They simplified Wakfu and it's... better? How are y'all feeling about the game?

[QQuixotic]

I was a huge Wakfu fan and really enjoyed the 'chuff' that came with original Wakfu - the big honkin' Xelor clock and weird mechanics, the entire Ecaflip, the entire osamodas kit, etc. They smoothed off the edges in Wakfu and I really hated it.

So when I saw this game smoothed off the edges more - each battle being it's own thing, all arenas being the same, no return of the Xelor clock, I braced for the worst but was pleasantly surprised. There certainly feels like there's 'enough' here to justify it. The battles being their own thing means no resource or time wasted between battles, and since they're all pre-configured and not random monsters in the wild, they can be highly tailored matches and objectives (like the boneship or blibli protection missions). Different ring and bracer abilities allow for great customization of characters right out the gate, too.

How are y'all feeling about the game?

[Trichouette]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από kmau:

3. The biggest flaw for me: Lack of strategic gameplay. There is no line of sight, everyone has access to long-range spells, no interesting combat maps. There's just no strategy required at all. Just build your deck and brute-force it against the opposition.

About that, you are MOSTLY correct, except the strongest spells have conditions. Like traps have range or certain spells require enemies to have an elemental state. Charges have range & line of sight requirement.

The strongest spells I have on one of my characters currently is one that sacrifices my little soul (iop) to deal a HUGE damage, and one that requires positioning to cast.

It is meant to be more casual, but to reward combo & synergies.

[justdrop]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Trichouette:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από kmau:

3. The biggest flaw for me: Lack of strategic gameplay. There is no line of sight, everyone has access to long-range spells, no interesting combat maps. There's just no strategy required at all. Just build your deck and brute-force it against the opposition.

About that, you are MOSTLY correct, except the strongest spells have conditions. Like traps have range or certain spells require enemies to have an elemental state. Charges have range & line of sight requirement.

The strongest spells I have on one of my characters currently is one that sacrifices my little soul (iop) to deal a HUGE damage, and one that requires positioning to cast.

It is meant to be more casual, but to reward combo & synergies.

Agreed. If it's not tactical enough, roll a sram and learn how to chain traps, then manipulate enemies into triggering rows of them for 100+ damage at a time. It's there if you look for it.

[Trichouette]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από justdrop:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Trichouette:

About that, you are MOSTLY correct, except the strongest spells have conditions. Like traps have range or certain spells require enemies to have an elemental state. Charges have range & line of sight requirement.

The strongest spells I have on one of my characters currently is one that sacrifices my little soul (iop) to deal a HUGE damage, and one that requires positioning to cast.

It is meant to be more casual, but to reward combo & synergies.

Agreed. If it's not tactical enough, roll a sram and learn how to chain traps, then manipulate enemies into triggering rows of them for 100+ damage at a time. It's there if you look for it.

Sadly builds that require combo & strategy aren't as strong as brain dead builds.
I hope they change that at some point.
Not by nerfing brain dead builds but by buffing builds that require combo & strategy.
Srams' traps are so incredibly weak.

[Zessen]

some of the builds are crazy strong in pve. my friend played a tele xelor that pushed out a ♥♥♥♥ ton of dmg first turn on pigs, with the help of spring boards. Somewhere between 500-2k i think at lvl 40. Scalpel eni was also strong with right plays. Together with him we beat lvl100 pigs both at lvl 40 with him being tele xelor and me playing phase eni. I did ok dmg but was mainly a distraction with self healing of around 100-200+ as he blew things up. the game might not be crazy thinking but theres some thought process in some builds and doing skill orders. im looking forward to cracking out in the game after putting 80 hrs in last week. At first I was sorta annoyed at elites having a turn before each person but I think it's a decent job of balance for party instead of just making every mob a damage sponge or something.

[Zenidar]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Zessen:

some of the builds are crazy strong in pve. my friend played a tele xelor that pushed out a ♥♥♥♥ ton of dmg first turn on pigs, with the help of spring boards. Somewhere between 500-2k i think at lvl 40. Scalpel eni was also strong with right plays. Together with him we beat lvl100 pigs both at lvl 40 with him being tele xelor and me playing phase eni. I did ok dmg but was mainly a distraction with self healing of around 100-200+ as he blew things up. the game might not be crazy thinking but theres some thought process in some builds and doing skill orders. im looking forward to cracking out in the game after putting 80 hrs in last week. At first I was sorta annoyed at elites having a turn before each person but I think it's a decent job of balance for party instead of just making every mob a damage sponge or something.

I play Scalpel Eni and he does really well with the right build allowing him to activate ~7*2 (100% attack) passive every turn. And for such a gameplay, you don’t need to say that you need a brain, you just want to take damage and at the same time never remain at full health.
However, there are also disadvantages, such gameplay is difficult to control and fulfill the conditions, focus on especially dangerous enemies (Arrow skeletons that receive a bonus damage for the death of allies are very problematic) and such tactics force you to heal yourself and not allies, although this could be fixed by finalizing the conditions for passive targets (Heal yourself for high health damage / Heal an ally for low health damage)

[wookieiceman]

Im loving it so far they add my panda boi back and im in.

[Boss Tripp]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από QQuixotic:

I was a huge Wakfu fan and really enjoyed the 'chuff' that came with original Wakfu - the big honkin' Xelor clock and weird mechanics, the entire Ecaflip, the entire osamodas kit, etc. They smoothed off the edges in Wakfu and I really hated it.

