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In the holy name of Ahri...that is wrong on so many levels I don't even know where to start, elitist much?
You can be both a PvP player and a PvE player. No-one stops you from enjoying both game modes. There is no "chose what you will play, PvP or PvE, but choose carefully as you will never be able to play the other one" situation. There are gamers who mostly play PvE games but also occasionally dab in PvP games or have that one PvP game they like, does that mean they should be fully labelled as a PvP player and be looked down upon by "true PvE community".
Second, do you have solid proof that the "overwhelming majority would never go in PvP regardless of rewards"? What if all the augments from PvP get the sharable tag, along other mods? Would you get that your statistics taken from who knows where still hold true?
If I put a gun at your head, tell no-one about your situation, and put that poll on, then kill you if the percentage of people who answer that they would be interested in playing the PvP mode is higher than 40% (because that means there is no longer an overwhelming majority, still a majority but no longer as vast as you state), what do you think, would you get out alive or not? Each player can only vote once. Be honest.
Now, how do you know someone represents the PvE community or not? There are threads like this one where players state they would only play PvP if they can cheese it, because they are after the rewards. Which player base do they represent? PvP or PvE? They sure aren't PvP because if they were, they wouldn't be talking like that.
And unless you pulled the toxic player count statistic from the same place you pulled the vast majority one, your own statement shows it's not the vast majority, otherwise you wouldn't be able to find enough players for 100 matches, and on average there are 4+ players in the PvP matches I get into then.....wait a second. You said you play PvP. So according to your own "PvE players who play PvP are not PvE players, they are PvP players", you are a PvP player, so why are you stating about the "vast majority" as if you're part of it? You're not part of it, as according to you, they don't care enough to play 1 match, let alone 100 or more as you did, so you aren't entitled to talk about them.
SO which is it? You part of the PvP community meaning all your statements about the PvE community are lies, because you aren't part of it, or are you a PvE player and all your statements all completely false due to arguments pulled from you know where?
According to you, you can't be both, so?
Whatever you think the word "elitist" means, you're using the word wrong.
Yes. Somebody who says they are a PVE player means they never ever bother with pvp. That's a given. A pvp player plays either only pvp or both. Those players who don't care about conclave and still cheese something they dislike for several weeks just for all the rewards? yeah, they're pvp players. Masochistic pvp players. I don't know what else to call such long-term dedication into something one dislikes so much other than masochism.
Years-long amount of forum topics and comments on the internet of people saying they can't find conclave lobbies to play in. They're hard to miss, this is not a secret at all. Everybody knows this. Even in Prime Time twitch the devs pointed out that very few people play pvp (and archwing).
No I didn't. Let me clarify the sentence where I said "Personally I would run into a troll 1 out of 100 missions. In a pvp game that would be 20 out of 100 matches"
The first part is about pve gaming in general. The second part is about pvp gaming in general.
This is also a given. You are going to encounter toxic behaviour a lot more frequent in a large pvp commuinity in pvp-centric games. Earlier you said yourself:
.
And this is a GOOD thing that it is only 1 you know, because the conclave player base is so small. I've seen some posts of conclave players saying their community is the friendliest around. That is BECAUSE it is so small. Once it grows larger and becomes more popular, mob mentality does its work and you will no longer know only 1 toxic player but a whole lot more and more frequent.
This is why I said in my first post:
A large pvp community is always very toxic, a lot more than a large PVE community due to its nature. This is not a secret, it's common sense.
So fast forward to now. We have a half baked PvP mode that literally ten people play and (which is 5 more than Lunaro) and whole bunch of wasted coding effort. The devs ♥♥♥♥ canned raids due to low attendance, and by low attendance I mean a few thousand players. Now what exactly do you think is going to happen with PvP? Feel lucky it was not shiz canned.
TLDR, like 100 kids and one Sony exec wanted PvP. DE lost interest when little intrest was shown by the players. And the mode is on life support. Most of us wish they would just pull the plug.
How do I know all of this you ask? I was there. I was on the forums the day DE first posted about the Sony exec and I was on the front lines when the player base came to the castle with pitchforks and torchs in hand.
In other word. No.
I'd love to see that, imagine the "true PvE players" crying on the forums that DE ruined their credit farm mission.
Tho if that idea comes in, it will have to use the Conclave balance for weapons and frames, otherwise it won't work.
So the feeling I get from you that you look down on PvP players is just in my head? Well, in that case, probably, but I think it's not.
And how do you know? You can only talk about yourself, so how can you be so sure that someone never tried PvP? Play a FIFA match vs guys from your class in middle school? That's PvP. Do some Mario Cart? PvP. Yu-Gi-Oh, M:tG or any other card game? PvP. Or do those not count?
I think those like you who "never even touched a pvp game" are some sort of dying breed if that's the case.
And in most threads, I find the same few people crying how PvP is dead, should be removed, yada yada, so the quantity of different players in those hate threads isn't as bit as the number of comments I see.
Someone makes a PvP related thread, the same people go in crying that it shouldn't exist. I always find conclave lobbies to play in, and it's always around 3-4, if not more, and due to my job, I never play at the same hour each day, and all my friends who go public pvp always find lobbies.
To give you an example, if there are 10 topic, with 10 people commenting in each, if 5 of them are in each thread (which is the case with all these PvP threds, just different ratios), then it's not 100 people commenting, but 55, and since that is actually the case, because whenever there's a thread about PvP, those guys feel the need to say how PvP is dead, it doesn't look like that big of an "overwhelming majority". You can never know what someone else does play.
And where do you get your math? Oh wait, I know where, because you added "PvP games in general" to be able to avoid any critism due to the random numbers.
Yes, it's a give that you find more toxic people in true PvP games compared to PvE games, but there is a reason for that: Prizes.
People want to win for whatever reward the match has, be it MMR in ranked matches, drops, or whatever reward the game has.
Warframe's PvP is a bit different. You get nothing different if you win compared to if you lose, hence why people say they are friendly. Yea, there will always be a black sheep somewhere, but that's a given in any type of game, regardless if it's PvP or PvE.
But in that's the case, a lack of actual reward for the match itself on a win, would it be that bad if PvP gets a bit more attention from DE and makes a propper balance, so those who do play it a lot have more fun, while those who want to try it can have easier fun? As long as there is no reward for a win, to make it "I lost because of noobs/hacks/cheats/whatever excuse they have", while the rewards would make players more interested in playing it, would it be that bad?
The true answer is no. The guy who wins and the guy who loses get the same amount of standings with Teshin, challenges rarely require you to win, or if they do, they are weekly ones, where it's kinda impossible not to win 4-5 matches in 7 days, unless you are THAT bad at the game. So if you would be toxic there, it means you are a toxic player by default.
TBH this is one of the main reasons I checked out Warframe. My experience with PVPers has been nothing but negative over the last 15 years of gaming.
And to add an old guys opinion to the topic...I'm not a fan of PvP games but I would love to see them bring back the old solar rail battles.It lept the feel of Co Op with a side order of PvP attached.
https://youtu.be/6MkhSK-EA4s