Why are skillbooks at vendors random?

[Buttback]

I don't get it. It severely limits you from getting the skills you want.

For people that don't get it: Skill book availability is random each playthrough, that means merchants sometimes won't have (imo) vital skills.

[HozzMidnight]

The biggest problem with random skill books is its effect on the respec option you get later. If you are trying to respec a mage with 2-3 schools of magic, forget it, you will never get all those spells back. That sucks.

[Mhblis]

Vendors reset every time one of your main characters level.

Personally I hate random but in this game it works since each playthrough can force you to have to use a whole new strategy since you may not have all the same skills. All working well together here.

[Kozzy]

There is tons of books you can craft (easy to) and there is a good amount of people who sell books all over the game world (also in you're homestead).

[PinkDaddySasquatch]

im not sure if someone said this alredy but its really not random AT ALL at least for the first town. a few select vendors will sell skill books for certain attributes for example the arrow seller will sell dexterity based skills, or the general vendor to the right of the arrow seller he will sell spells usually, and the Guard Captain will sell strength based skills

[J A F F A]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από scat:

Many people seem to have complaints similar to this one, and they are valid, but I also believe that Larian did this intentionally. I remember listening to an interview with them where they were asked why it seemed that what some stats do or the full effect of some stats were hidden. Their response was that They don't really want everyone to min/max the game. Take what you get, and use their amazingly flexible game to find creative ways around obstacles or fights. I personally welcome this for a number of reasons, number one being that I have played way too many games where min maxing ruined it for me. WoW everyone had the same armor and talents and specs and gems and enchants and rotations or you were doing ti wrong. League of Legends you had to build a certain way or people looked at you like you had no idea how to play. Even games like Counter Strike or Call of Duty where if you buy the wrong gun then you weren't as effective.

The need and want to min max your character is something I completely understand, and I am not saying that it is a bad mentality, but I do think that people are not aware that Larian did intend on making that hard for you. I personally like to take the approach that I want to min / max my play through, not necessarily the game / my character if that makes any sense.

I think this is kind of a lazy way to force gameplay variety and excuses poor game balance. Games like WoW and LoL are not comparable because D:OS is not a competitive game. Who cares if players break the game? Who does it affect? A good dynamic character system should facilitate a number of builds with equitable strengths and weaknesses that challenge the player to prioritize their goals, not by taking away their power and replacing it with a random number generator. Personally I don't think it's a huge deal, it's much better than the Diablo 3 solution of making every class have automatic attribute allocation, but it's still a bit lousy.

If this is what they wanted to achieve it would be better to randomize the enemy types a bit more so you can never be 100% sure what you are actually min-maxing against.

[Mhblis]

I agree it is lazy in that respect but at the same time it adds an element of a living world where not everything is always available. It adds to immersion for me.

[feralgal]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Pink Daddy Sasquatch:

im not sure if someone said this alredy but its really not random AT ALL at least for the first town. a few select vendors will sell skill books for certain attributes for example the arrow seller will sell dexterity based skills, or the general vendor to the right of the arrow seller he will sell spells usually, and the Guard Captain will sell strength based skills

The vendors sell certain types of books but the books they sell are random within that type. E.g., I have two mages. Arhu sells fire and earth books, Cylia (the enchantress in the marketplace) sells Air and Water books, Shereth (King Crab Inn) sells Witchcraft books. Sometimes Conrad (on the ship) has books. But which fire and earth books Arhu sells is random. (You can verify this by saving before talking to the vendor when your mains are at a given level, then reloading after you've seen the inventory.)

I've been trying to collect two copies of all the books I might need in case I want to respec. (I didn't when my mains were on level 2 because no money and I don't think I did on level 3 bc I didn't know about the possibility of respeccing at the time.) I have all the level 2 earth books but only 1 of the level 2 fire books (for my two mages plus Jahan or any other mage henchie that I might hire). I have no level four or five earth books and two types of the fire books (one level 4 and the other level 5). It's similar for the air, water and witchcraft books. I have no idea how I'm going to get those books since I've been buying all the interesting books that were available since my mains were at level 4 (and some when my mains were at level 3). I try to get at least two copies of every spell book in case I might want to use it later, either for one of my mains or for a henchman that I hire later.

