Kung Fu, or Weapons for you?

[Cajun Rabbit]

Simple question with not so simple answers.


What do you prefer for your "Main squad" (the people to run ruins and such with)



I loved the katana at first, but now... im falling in love with Kung Fu... at high levels you dodge most attacks and deliver pretty devestating hits.

Im curious as to what other people use.




I primarily use Topper class katana weapons in almost all situations.

[Erei]

I have a variety of weapon. As for min-maxxing, early on I think katanas are the best. Even wakizashi (stun lock on weak opponent). Later on, heavy weapons and planks. MA can be strong later on to. I feel the MA dodge animation is way too long though, and you spend most of your time in dodging animation, delivering little damage in between. Also, no AoE.

Polearm are extremely situational or downright useless. Blunt weapons, I feel they are weak all around. And sabers are poor to.

[Red Bat]

Eventually martial arts beats weapons other than Heavy Weapons but it takes a long time. Heavy Weapons eventually just completely outperforms everything though.

[THANKS OBAMA]

Originally posted by Pidgeotto:

Eventually martial arts beats weapons other than Heavy Weapons but it takes a long time. Heavy Weapons eventually just completely outperforms everything though.

The difference is rather insane. I got Dimak from the black dragon ninja's stuffed into one of my holding cells along with a broken skeleton.

Both have similar stats, riding above 50 for the most part, with Dimak even hitting above 60 Melee attack when I gave her a no guard Katana. With both of them wielding Mark 3 hand crafted weapons of the type they favor and wearing masterwork medium armor on dimak, heavy on the skeleton you can see the huuuuuge difference.

Dimak just pokes everything for about 8-25 damage at most, and while she blocks constantly and keeps the fight going on pretty long the skeleton can someyimes just straight up one shot some of my squad, it's even two shot killed [as in straight up killed it] one of the lighter armor wearing assassin crew I got that focuses pretty highly on slashing as fast as they can. That beast hits for between 30 if it clips a well armored body part, all the way up to 104.

[Erei]

Originally posted by Pidgeotto:

Eventually martial arts beats weapons other than Heavy Weapons but it takes a long time. Heavy Weapons eventually just completely outperforms everything though.

MA have 2 big issues that make the heavy be usually the "best". First, the lack of AoE. Second, they have a hefty damage penalty against machine (25 or 50% not sure).
Also they take an armor slot for the bindings. It take a lot of stats to be able to get rid of them.

[THANKS OBAMA]

Why would you waste a slot for the bindings? Why use any of the karate uniform stuff at all?

I mean, I guess if you wanna role play or something, but in general the payoff isn't worth the cost. I got only one character as a martial artist for the novelty of it, it's still fun to have a bit of a difference between your squad members. If you mean they need the bindings to help with recoil, the recoil is piddly. Like 1 damage every couple of swings.

[balalaika86]

Originally posted by Erei:

Originally posted by Pidgeotto:

Eventually martial arts beats weapons other than Heavy Weapons but it takes a long time. Heavy Weapons eventually just completely outperforms everything though.

MA have 2 big issues that make the heavy be usually the "best". First, the lack of AoE. Second, they have a hefty damage penalty against machine (25 or 50% not sure).
Also they take an armor slot for the bindings. It take a lot of stats to be able to get rid of them.

Bear in mind though that the damage penalty against machines "only" applies for Humans, Shek and Hivers. Skeleton martial artists uses a different MA "weapon" with no damage penalty against machines, making them the strongest martial artists in the game.

Tinfist will probably be a real beast to fight.

[Grimmrog_SIG]

Originally posted by loubre:

Why would you waste a slot for the bindings? Why use any of the karate uniform stuff at all?

I mean, I guess if you wanna role play or something, but in general the payoff isn't worth the cost. I got only one character as a martial artist for the novelty of it, it's still fun to have a bit of a difference between your squad members. If you mean they need the bindings to help with recoil, the recoil is piddly. Like 1 damage every couple of swings.

without the bindings iirc you will take damage, thats why you use them.

[Zombiedragon201]

Didnt know about the MA effects with skeletons. I'm gonna have to make burn a martial artist.

[balalaika86]

Originally posted by Grimmrog_SIG:

without the bindings iirc you will take damage, thats why you use them.

That's only at low skill. The higher the skill level, the lesser the damage to your own fists.

And Skeleton MA's take no limb damage at all, btw. ;)

[Erei]

Originally posted by balalaika86:

Originally posted by Grimmrog_SIG:

without the bindings iirc you will take damage, thats why you use them.

That's only at low skill. The higher the skill level, the lesser the damage to your own fists.

And Skeleton MA's take no limb damage at all, btw. ;)

Even at 40ish, you still take damage. Decreasing your damage further.

Originally posted by balalaika86:

Bear in mind though that the damage penalty against machines "only" applies for Humans, Shek and Hivers. Skeleton martial artists uses a different MA "weapon" with no damage penalty against machines, making them the strongest martial artists in the game.

Tinfist will probably be a real beast to fight.

It's rather situational, this topic is more general. Also, I'm not sure if it's fully intended.
MA still have a lack of AoE that is an issue compared to heavy weapons and plank. Also, as I mentioned earlier, I feel like the dodge animation is way longer than the block one. Meaning less DPS overall.

[oi__io]

Originally posted by Erei:

First, the lack of AoE.

Is that true that MA doesn't have AOE? I haven't been using high level MA character for a while but back then I think I've managed to KO multiple enemies in single blow. My character's MA was at 80 something. Was that a fluke? Or was it a combination of other factors that I didn't observed (such as blood loss, limb status etc).

[THANKS OBAMA]

They can smack multiple enemies at once but we're talking when you're getting mosh pitted and you could probably slash multiple folk with a frigging wakizashi. It's not that uncommon, but the reach is probably the lowest barring the forward jump kick, which will pop a few dudes.

[Sievers]

i have a character with 100 at all stats ( yes moded , and i have fight a lot with all weapons ( best quality - yes cheated ) and what i found is, MA is 1 shot kill almoust all hits, but dodge will get you killed if you got swarmed. Katanna and Sabres can block alot better and can take on a larger group of enemies.

Well, that was my conclusion after a while fighting with my all lvl 100 character, and crossbows will come one day, and a katana or a sabre (sword) is way too cool at the back slot too xD

[Aereto]

Originally posted by oi__io:

Originally posted by Erei:

First, the lack of AoE.

Is that true that MA doesn't have AOE? I haven't been using high level MA character for a while but back then I think I've managed to KO multiple enemies in single blow. My character's MA was at 80 something. Was that a fluke? Or was it a combination of other factors that I didn't observed (such as blood loss, limb status etc).

All weapons incur AOE, but their ranges vary on the weapon type and attack animation. The "Baseball Swing" attack has the most AOE range, found in sabres, hackers, blunt, and heavy weapons. You can cut down a squad if they cannot block correctly.

Martial Arts and certain weapons have more attacks with low AOE that requires enemies to be very close together to get multi hits.

[Red Bat]

Originally posted by GG.:

i have a character with 100 at all stats ( yes moded , and i have fight a lot with all weapons ( best quality - yes cheated ) and what i found is, MA is 1 shot kill almoust all hits, but dodge will get you killed if you got swarmed. Katanna and Sabres can block alot better and can take on a larger group of enemies.

Well, that was my conclusion after a while fighting with my all lvl 100 character, and crossbows will come one day, and a katana or a sabre (sword) is way too cool at the back slot too xD

Give that character a Rusted Junk plank, no armor, and watch what it takes to kill them. It's ridiculous how powerful Heavy Weapons get when your strength stat is above 60.