New tileset/enemies + Solo Survival = Unfun

[KitKat]

TL;DR in the end!

So here I am, trying to farm the new arch-gun parts, right? They drop from endless nodes - survival, defense and alchemy. I'm doing it solo survival cuz I'm mainly a solo player. And obviously, I'm taking my well tried and tested builds, that can work on Steel Path 30-60min survivals on SP with ease. Or more, if I'm not bored by that time. And... the results are not fun here.

1) Solo Normal = simply not enough enemies for life support upkeep, even with the towers sent to you by the fish to survive past 10 mins. It's already an issue on other, older tiles too, but here it feels even worse. So I feel like when playing solo, I am forced into Steel Path to get the full 4-player amount of enemies to even spawn for that LIfe Support upkeep via dropped life support pickus.

But again... Even on Steel Path the amount of enemies is not enough. Or rather... On SP, there IS enough enemies, BUT... In both normal and SP, enemies - especially the necramechs/necramech dogs - just like to "keep distance and stand there, MENACINGLY". They don't get close to your chosen "arena" from the whole map, they don't attack from range either (yes, they don't shoot stuff at you!!!) - they just stand there in bundles/groups, doing nothing, period. I assume(could be wrong) they are having some pathfinding issues and get possibly stuck on tileset piece edges or something? Some invisible tile-piece edges they can't cross or something?

And sure, you might say - just go to them yourself and kill em. Yes, can do that. But they sometimes get stuck all around the place, including vents and such. And just stand there, braindead, not doing anything. So I just waste more time running around and *looking for the enemies* to kill, rather than actually killing to get those precious life support pickups that are needed, since you can't rely on the default life support towers, as life support will simply run out this way.

In short = enemies get stuck/don't come to you. Which is an issue even for SP amounts. And absolutely kills any runs on solo normal past 5-10mins due to there not being enough spawns in the first place - AND THEN those fewer enemies also get stuck too!

This makes farming Survival the "usual way" - via Khora dome or Zephyr's tornados for example - simply ineffective. Enemies don't come to your dome/tornados at all.

I'd understood if the AI saw the dome/tornados and kept their distance to not get pulled in and attacked you from range - that's logical and makes sense. Clever AI is fun to play against and such, I get it! But NO! They keep distance and JUST STAND THERE, not even attacking from range. Something is legit broken here.

2) Any AOE weapon/warframe is counter-productive. Simply because together with nuking enemies, you will be nuking the whole tileset and making the floor into lava acid. So even if you DON'T die to enemies/acolytes(SP) and feeling absolutely comfortable and confident about doing 30min+ or 1h+ survivals on other tilesets, even on SP... On here, you will simply die to the never-ending flow of acid being spilled on the floor. Because by the time the acid goes away from the floor... stupid Entrati maid robots already repaired the tubes/vials/bottles of acid and they get nuked again, spilling the same acid on the floor again! SUUUUURE, it kills enemies too... But it also kills YOU in the process!

AOE waeapons like Kuva Bramma, Zarr, literal simple Ignis even or AOE abilities for frames - like Zephyr's tornados, Voruna's jumps, Excal/Umbra's blade, Octavia's beatbox machine, Limbo's dome, Xaku's skeleton mode, Yareli with an AOE secondary... The list of any AOE stuff goes on that I haven't tested yet. Any and all of it just makes it unfun, since you're now fighting not the enemies, but the tileset itself - because the floor is lava acid.

And that's already on top of the 1st issue, where you fight against time/life-support much harder than usual. Not because you can't kill enough enemies in time - but because there aren't enough enemies in the first place, since they can't reach you lol.

3) The Murmur spinny snake enemy, my god... I can understand the flying pyramid with arms, right? The one you have to shoot the arms with precision aiming to kill off. Ok, this is good, this is fun enemy mechanic for a lil bit of extra complexity and such. GOOD stuff.