[Black Hammer]

I'm not sure how potentially forcing players to have limited choices of skills with a chance of said offerings being the same in multiple playthroughs counts as "encouraging variety."

Showing me all the options and letting me pick is variety. Randomly picking a limited number of options (and random does NOT in any way preclude getting the same ones each time) is not variety, but the game making a decision for me. Kind of a difference there.

[feralgal]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Black Hammer:

Showing me all the options and letting me pick is variety. Randomly picking a limited number of options (and random does NOT in any way preclude getting the same ones each time) is not variety, but the game making a decision for me. Kind of a difference there.

This happens to me a lot. I get Boulder Bash all the time. The first time, I was really excited because it was a spell I wanted to learn later. But after the 10th or 12th Boulder Bash book (with more coming later!), I was not pleased. There are a few other books that the venders had frequently as well. Sometimes I'll open the vendor's inventory, see that the vendor has a lot of books, then be disappointed that they're several copies of maybe three spells (which I already have).

[Buttback]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Pink Daddy Sasquatch:

im not sure if someone said this alredy but its really not random AT ALL at least for the first town. a few select vendors will sell skill books for certain attributes for example the arrow seller will sell dexterity based skills, or the general vendor to the right of the arrow seller he will sell spells usually, and the Guard Captain will sell strength based skills

You also don't get the point of this topic. Obviously they do sell the same schools of skills, but the skills themselves are completely random. For example, the Legion Captain you mentioned didn't sell Helping Hand in my playthrough yet, which made everything a lot harder so far.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Mhblis:

Vendors reset every time one of your main characters level.

Are you sure? If this is true, thanks a bunch for this info.

[50 Cal]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από HozzMidnight:

The biggest problem with random skill books is its effect on the respec option you get later. If you are trying to respec a mage with 2-3 schools of magic, forget it, you will never get all those spells back. That sucks.

This is why I didnt respec either, it sounds great that you can respec until you realise you have to get all the skillbooks over again, also most reasons for repecs are probably minor things like you want to get rid if the 50% less durability loss perk or something like that. Its easier just to go to Hall of Heroes and make a new avatar.

[Invasion_Dec]

Everytime you level up, merchants randomly change what they have for you to buy. Including skill books. What you can do is after leveling up, go to a merchant that sells the class of the skill book you are looking for. Make a quicksave before interacting with the merchant. Now if what you want is not available, just reload the quicksave until he/she has it.

This technique can also be used for chest loot and in combat to get desired results on say, applying a status effect on an enemy. It's called savescumming. Essentially cheating. But hey you bought the game and you're entitled to play however you like.

[Morgian]

As above said, leveling up restocks the vendors (*all* of them :) ).

But some spells are never found on vendors, e.g. Lightning Bolt, no matter how often you reload, so don't waste our time doing that.

[HozzMidnight]

They do reset when you level. But it still sucks because there are only a couple of vendors that sell more than a handful of skill books. I respecced my Rogue and I couldnt find the self invis and self haste for two levels, and those are the best two in the tree. Its worth pointing out that the Elementals you unlock in the Homestead each sell their element and one other, as in Air sells Air and Scoundrel. Fire sells Fire and Man At Arms, etc.

[clegane]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Crane:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Fhqwhgod:

No. a good game makes a second playthrough more fun (so far it seems I will have a lot of fun on my 10th playthrough too).
The random Skill book idea seems worse than it is. So far I had several copies of each skill I can use and even some that are too high in level. Just buy them whenever they appear even if it means dragging them around for 4 levels.

Then you are forced to adjust your build, I like that myself:P

This. Absolutely. I find the 'forced variety' to be quite liberating. It demonstrates that no skill is "vital" (as the OP referred to them) and forces the players to think creatively in order to win difficult encounters with agruably 'sub par' skills that they'd NEVER have purchased over the 'vital' ones if the randomizer hadn't forced it.

Min-maxing ruins games for me. I still do it in most games, because that's just the way my brain works. Can't help myself. So having certain aspects of my build controlled by the randomizer in a game like this allows me to explore options that my min-maxing nature would never have permitted otherwise. I heartily applaud the design decision.