La-Mulana

La-Mulana

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Pink Jan 9, 2014 @ 5:51pm
Jump mechanics put me off
Am I the only one who got put off by the jump mechanics?
I'll complete this game one day, just not anytime soon, I didn't realize it wasn't as fluid as I expected it to be :(

Ok just here to rant, but feel free to post comments.
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Showing 1-15 of 35 comments
Sicris Jan 9, 2014 @ 5:58pm 
I find the jump mechanics to be fine. In fact I can't imagine the game to play all that well without it. It's one of the few platformers I play that I can pull off advanced moves with relative ease.

Jump mechanics in the original La-Mulana took me a few hours to get used to though; had to press up on the D-pad to jump. Then I realized much later I could configure it to a button instead which made my life a lot easier.
Last edited by Sicris; Jan 9, 2014 @ 6:04pm
Yeah, I'm used to separate-button jumping so the original La-Mulana's controls threw me off. Yeah, I could change the jump button but it doubled as the climb ladder button, so I kept it as up.

New La-Mulana has separate climb-up and jump buttons so that's nice.

The relatively stiff jump mechanics (of La-Mulana original and remake, both) are like the jump mechanics of the old Castlevania games (the "classicvanias"). Once you commit to a jump, you can't reverse direction. LM is a little nicer, though: If you just jump straight up, you have regular movement flexibility for your jump. Use this to jump off a ledge and go into a ledge directly under it, from the side.
Last edited by Quint the Alligator Snapper; Jan 9, 2014 @ 6:06pm
Sicris Jan 9, 2014 @ 6:09pm 
La-Mulana is a strange case though with it's controls and pulling off advanced moves.

The controls for games like mario, megaman, metroid, etc I would say are easy to learn, hard to master.

La-Mulana is one of the few games where I feel it's the exact opposite with it's controls; hard to learn, easy to master. Mostly cuz you have no choice in the matter, you either master them fast or you get no where fast, this is especially true for hell temple and hard mode. Besides, the advanced stuff is really not at all difficult once you get the basics out of the way.
Last edited by Sicris; Jan 9, 2014 @ 9:32pm
Dentorhedge Jan 9, 2014 @ 6:11pm 
I recently learned that Ghouls and Ghosts. part of the Ghosts and Goblins series, also has similar mechanics.
Sicris Jan 9, 2014 @ 6:15pm 
Originally posted by Dentorhedge_of_the_Victorious_Mu:
I recently learned that Ghouls and Ghosts. part of the Ghosts and Goblins series, also has similar mechanics.

I love ghosts and goblins, played the series all the time. Now that you mention it, it's almost the same jumping scheme as super ghouls and ghosts but there are a few differences. In super ghouls and ghosts you're not "fully" commited to a trajectory as you are in La-Mulana. When you double jump you are able to jump foward on the first jump and then jump only vertically on the second jump, can't do that in la-mulana. The second thing is that in super ghouls and ghosts you have zero control of how high you jump and you can't control your trajectory after a vertical jump, La-Mulana controls more similar to megaman in that aspect of the jumping.

That aside, it's practically the same as super ghouls and ghosts.
Last edited by Sicris; Jan 9, 2014 @ 6:48pm
Pink Jan 9, 2014 @ 6:43pm 
I finished G&G long ago, how should I put it....
The jump in La-mulana feels more "sluggish", again, it's not a deal breaker to me, and I even managed to advance in the game with ease when I first played it.
I just like to make quick decisions in games, at least jumping was faster in G&G, or at least felt that way.

Also, not being able to jump into a ladders or releasing them :tbpsleep:
Sicris Jan 9, 2014 @ 6:50pm 
Originally posted by horheristo:
I finished G&G long ago, how should I put it....
The jump in La-mulana feels more "sluggish", again, it's not a deal breaker to me, and I even managed to advance in the game with ease when I first played it.
I just like to make quick decisions in games, at least jumping was faster in G&G, or at least felt that way.