So when I saw this game smoothed off the edges more - each battle being it's own thing, all arenas being the same, no return of the Xelor clock, I braced for the worst but was pleasantly surprised. There certainly feels like there's 'enough' here to justify it. The battles being their own thing means no resource or time wasted between battles, and since they're all pre-configured and not random monsters in the wild, they can be highly tailored matches and objectives (like the boneship or blibli protection missions). Different ring and bracer abilities allow for great customization of characters right out the gate, too.

How are y'all feeling about the game?

I'm actually not digging it. I like the updated graphics and stuff, but everyone basically being melee is bad to me. I didn't play Wakfu until I played this game, because it was so fun, but after going back and playing wakfu; I feel this game is a step forward in some areas, but a step back in others. Like, why does my archer arrows not come from me and why is it more efficient for me to punch someone? If they gave the melee attack a cost like the other powers then that I believe would balance things out a bit.

[kmau]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από justdrop:

Agreed. If it's not tactical enough, roll a sram and learn how to chain traps, then manipulate enemies into triggering rows of them for 100+ damage at a time. It's there if you look for it.

I actually just tested Sram and Xelor yesterday, placeable elements like traps definitely feel more big-brainy, if underpowered. I assume once you get more push and pull spells this may change.

[Trichouette]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από kmau:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από justdrop:

Agreed. If it's not tactical enough, roll a sram and learn how to chain traps, then manipulate enemies into triggering rows of them for 100+ damage at a time. It's there if you look for it.

I actually just tested Sram and Xelor yesterday, placeable elements like traps definitely feel more big-brainy, if underpowered. I assume once you get more push and pull spells this may change.

In my experience, the issue isn't with placing enemies in traps, but rather how low their damage is.
There's a brasser that grants a free push spell on attack, so it's pretty easy to push enemies into your traps.
But even after setting 4 traps the damage output is meh...

Sram really feels like too much work for a not so good outcome to me.

[Zenidar]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Trichouette:

In my experience, the issue isn't with placing enemies in traps, but rather how low their damage is.
There's a brasser that grants a free push spell on attack, so it's pretty easy to push enemies into your traps.
But even after setting 4 traps the damage output is meh...

Sram really feels like too much work for a not so good outcome to me.

Not only with the damage of the problem, but also with the tactical part. In Wakfu you have a bigger map and enemies move cell by cell + there is stealth which allows you to move a lot and manipulate enemies. In Waven, enemies literally teleport, ignoring all the cells in between, small maps and the limited range of traps, and due to the fact that enemies teleport sometimes you have to guess where exactly (there are enemies that cannot attack at all if they don’t make a move and just stand around your character) . In my opinion, the trap mechanic is not suitable for Waven as a main source of damage, a standard assassin with trap tools would be more practical and easier to learn with such a simple and straightforward mechanics and tactics that are present in the game.

[Trichouette]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Zenidar:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Trichouette:

In my experience, the issue isn't with placing enemies in traps, but rather how low their damage is.
There's a brasser that grants a free push spell on attack, so it's pretty easy to push enemies into your traps.
But even after setting 4 traps the damage output is meh...

Sram really feels like too much work for a not so good outcome to me.

Not only with the damage of the problem, but also with the tactical part. In Wakfu you have a bigger map and enemies move cell by cell + there is stealth which allows you to move a lot and manipulate enemies. In Waven, enemies literally teleport, ignoring all the cells in between, small maps and the limited range of traps, and due to the fact that enemies teleport sometimes you have to guess where exactly (there are enemies that cannot attack at all if they don’t make a move and just stand around your character) . In my opinion, the trap mechanic is not suitable for Waven as a main source of damage, a standard assassin with trap tools would be more practical and easier to learn with such a simple and straightforward mechanics and tactics that are present in the game.

It doesn't really matter if enemies teleport or not, considering you have to land on the trap for it to work (and not just walk on it). Which by the way is a huge pain to your teammates if an enemy is surrounded by traps.

With a small map and traps that can be seen (I believe the enemy team can see them) I think you have a good way to make traps work, especially since most enemies have to come in melee range to hit you.

I especially like the "assembly" mechanic (no idea what it's called in english, when you place traps next to each other and they trigger together).
But I think it would work a lot better if traps did bigger damage.

It's true placing them isn't very expensive, most traps cost 2 or even 0, but spending turns making big traps and they won't even one-shot a single enemy is a bit disappointing.

Right now the only efficient way to make good use of them is to manage to trigger them on more than one enemy at once. Sadly there aren't many spells that can allow you to do that.

Maybe I have it all wrong, I'm focusing too much on traps and they're not supposed to be the main source of damage.

[Zenidar]

I also found that enemies see traps and don't step on them, you can surround yourself with traps and just hit one enemy while others stand and watch skipping their moves

[Trichouette]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Zenidar:

I also found that enemies see traps and don't step on them, you can surround yourself with traps and just hit one enemy while others stand and watch skipping their moves

I think they'll still trigger them if they have no choice won't they ?
And anyway, a lot of enemies have spells that move players.
The AI is quite clever and will push you on your own traps to disarm them.

[Zenidar]

Unfortunately, ALL Sram mechanics are based on traps, even the Conspiracy mechanic requires 2 traps set to activate.
I just checked, squeezing myself in a corner, screwing up traps, I was attacked only by spells and an archer, and my neighbors stood motionless until their death, they attacked and stepped on the trap only when it became possible to inflict mortal damage on me and kill me
Although not all enemies stand as idols, some enemies attack and step on traps, but I don’t understand what it depends on

PS: J'utilise moi-même un traducteur pour parler anglais

[Trichouette]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Danil:

I was enjoying it alot in previous alphas, this demo does not save progress and not much different to previous alpha, so I dont play it.
Waven is a very good game, hope to see release.

yes this demo is basically the last alpha but with the new skill tree and with a lot of locked content.
We'll soon get the open beta.