Tonkor Build Question (Corrosive vs. Hunter Munitions)

[Stealthy Jeffrey]

Hey there lovely community! =)

Can you please help me to find out what's the better Tonkor build? :)
I am really struggling with that question. Back in the days the corrosive elemental combo was the usual way to go on primary weapons. However, several popular Youtube Channels used the vigilante armaments + hunter munitions combo instead.
I tested both configurations in the simulacrum vs. level 80 (I can't spawn higher enemies at the moment) nox and corrupted heavy gunners with no clear winner.
However, I don't really get why I should use the vigilante armaments + hunter munitions combo if I can deal massive burst damage instantly with a corrosive build instead of having to wait for the bleed damage.

Could it be that the corrosive build is stronger vs. lower enemies while the hunter munitions build is better at level 120 and above because the slash damage bypasses armor?

Build 1:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1891183561

Build 2:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1891183675

Riven Stats:
+250.5% Crit Chance
+176.4% Crit Damage
-33.3% Ammo Maximum

I would be very thankful for any advice. =)

[Rutabaga]

Personally, I'd say the Hunter Munitions build is likely better. However I'm not too sure how the mod interacts with explosive weapons, as I have never used it on one. Namely "does it work with the explosion or only with direct hits? I can only hope it's for the explosion." and "Is the 30% chance proc applied per shot or simply for when an enemy is hit? I'm fairly certain it's the latter.".

Also, yes, when it comes down to it a Hunter Munitions build is primarily for high level content. Furthermore Vigilante Armaments is usually recommended with Hunter Munitions as the extra multishot gives you more chances to proc the bleed for most weapons.

edit: Also, just in case you don't know, Slash is good because it inflicts Bleed relative to the damage that inflicted the Slash proc. With Bleed's damage type being "True Damage", which simply ignores Armor and Shields.

[TheSuit]

The answer is Slash damage is True damage which can bypass armor on proc.

Corrosive decreases effectiveness the higher ou go, because you need to proc more remove more armor. This is fine for a high RoF gun like Soma prime but Tonkor RoF is extremely slow in comparison.

Hunter Munitions has another advantage, its 30% slash is INDEPENDENT of other modifiers. That means you aren't adding to the status chance but every 3rd shot essentially has a chance of applying slash on critical.

The downside is it is only 30% on critical meaning you better be building it with a high critical chance build.

[Stealthy Jeffrey]

Originally posted by Shade/Abhor:

Personally, I'd say the Hunter Munitions build is likely better. However I'm not too sure how the mod interacts with explosive weapons, as I have never used it on one. Namely "does it work with the explosion or only with direct hits? I can only hope it's for the explosion." and "Is the 30% chance proc applied per shot or simply for when an enemy is hit? I'm fairly certain it's the latter.".

Also, yes, when it comes down to it a Hunter Munitions build is primarily for high level content. Furthermore Vigilante Armaments is usually recommended with Hunter Munitions as the extra multishot gives you more chances to proc the bleed for most weapons.

edit: Also, just in case you don't know, Slash is good because it inflicts Bleed relative to the damage that inflicted the Slash proc. With Bleed's damage type being "True Damage", which simply ignores Armor and Shields.

Originally posted by The | Suit:

The answer is Slash damage is True damage which can bypass armor on proc.

Corrosive decreases effectiveness the higher ou go, because you need to proc more remove more armor. This is fine for a high RoF gun like Soma prime but Tonkor RoF is extremely slow in comparison.

Hunter Munitions has another advantage, its 30% slash is INDEPENDENT of other modifiers. That means you aren't adding to the status chance but every 3rd shot essentially has a chance of applying slash on critical.

The downside is it is only 30% on critical meaning you better be building it with a high critical chance build.

Thank you very much! :)
I just found out that I can pause the AI for easier headshots in the simulacrum, which made dps comparisons between the two setups MUCH easier. :)
I wish I would have known that BEFORE I opened this discussion. xD
So now there is a clear winner. You were right, the hunter munitions build deals more damage in the most test runs. :)

[Watermelons]

Originally posted by The | Suit:

That means you aren't adding to the status chance but every 3rd shot essentially has a chance of applying slash on critical.

Your wording is weird, I think you mean "about every 3rd crit essentially will apply slash". What you said sounds like "every third shot will roll the chance to apply slash", but I'm pretty sure you know what you meant , and so did OP.

The downside is it is only 30% on critical meaning you better be building it with a high critical chance build.

And since OP's riven cranks up his crit chance beyond 100%, it means at least a yellow crit is guaranteed on every shot, making every shot also rolling the dice to proc slash, 30% chance in the truest sense.

[Mhblis]

So to clarify does the aoe apply slash or only the direct hit?

[Rutabaga]

Originally posted by Mhblis:

So to clarify does the aoe apply slash or only the direct hit?

I personally assume both, but I haven't tested it since I posted my comment. It should be an easy test in the Simulacrum though.

[Mhblis]

Not home for days so I cant test which is why I was hoping someone had the answer.

Because if it is on only a direct hit slash is still going to be useless.

[Watermelons]

Originally posted by Mhblis:

Not home for days so I cant test which is why I was hoping someone had the answer.

Because if it is on only a direct hit slash is still going to be useless.

I'll test it out right now and report back. I believe it should be both direct hit and explosion.

Yeah it is explosion as well, but it rolls separately for each individual target hit. So it's not a binary roll that simply tags the crit explosion as causing a Slash proc or not. Hitting a group of enemies, you may only see one person get Bled, or you may see all of them.

[Pakaku]

The reason you want Vigilante Armaments is because you're running a single-shot crit weapon:

1.) The multishot combined with Split Chamber pushes it to 150% MS total, so half the time you'll fire two grenades, and three grenades the other half of the time. So you're maximizing every shot, which is very useful for slow weapons like the Tonkor

2.) Vigilante mods buff your crit tier, which means yellow crits can become orange, and orange crits can become red. You're already pushing +100% crit chance, so there's easy orange crits there. Slash procs benefit a lot from critical damage, which is where Hunter Munitions comes in

I think part of Corrosive's value is in its armour-stripping, which is very very limited on a weapon with a low fire rate and a low status chance. Without being able to spam it, you're only at an advantage against Ferrite armour, which HGs have, but not Nox. Slash procs ignore both types of armour, so it's a better choice in that case, especially if you're not raising your modded status chance over 30% in the first place.