Also, not being able to jump into a ladders or releasing them :tbpsleep:

It only feels sluggish because you may not have gotten the hermies boots yet which increases movement speed. It's accessable very early in the game. Once you get the hermes boots, the jumping should feel a lot less sluggish and you will be able to jump slightly further as well.

Also in all fairness I can't really think of that many games from that era which you were able to do that. Castlevania had that problem with stairs, Donkey Kong had that problem with ladders.

Megaman is the only game which I can think of that you can fall off ladders.

I noticed by your achivements you activated hard mode as well. If you turned on hard mode and saved the game you may want to restart the game from scratch (it can't be reset after you saved). Hard mode is NOT for the first playthough at all. It's meant for players that mastered the controls already and it's a very unforgiving brutal difficulty for this version of the game to beat legit without cheating by using pistols or software weapon combos. Think Ys: Oath in Felghana in Nightmare or Inferno mode and that's basically hard mode La-Mulana. Little to no room for error on anything.
Last edited by Sicris; Jan 9, 2014 @ 7:17pm
Pink Jan 9, 2014 @ 7:20pm 
Eh, I always start games on highest difficulty, I have a principle in gaming that games should be played in their "true" nature. I don't like hand holding, and am a big sucker for punishment.

I'll be honest, I haven't played the old school castlevania, I was more of a mario, kirby and Island kind of kid. Which is probably why I need to get used to the mechanics.

If one thing is for certain however, your last comment about hard mode definitely made me want to complete it ONLY that way, and not sure what you meant by cheating, but I'll figure my own way of beating it.
Sicris Jan 9, 2014 @ 7:26pm 
Originally posted by horheristo:
Eh, I always start games on highest difficulty, I have a principle in gaming that games should be played in their "true" nature. I don't like hand holding, and am a big sucker for punishment.

I'll be honest, I haven't played the old school castlevania, I was more of a mario, kirby and Island kind of kid. Which is probably why I need to get used to the mechanics.

If one thing is for certain however, your last comment about hard mode definitely made me want to complete it ONLY that way, and not sure what you meant by cheating, but I'll figure my own way of beating it.

By cheating I mean that some people tend to either use pistols on bosses which kill them in about 5-6 hits (sometimes less depending on the boss) or by using software combos that make weapons do 2 times the damage they normally do.
Last edited by Sicris; Jan 9, 2014 @ 7:27pm
Pink Jan 9, 2014 @ 7:27pm 
Well it IS part of the game's mechanics, unless you're trying to show off, or there's an achievement involved, I don't see how's that cheating.
Sicris Jan 9, 2014 @ 7:58pm 
Originally posted by horheristo:
Well it IS part of the game's mechanics, unless you're trying to show off, or there's an achievement involved, I don't see how's that cheating.

No idea what achivements have to do with anything and I don't know how how that is showing off. I've always considered it cheating, ever since the original verision. Before achivements, before the remake, before I've ever beat the game, before anything really, I've never considered the software / ROM combos that boost weapons to be legit just because of how unbalenced in power they are.

If you want to consider them game part of the game mechanic go ahead, technically you're right they are part of the game mechanic. It's not like I claimed never used them before. I used it to get the "All I need is one finger" achivement a few months ago. But no one is going to make the claim that they are not overpowered (and they have to be, because no one is getting though Mushussu's room in Hard mode Hell temple if they weren't).

Don't make the assumption that I've only played the game once in a certain way and am just making random claims. I've played the game many times, in many ways. Both with and without software combos; with sub weapons without subweapons on bosses. Sequence breaking and not sequence breaking; Normal mode and Hard mode; Original version and remake version, etc etc. When I say it feels like a cheat to me, I genuinely mean it. You can make your own assuptions when you play, maybe you'll agree, maybe you won't.
Last edited by Sicris; Jan 9, 2014 @ 8:03pm
Pink Jan 9, 2014 @ 8:05pm 
Didn't make any assumptions really, showing off meant for youtube, and achievements wise I meant that it allowed to cheese them out. (which is fine anyway)
Clearly you take great pride in your experience with this game, which I won't try to take from you.

