Let's talk about those relics. (Rant/Suggestions)

[Warriorsage]

I have quit Warframe three times. Each of those times was after one or more weeks of grinding particular relics for particular items. Today it almost happened again, as I wondered why I have 8 Valkyr Prime Blueprints (the most common drop) from RADIANT Lith N3 relics and zero Nekros Prime Blueprints (10% chance). I am getting better at remembering that it's my own decision to almost exclusively engage this process every time I play the game, and that it isn't the game's fault that I'm a hardcore relic grinder.

That being said, I have two alternatives to the relic drop system. The first is inversion. For each grade of relic, the drop rates for the items involved flip. The middle item stays the same, and in descending order, chances INCREASE. Mostly I make this suggestion because void trace drop rates are absurd. I estimate the range to be anywhere from 6-32 for a single mission, in my experience. That means somewhere between 3 and 17 missions to get ONE radiant relic, with the reality being somewhere closer to 7. I would also insert a minor suggestion that void traces gathered during the mission count towards the total. Why the ♥♥♥♥ should I have to gather 10 void traces to get 6 traces at the end of a non-relic run?

My second suggestion is a little more radical. Maybe relics shouldn't drop ANYTHING. Maybe instead of having them laterally equal to each other, different grades contribute energy or research when bust open. Different relics, different grades, different levels of contribution. We access a drop table with the Void Segment back at the ship, and for every relic we bust open, we contribute that resource directly towards items that we want. Void traces can stay right as they are, with refining increasing the relic's contribution towards the bar. I'm sure this will be readily abused to make it grindy, but my point of contention is NOT about getting an undesirable item for every relic I bust open, but the minimum of 4+ completely wasted missions involved in the entire process of getting the correct relic, then the void traces to make it radiant.

Guys, I don't give a ♥♥♥♥ about Akstiletto Prime. But I still busted over FORTY RADIANT RELICS open to get that blueprint just so I could place that relic in the fodder pile. My choice? Sure. But there's got to be a better way to do this that doesn't involve breaking the game's economy or DE's bursting wallet.

[Lufka]

enhancing relics with tears does nothing, or even makes that drop worse

[EldritchErin]

It dosen't need to change, rng just hates us all. A tip is to use recruiting chat to find other people with the same radiant relic if you haven't already. As that would, in technicalities, give a 40% c chance of a rare drop.

Also, you can trade relics with other players to alleviate the grind a small amount, as there are players willing to trade their relics for your relics.

[No_Quarter]

you sir need to learn of what chance to drop means, with 4 radiants there is 10% chance to drop 1 rare item, but even after 100 radshares your chances ar enot 100%.

Simple math, or if you do not get the drop in 10 tries you sell junk you've got and get the rare on the market.
Why change the system if you get the item one way or another?
Worst case scenario you get 10 prime junks which is 20 plat, and chances are you will get at least 1 or 2 uncommon items which can be worth more.
So there you go, farming explained

[Warriorsage]

@No_Quarter I know exactly what drop rate means, if not from programming, than from 32 years of gaming.

I do however blame myself for not mentioning that I run solo. I forgot, or subconsciously omitted that information on purpose, because such a fact doesn't make me wrong, and it doesn't mean the system shouldn't be changed. Sorties can be solo'd, why should I have to run four-man teams for relic drops?

I suck it up, like we all do already. But that doesn't mean the system shouldn't be looked at in the overall scheme of the game. Period.

[No_Quarter]

lel solo relic runs.... mkay, let's overhaul co-op game because someone hates to play with people for sakes of greather good.

you do nopt have to, but it increases your chances to get good drop

[Warriorsage]

Correction: in a game that's rewardingly solo-able with optional co-op, let's look at the one system in it that chronically punishes players by wasting their time because they run solo.

[No_Quarter]

or how about you change your setting to public mm? sound easier than rebalancing entire system

[FatefulRuin]

"I don't want to have the best chances possible by just running with a squad. I prefer to have the bad chances ! So DE, change my solo chances to be better than with a four-man-squad, so I can keep playing this multiplayer game solo !"
The logic these days is just fascinating.

If you WANT to run solo, it's YOUR OWN decision and so it's your fault, and your fault alone, that you don't get the drops you want.
I ran in a group and got Mirage Prime together in like 3 hours of work. So how's that for "change the system" ?