BUT MY GOD, THE SPINNY SNAKE THING!!! It comes in, ignores ALL of your crowd-control abilities(Khora's 2, Zephyr's tornados, Voruna's cold/electro status effects from 2 that are supposed to stun/slow-down, Excal/Umbra's blind, Limbo's time-stopping dome, etc), rolls over up to you and starts AOE blasting what I assume to be... some magnetic proc/damage? Which messes up your shields, messes up your energy AND messes up your UI too, so you can't even see your energy/shield/hp left properly!

To top it off, i couldn't seem to find the weakspot aka "headshot zone" on it either. And it seems to have some insane and dumb amounts of HP or damage resistance in the first place. I have top tier weapons, incarnons and such, modded and formad to hell and back. I am legendary 3 with over 3500h on steam and 1k+ pre-steam of Warframe. So I know my stuff, how to mod, damage types, all that. And the same weapons just evaporate everything else around, including the full sized necramechs that are spawned sometimes. Everything... except this stupid rolling murmur snake enemy.

Worst part is? It seems like it's not even considered some "elite" or eximus enemy and you sometimes can have up to 2-3 of those snakes rolling around in the crowd at the same time on SP survival, spamming their stuff to absolutely ruin your run.
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TL;DR So basically... Survival in the new tileset, with new enemies... Is not fun.
- Not enough enemies on Normal and they get stuck, so you don't get enough life support drops from them and have to rely on towers... which will not get you past 10 minute marker comfortably or at all;
- Steel path has enough enemies, but they still get stuck and again, not enough life support drops. Same issue as above;
- AOE = counter-productive, as the whole tileset floor will be acid that kills enemies, sure, but also YOU as well;
- Spinny snake fun-killer enemy that ignores crowd control, has some absolutely dumb HP/DR, has no apparent weak spot(unless I'm missing something) and just wrecks your day with magnetic proc non-stop(no shield, no energy, no UI to see anything) and strong damage.

Yes, I know DE does not read this forum. I just felt overly frustrated by this and felt like venting. Whatever.

[KitKat]

I am now 100% sure the problem is in the tileset itself.

Octavia, Survival, Steel path. Enemies still have that same behavior, doesn't matter if I'm stealthed or not.

5 minute timer. Acolyte spawns in a nearby room. Not in my room, but the one next to it. There is an arch and a border, clearly the edges of two tileset pieces connecting, right? Acolyte spawns on the other side of said border. And just... stands there.

I am in stealth - acolyte stands, does nothing. Doesn't move, doesn't shoot, nothing.
I let stealth run out. Enemies in my room start attacking me. Enemies AND the Acolyte from the nearby room - just stand there, do nothing still.

I stealth once again. Set one foot across the border while still in stealth... BOOM, instant one-shot with an opticor with no charge-up, no animation, no movement, nothing.

Yeah. Something is broken with the new Entrati lab tileset. For sure.

[Spittz]

I get out to the outside/desert open area tiles where enemies have way more spawn points, and fewer obstacles or pathing. That, or I just sit next to tower spawns. The levels are so damn big and long (giggity) to risk exploring too far.

[KitKat]

Originally posted by Spittz:

I get out to the outside/desert open area tiles where enemies have way more spawn points, and fewer obstacles or pathing. That, or I just sit next to tower spawns. The levels are so damn big and long (giggity) to risk exploring too far.

Thank you. I'll try the outside/desert areas some time tomorrow, actually. Hopefully it'll be better.

[Commander_Black]

i did survival with Hydroid in a giant room and it wasn't an issue cuz they pretty much spawned at the doors around my room. so i did not experience that path-finding issue.
i stayed for 10 minutes with 100% life support from enemy drops only.

My advice is: camp a bigger room :)

[aGothLizard]

I camped the very large murmur tile that's open and ran a 40 minute survival on normal just fine. Probably could've kept going for 20 no problem aside from a strange bug I ran into where my guns wouldn't hurt anything not 10 feet away.

[KitKat]

Originally posted by aGothLizard:

I camped the very large murmur tile that's open and ran a 40 minute survival on normal just fine. Probably could've kept going for 20 no problem aside from a strange bug I ran into where my guns wouldn't hurt anything not 10 feet away.

Seems like that's the way to go for now until they fix stuff.