Just saying that if the game allows you to become OP, then not taking advantage of it is simply being ignorant / your own sense of pleasure / bragging rights.
Last edited by Pink; Jan 9, 2014 @ 8:06pm
Sicris Jan 9, 2014 @ 8:38pm 
Originally posted by horheristo:
Didn't make any assumptions really, showing off meant for youtube, and achievement wise I meant that it allowed to cheese them out. (which is fine anyway)
Clearly you take great pride in your experience with this game, which I won't try to take from you.

Just saying that if the game allows you to become OP, then not taking advantage of it is simply being ignorant / your own sense of pleasure / bragging rights.

Yea but this almost feels too overpowered, know what I mean. Pistol for example can kill most bosses in 4-6 seconds flat. Not even exaggerating that.:closetgamer:

Software combo is a bit more difficult to explain why I feel is a bit too overpowered. When you play the game, it pretty much gives you weapon and health upgrades the further in the game you go. And all the bosses feel like they are attuned to have just enough hitpoints and deal just enough damage for the upgrades you are carrying at that moment, no more no less. The way that the software combos feel is like it was put in there as an after-thought really. Like a way to get yourself "unstuck" if you can't progress more in the game. It's a lot more obvious in normal mode than hard mode though. It's difficult to describe, but I'm sure you'll see what I mean after a few playthoughs. It won't feel that way the first playthough, especially since you are taking on hard mode first which will initially feel unfair and perhaps impossible at times. But after playing the game a few times and getting used to how the fights work, learning how to exploit the bosses as easily as they exploit you, knowing what items you need before taking on that boss, etc. The software combos will slowly but surely start to feel excessive. You'll notice the bosses are going through their multiple phases more quickly than you are losing health. For lack of a better example, it'll feel like your a level 50 character in an RPG taking on a level 20 boss.:catnap:

Pretty much it becomes less about being "overpowered" and more about "the bosses are dying WAY to fast for me to enjoy this fight" type of thing.:luvgaze:
Last edited by Sicris; Jan 9, 2014 @ 9:20pm
Vil Jan 9, 2014 @ 10:49pm 
I'd qualify that a lot more heavily as "personal taste" than I would as "cheating".

Pistol is absolutely overpowered, I'll grant, though for a less experienced player who doesn't know about good renewable coin sources or even too many good non-renewable coin sources, it's reasonably well balanced when considering the enormous cost of ammo. Think of how often you'd be inclined to use it if you expected you'd be funding it from occasional enemy drops of 2 coins at a time. If you were really that desperate, you've earned its damage output through dedication.

And I'm not terribly concerned about balance for a more experienced player who knows where everything is. Of *course* they can dart around snagging advantages for themselves if they see fit. That's a major point of replay value, for some players, in an open-exploration metroidvania like this. They can also opt not to do that if they prefer, and stick with what they consider to be "appropriate" levels of upgrades.

Some people like to work with a limited toolset to maintain challenge, even though they are absolutely able to go get more stuff if they feel like it. Other people like to really beef themselves up to unnecessary degrees and curbstomp the opposition. Neither of these is wrong or "cheating" since it's completely arbitrary and entirely up to the individual, how much they want to prepare and what their motivations are. Just different tastes.
Pink Jan 10, 2014 @ 3:40am 
I'd probably won't even use pistols vs bosses anyway.
"I only need one finger!" achievement is something I'd like to get on my first playthrough.

My plan is to get all the Hard mode achievements out of the way first, and then restart in normal mode and finish the rest.
After I beat the game on hardest difficulty, it's pretty much done for me, unless it unlocks a bigger challange.

I don't like to spend more time than I should on a game, crippling myself for no reason, while there's so many other good games out there to play as well :)
And I'm the loyal type, only one game at a time, maybe 2 tops, if the challenge I'm aiming for requires too much practice or too tedious.
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Date Posted: Jan 9, 2014 @ 5:51pm
Posts: 35