[the poopshitter]

Messaggio originale di Warriorsage:

Correction: in a game that's rewardingly solo-able with optional co-op, let's look at the one system in it that chronically punishes players by wasting their time because they run solo.

except solo-ing relics is usually a huge waste of time

[Warriorsage]

@Vincent "I got extraordinarily lucky on a particular set of drops in an experience that I coordinated beforehand with three friends, so that completely invalidates whatever your experience is, preferred playstyle, and inconvenient facts that you're stating about my most-loved game."
The logic these days is just fascinating.

@B.W.S. Agreed.

Look, I'm not saying that running four-man teams SHOULDN'T be easier. I'm saying that running relics solo doesn't scale with the rest of the content of the game. Things SHOULD be tougher solo, they SHOULD take longer, and I've never had a problem with that. The question is where should that line be drawn? Because right now, that line is drawn out a lot further out in this case than it should be compared with the rest of the game's content.

[DarkEternal]

RNG is a fickle mistress. Check out my nuts ride the last year:
I farmed Ivara for MONTHS and only got her BP and systems. Then, last month, within 2 days I got the neuroptics and chassis. It was unreal.
Last month, I went into an endless fissure radshare for Nekros Prime Systems with 6 Radiant relics. I used 5 that mission and walked away with 5 Systems. It was incredible. 2 rounds we had multiple people get the Systems.
Then, earlier today, I used up 4 Axi B2 relics in an endless radshare and got exactly nothing.
An hour later I joined an Octavia Neuroptics farm on a whim, never having tried to get any of her parts, and got it first try.
RNG will love you to death one minute and then hate ♥♥♥♥ you into a fetal position the next. She sucks and I love her.

[Warriorsage]

@DarkEternal See, most of that stuff though, I don't mind. It took me around a week to get all of Nidus' parts. But every time I ran that mission, I had a shot. That's such a far cry from a rad-relic's 5+ you're-never-gonna-be-that-lucky prep-missions to wind up with a handful of ducats.

[Saelune]

I remember void keys. That makes me appreciate relics.

[FatefulRuin]

Messaggio originale di Warriorsage:

@Vincent "I got extraordinarily lucky on a particular set of drops in an experience that I coordinated beforehand with three friends, so that completely invalidates whatever your experience is, preferred playstyle, and inconvenient facts that you're stating about my most-loved game."
The logic these days is just fascinating.

Funny thing that I did NOT coordinate anything and ran with randoms. Sucks to do a statement without knowing anything that happened. xD
And just so you know, I play mostly solo too, 'cause it's my preferred playstyle and my PC almost bursts in friggin' flames when I actually am the host of a run, but with relics it's just dumb to go alone, nothing more, nothing less.
Oh, and to top it of: there's only few things from relics I need(namely Hydroid, Akbolto, Kogake, Ballistica, Nami Skyla and Odonata), and that mostly because I didn't bother to farm them up until now. Everything I tried farming so far worked out after a while and I am surely not one of those guys who run only void. Hell, I got hardly enough to sell it for ducats whenever Baro arrives. Sometimes I even don't have enough to get everything I want from him. My "luck" is solely based on running in Squads and having people in there who had a relic where I'd have been fine with the reward too.

Messaggio originale di Saelune:

I remember void keys. That makes me appreciate relics.

Arguable, I'd say. Keys at least had the possibility of using only one of them and then staying in a mission for hours, if you prepared right. But since that is only the case for endless missions and running in a premade-team, it was a pain to farm the things that dropped in missions like exterminate or sabotage.
So I can understand why people liked the keys better, but I dare to agree(hopefully no one rips me apart for this xD), that relics are much nicer in terms of farming and RNG, since its always only six Items, and not much more like in the key-days.

[Saelune]

Messaggio originale di Vincent_Darc:

Messaggio originale di Saelune:

I remember void keys. That makes me appreciate relics.

Arguable, I'd say. Keys at least had the possibility of using only one of them and then staying in a mission for hours, if you prepared right. But since that is only the case for endless missions and running in a premade-team, it was a pain to farm the things that dropped in missions like exterminate or sabotage.
So I can understand why people liked the keys better, but I dare to agree(hopefully no one rips me apart for this xD), that relics are much nicer in terms of farming and RNG, since its always only six Items, and not much more like in the key-days.

Even just getting the keys was a pain. Now? Im sitting on mountains of relics. And when I want to get a specific thing, just got to get a few of the relic I need, then do a radshare. Sometimes you get unlucky and have to do 10+ radshares, but most of the time it takes 1-3.

And I like fissures better than a specifc area, since it lets you go back to places otherwise ignored, and having the void as a place to just go to is neat.

The only problem with relics is apparently there used to not be a prime vault...but even if they kept the keys, Im sure eventually they would have implemented something similar eventually.