The result is conclusive, you can't really argue with the results as it does sound fantastic and near identical in accuracy with how they have blended all of the recordings. Your argument is comparable to just sweeping it under the table and fobbing it off.
Don't get me wrong, it's just one example and not all of the cars in AC sound quite so accurate. Just as in the same way many of the sounds in PC vary in quality and accuracy. I've experienced some very bad sound quality issues on some cars in PC, namely the RUF RGT-8, with glitchy noises between gear changes and a very un-natural and unconnected sounding rev limiter... It feels rough.. The consistency is clearly not the same across the board.
I'm well aware this guy has worked on pretty much everything out there, but the proof is in the pudding whether it is good or bad.
For me, I don't mind that the tonality of the audio is 'different'.
You've just captured some of the audio qualities that others people/microphones have missed.
Anyone who understands anything about how microphone placement changes the tonality of sounds should understand this.
What is inexcusable, however, is the childish post-recording squashing of the dynamics; which has essentially turned one of the most powerful assists/immersion factors -- audio -- into a completely useless 'thing' that's just happening in the background.
If I can replicate ProjectCARS' audio in Assetto Corsa (also using F-Mod) by overwinding the audio levels in an .ini, then there's no reason you guys can't wind-back the levels at your end - as you've not provided the files for us to do it ourselves.
All the issue is, is the signal (of at least the engines, but probably everything) being forced through F-Mod's limitting system waaay too hot.
Turn everything down 20% and it'll improve dramatically.
I agree, almost inaccurate. Take a listen to the posted P1 real, P1 Pcars and P1 Assetto Corsa and honestly which one sounds like the P1 in real life?
Yup, I think it is very obvious from these examples which sound is the most accurate and which sound is the most `generic` for those `with ears`.
This is essentially correct. Pcars post-processing is overdone, too compressed and has a much smaller dynamic range compared to AC. It's like modern pop-music in that respect with it being far too compressed and lacking in dynamic range so much that it just sounds `loud`. Also Pcars audio sound so overworked it almost sounds `bit-crushed`.
I disagree to some extent. Listen to the recording again of the car in the Youtube clip - its incredibly distinctive. Simply adjusting mic positions would not account for the weird, almost Star Wars-like sound of the engine. It has a definite square-wave sound to it, and that took some time to create. Its not created by accidental mic phasing issues - that's deliberate.
I saw a documentary on McLaren, and they hire a guy whose sole purpose is to make the sound of their cars sound better. He tunes the EQ using the baffles in the silencer. Apparently, Brits like their cars to sound growly, Italians like their cars to sound high-pitched and whiny, and so he develops cars engine-sounds to meet a particular taste in the market. To say that all cars engines sound the same and that mic placement makes the engine sound distinctive is to misunderstand the effort that goes in to creating that sound at the design stage. You're just plain wrong on that.
You're probably right about the dynamic processing. I've never bought in to the loudness war on records, and I don't think the guy reproducing the sound needs to mess with the dynamics unless they were poorly recorded in the first place (in which case he should record them again.)
It's not that Project Cars has bad sound, I would say that the Assetto Corsa sound in the Youtube video uses original recordings of the car and not a generic mash-up. When the people at Project Cars paid their soundman they were short-changed - they should have gone to the Assetta Corsa people (at least for the car in the video and possibly for the rest if they are of the same quality.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTwnTqI3pPA
I have also noticed that PCars don't have echo sounds from external. Also tire sounds are terrible, best tyre sounds are in Forza 5. I wish pCars let us use custom sound mods or re-do their sound engine, this is the biggest draw back for me for this game. Otherwise pCars is the real-life like feeling when comes to driving the car.
Agree
In general not thrilled with the sound in pcars
Pioneer elite sc-27
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