How to make people care about Solar Rails

[Kramit The Frog]

So this is an opinion piece, nothing more, open discussion is encouraged. My intent is a constructive look at the faults of current solar rail system. Not a flat bash fest, because I like the idea overall, just not how it's currently implemented. And because most of these discussions turn into credibility disputes, yes, I've been around the block a few times, I'm mastery 15, I own virtually everything in the game, and have been playing since Warframe opend the beta. Don't care about my qualifications? Good, neither do I, a new players opinion is as valid as anyone elses. But for those that will ask, there they are.

This new system of solar rails and pseudo PvP (er... CvC, CvA, and AvA) is, to put it bluntly, a total flop on a very interesting idea with a lot of potential. To be clear, this is about the rail conflicts, not the dark sectors themselves.

Here's my take on the pros an cons of the current system, I will address them in a little more detail later on and provide what I believe is a much better system. Yes DE doesn't really care about these forums etc... but we are the players, and we have voices, whether or not they are heard.

Pros:
-More generated interest in clans and the new alliance system
-More co-operation between players, a tighter community
-Income for the clan/alliance owning the sector, plus some prestige for being on the map
-Provides access for other players to the dark sectors (with or without charge)
-More end game goals and content for those of us at end game

Cons:
-Negligible Battle pay, or complete lack thereof
-Taxes, or lack thereof, depending if you own the rail or not
-Monopoly of larger/established clans/alliances
-Forced exclusion or subordination of newer/smaller clans to use this system due to the above mentionned monopoly.
-Complete apathy for rail conflicts + Dark sector access downtime (main point)


Ok so overall i feel that the pros are outweighed by the cons. Warframe, while capable of complete isolation and solo play, is intended as a primarily co-operative experience. Thus, the addition of anything that complements the clan system is going to make the game better. The community of any game can make or break it, and I like to think that DE has garnered the interest and support of a pretty fantastic community of individuals. All that being said, I feel the system failed to take off and garner the interest it deserves. Here is my idea for a solution. By all means, help me explore this idea in a pro vs con manner as I have done. I like this idea but having concieved it, I am ill positioned to critique it.

New idea for the whole solar rail system

-The solar map should keep it's new Dark sector nodes as they are, no problems there.

-Solar rails should be unique to, and only usable by the clan/alliance they belong to, they should not interact with other clan/alliances rails at all, and not prevent other clans/alliances from occupying the same node. In short, if you're not in a clan you can't see rails or use the sectors, if you're in a clan the only rails you should see are your clans/alliances. This worked happily with the Dojo lab research system and I think it fits perfectly there. Recruiting clans advertise based on the completion level of their research, why not on the number of rails they have deployed and maintain?

-Rails and extractors should work basically the same way. Once a clan/alliance deploys a rail the rail would decay and take damage as the extractors do, they could be retrieved and should cost time and resources to repair, closing the node they occupied temporarily. These resources could come from the taxes set for the use of the rail, that way the ones using the rail and belonging to the clan can contribute to the mammoth costs of these titans. One lab per active rail? Sure, thats fine, or maybe let us stockpile rails but need another dojo room/lab to make repairs to them.

-NO MORE FORCED DARK SECTOR DOWN TIME. This is the big one, with the current system, the dark sectors are only available to play about 1 day of 2 or 3, depending on the level of interest in the rail sabotage misisons. And that is the lynchpin problem with the system. There is almost complete apathy for the conflicts themselves, there are conflicts that almost time out while they are both at 100%.

http://steamcommunity.com/id/marcgravel/screenshot/598160297170316980

Not to mention that when a conflict becomes 98% vs 94% the losing side pulls all it's battle pay and vocally "surrenders". This leaves the rest of the server to wait out the remainder of the 48 hours to get back to the levels they actually wanted to play in the first place, the Dark Sectors. With only your own clan's rails to worry about, Dark Sector down time is self imposed and dependant on the players willingness to contribute. You'd have no one to blame but yourself, or if you're in a lazy clan, you'll need to find a better one or recruit more active members. Either way, players maintain an active avenue of access to the dark sectors rather than simply wait it out. Those of us building solar rails have some level of investment into this game, we're already waiting for our new frames and weapons to build, don't lock out the only end game areas where we can kill time while already waiting.