P.s. Solo Alchemy as Octavia for AABC rotation(4 crucibles) and extract seems to be the way to go now instead to farm the arch-gun parts though. It's faster in terms of time, even if by little (13-15mins per run over 20min survival) and less stressful(cuz stealth octavia, yeah?).

[the crying fat cat]

I don't really have problem with this myself but if I were to guess I think it due to path finding issue because this tileset are large and have a lots of vertical space in a room while most other map are horizontal
as for the snake thing I think the weak sport is on the hands next to its head I think not quite sure because I didn't check it in the simulacrum yet

[Khanwolf]

i like that you mentioned that rolling Snake, the Stats regarding its Survivability and the Pathfinding of everything else in the new Tile Sets is horrible!

This is unfinished content though, there are placeholder animations in case DE didnt implement some mechanics since ten years: The whole new Faction still has these Placeholder Animations for Finishers in general.

If you are part of Ash's Bladestorm for example, you will be able to leave the map, because there are no anchor points yet for the Placeholder Animations of Bladestorm, so Ash will glitch through walls and the ground and do them randomly somewhere 1m around the enemy.

Some Railjack Units, some Moas there, took around 3 months until they were finished and all animations were in place with Anchor Points for Finishers in general or Animations like Bladestorm. This is unoptimized Beta content we are playtesting. Absolutely unfinished.

the mission progression bugs also underline that this was never finished or tested.

[Noot Noot]

Saw on Wiki that the snake is part of the Murmur 'construct' type wich has a unique health type called 'indifferent facade'. -50% to slash and viral, +25% electricity and puncture and void , and +75% to radiation damage. Doesnt suprise me when i read it since new frame is radiation based. But they fact that its CC immune is insane to me, not even Nezha can apply his multiplier ring.

[Sceles]

I have not had any issues. Your builds probably suck.

[Wintermute]

I went through 20 minutes on Hydroid. The tileset definitely ♥♥♥♥♥ with AI too much, but I wouldn't call it unplayable.

[BoxxyB]

Haven't had spawn issues with the survival but the exterminate bounty is massively bug because I have had to abandon it several times from things either not spawning or things just outright disappearing but DE doesn't read these forums. go make an official forum post and keep your attitude in check so you don't get 2035'd

[KitKat]

Originally posted by Sceles:

I have not had any issues. Your builds probably suck.

Ok. Good for you.

Originally posted by BoxxyB:

Haven't had spawn issues with the survival but the exterminate bounty is massively bug because I have had to abandon it several times from things either not spawning or things just outright disappearing but DE doesn't read these forums. go make an official forum post and keep your attitude in check so you don't get 2035'd

Already did. But from what I saw there, most feedback/bug-report threads are left untouched, unanswered. So it feels like it's not gonna be any better than this one here lol.

[XXX_SniperSlayer42069_XXX]

Originally posted by KitKat:

Originally posted by Sceles:

I have not had any issues. Your builds probably suck.

Ok. Good for you.

Originally posted by BoxxyB:

Haven't had spawn issues with the survival but the exterminate bounty is massively bug because I have had to abandon it several times from things either not spawning or things just outright disappearing but DE doesn't read these forums. go make an official forum post and keep your attitude in check so you don't get 2035'd

Already did. But from what I saw there, most feedback/bug-report threads are left untouched, unanswered. So it feels like it's not gonna be any better than this one here lol.

I mean if your builds suck then you should get better builds no? Solves the issue pretty quick.

[KitKat]

Originally posted by XXX_SniperSlayer42069_XXX:

Originally posted by KitKat:

Ok. Good for you.

Already did. But from what I saw there, most feedback/bug-report threads are left untouched, unanswered. So it feels like it's not gonna be any better than this one here lol.

I mean if your builds suck then you should get better builds no? Solves the issue pretty quick.

Both of you missing the point that the builds aren't the issue, but the AI behavior in the new tileset clearly being broken and not functioning as intended, compared to other tilesets.

But sure, keep being a toxic brat and pointing fingers at other players builds without actually knowing what they are :)