-As for those that are interested in the rail conflicts, thats great! I wish they did work as planned and that the current system was viable. I have no wish for it to fizzle out like it did, but it did. I have thought about ways to revive it but I don't see one. If the system can be made viable then please make it so! I have nothing against it, I have something against it's current limitations due to non-participance.

That's basically it. What you end up with is a much less adversarial system that promotes the clan system through necesity of cooperation towards a mutually beneficial goal, to no one's detriment. Not a mindless competition between giants and the guy who clicked "deploy rail" faster than you did.

[xerxeso1]

Great ideas Kramit the Frog....Rail conflicts= PVP (don't like much and that's why a lot of Folks don't play PVP games)....Tennos don't have enough darn Aliens to worry about????

[Kramit The Frog]

Yeah, case and point, an Eris conflict ended by timing out with opponents at 100% and 93%... If I remember correctly they recently chopped Solar Rail health in half no? That's depressing... seriously with this much non-participance how can we even remotely expect this to fix itself?

http://steamcommunity.com/id/marcgravel/screenshot/598160297170316980

[Kramit The Frog]

Bump. Looking for some more input from the community.

[Zachary]

Escrito originalmente por Kramit The Frog:

Escrito originalmente por Javet90:

My issue with solar rails atm...there is no point to them. Everybody gets access to the mission irregardless of who owns the rail, the rail that is in effect is almost always 0% tax so you don't make money from rails, there is no point to specifically owning the rail for a mission since everybody gets the same bonuses and the tax is the only real benefit you get from owning it...but you have to set it at 0% or somebody will take over the rail, and they are almost always contested so there is no point in doing the missions anyway.

Agreed, along with no battle pay for taking a side, there's 0 incentive to participate due to the necessity of 0% taxes

Make it so taxes can't go below 10%.

[Kramit The Frog]

The taxe rate isnt really the problem tho, the fact is that no one cares to support either side almost regarless of pay, which yes taxes could help supply, yes. And even if the battle pay was even remotely significant enough for people to care it still means that only the largest clans/alliances will ever hold a spot due to their endless banks. This forces players to either give up on their own dreams of a solar rails, or it prevents the creation of new clans by new players out of necessity to access this content. It essentially alienates or forces subordination of the smaller clans/newer players.

[Zachary]

Taxes are the long term solution, unless clans can actively pay 10k a mission it isn't worth it at all. Tower keys are much easier to get then they used to be, the whole point of defending them is you're being hired and paid, if it's one of the worst ways to make credits who is going to do it.

It won't be an overnight fix but I think if we stop the "no taxes" garbage that is actually hurting the game then it will benefit all of us. I think we can easily see 30k payout missions in the future if we take out the ability to have no taxes.

[Kramit The Frog]

Thats just the issue though, that 30K doesnt just drop out of thin air, it comes out of the clan treasury. Each and every single battle pay comes from the treasury, unless I misunderstand this point. That means that from a tax perspective, to maintain a self sustaining system, you would need the taxes to match the battle pay to have a self sustaining micro economy. The problem is that no one is going to give up that much of their battle pay and the amount of pay that would be expected of end game type levels would rely entirely on clan members dropping their own cash into the treasury. The owners of the rails have naught but to lose and the players have nothing to gain because the owners dont want to lose. It's an intrinsically non-viable system regardless of if they enforced taxes or not. Battle pay would need to be subsidised and that defeats the purpose of the whole system as well.

[Asynaptic]

Well it has been about a month since the last comment posted here. And even the brief flicker of interest in this topic is sputtering and dying.
I agree that the "solar rails to dark sectors (AKA new content)" was another nice idea abysmally executed.
Regarding the taxes/battle-pay issue and credits - meh - totally irrelevant - credits are credits - can get em anywhere. I don't need credits - I need new and engaging content, imaginative story line, better game mechanics. I need many many things long before I need credits.
As it is dark sectors are merely copy paste levels which serve as a new home for the infested.
Too bad.