My crappy excel budget is better... weird.

[Knottypine]

Not to discredit YNAB... but I don't know why it appears to by a little user unfriendly. I'm no accountant, or math wizard... but I have an excel spreadsheet that I manage my monthly expenses. I have all my recurring bills for each month, and colour coded for whether they are paid or not, which I manually do. This gives me a quick birds eye view of what hasn't been paid yet.

My income and bills for each month can be easily managed, and edited. Seems to work pretty smooth. Yet I try the trial for YNAB, set up for recurring income... and when I click future months, there is NO income. I don't get it. I'm missing a step or something. I don't think it's rocket science, but as soon as I make something recurring, why does it not show on the next month?

YNAB is currently on sale, and I'd never pay more than that sale price to manage my budget... considering I'm managing it just fine in excel. I was just looking for something a little more robust. This just seems like too many clicks to do something simple.

(Anyone hear of Monitor Mass? My god you'll know what I'm talking about)

[RodeoClown]

Have you checked out the method[www.youneedabudget.com]?

The whole point is to deal with bills and the like, and to make sure you can actually pay them, rather than just hoping your pay will cover it. That said, if you have a system that is working well for you, then we aren't going to force you to buy our software!

[RodeoClown]

Escrito originalmente por Sardinia:

Hell you let me setup scheduled income transactions months in the future, doesn't this go against that philosophy?

You can set up income transactions, but they aren't included in your budget until the scheduled day comes. At that point we stick a reminder icon on it so you can approve the transaction if the money did come in as scheduled. If it didn't, well, you can reject the transaction, and then you need to work with what you have on hand.

[RodeoClown]

Escrito originalmente por Knottypine:

In the trial, it included headings like "Rent/Mortgage" and utilities among other things. I don't decide to pay these when money comes in, I pay them because it's my responsibility. I budget for them on a monthly basis and work within my financal means. I know what comes in, and what needs to go out. I don't decide on paying my mortgage this month because more money came in, I do it because it's due.

Quite the contrary - your mortgage is one of the first things you need to pay, so you'll need to know you have the money to do so. If you don't have the money, then you'll need to take it from somewhere else to make sure it's covered. Once that's covered, you'll need to make sure you have money for essentials, and only then can you start putting money towards discretionary items (games, savings, etc).

You enter your money and then figure out what it needs to cover before you get paid next (whenever that might be). By working with only what you have access to, should your pay be delayed by several days, or not come at all, you aren't going to be looking at your budget assuming you can pay for stuff when you really can't.

[Knottypine]

Escrito originalmente por RodeoClown:

Have you checked out the method[www.youneedabudget.com]?

The whole point is to deal with bills and the like, and to make sure you can actually pay them, rather than just hoping your pay will cover it. That said, if you have a system that is working well for you, then we aren't going to force you to buy our software!

Make sure I can pay them? But the ONLY way I know I can actually pay them, is to know the income I have coming in can cover them. If I have a projected expense that I know is coming the second half of the month, the "method" you mention won't let me know if I can cover the upcoming expense until money is received. So that would be difficult to budget.

I guess basically I look at it like this... The program is called, You Need A Budget. But I just don't see how someone could create a budget without at least projecting what money they have (or are expecting) to work with.

I do have a system I use in excel, which is fairly bare bones basic but has some cool graphs. I was curious into looking at something more. But I think I'll just continue with my excel.

[RodeoClown]

That's fair enough - you're more than welcome to keep using your spreadsheet :)

With what you are doing you can't know you can pay, you're hoping you can pay, and assuming the pay comes in, then you're fine. It's when it doesn't come in, or is delayed, that you'll run into issues with projected income. That may never be an issue for you, but it can be for other people. The method is more about proactively managing the money you have, rather than planning what to do with money that should come in the future.

(I will ask again though, did you check out the method? It explains it all pretty well, and the teachers who wrote it up are better than I am at explaining this stuff ;))

[Knottypine]

Escrito originalmente por RodeoClown:

That's fair enough - you're more than welcome to keep using your spreadsheet :)

With what you are doing you can't know you can pay, you're hoping you can pay, and assuming the pay comes in, then you're fine. It's when it doesn't come in, or is delayed, that you'll run into issues with projected income. That may never be an issue for you, but it can be for other people. The method is more about proactively managing the money you have, rather than planning what to do with money that should come in the future.

(I will ask again though, did you check out the method? It explains it all pretty well, and the teachers who wrote it up are better than I am at explaining this stuff ;))

No my pay isn't an issue, DFT government salary. And if for any reason it fails to be deposited, I can go straight to the pay office and have it fixed with relative ease.

No I haven't checked out the method... however I've re-read the description, watched videos... From what I can see, something like this would only become beneficial AFTER you successfully begin living off of last months income. That puts someone one month ahead vs pay cheque to pay cheque.

[naomorte]

Actually, this sounds and looks perfect for my wife. And, no she can't plan a budget two weeks out, let alone a month or more. She does fly by the seat of her pants, as do most of the people she works with. They simply have no comprehension of *future* events. I have the demo downloaded and am going to try to get her to see how it works for her.

[sheehanje]

I'm going to try the method - even though I don't understand it fully. Things are fine for me until I hit something unexpected - and yes, I do live paycheck to paycheck, even though it's a steady paycheck. I also run into money sometimes with side jobs that I do - that aren't so steady.

I've done the Excel method, I had to keep 3 different spreadsheets - once for my monthly expenses, one for my long term debts, and one debts I didn't owe financial institutions.

It always breaks when I have the car break down, or the kids break the vaccuum cleaner. I guess I am one of those types that don't plan well and YNAB looks like it may help.

[RodeoClown]

Hi Sheehanje, can I recommend out free live classes[www.youneedabudget.com]? The teachers there do a great job of explaining how the whole method works, and how to break out of the paycheck to paycheck cycle.
Good luck!

[sheehanje]

I was just looking at them - unfortunately the next one I can schedule will be next Wednesday - right now I'm going through the tutorials.

On question you might be able to answer quick though - I know eventually this method works so I'm paying next months bills with this months money - but for the time being, where do I keep track of when my bills are due - Rent 1st of the month, Car on the 22nd, etc.

If I'm asking the question "What does this money need to do right now?" - shouldn't I have a glimpse of what I need to prioritize by due dates?

[RodeoClown]

We actually have a prerecorded copy of all the classes here: http://www.youneedabudget.com/support/article/introduction-to-ynab-class-materials

They aren't quite as good (no live Q&A), but they might help.

As for when stuff is due, the easiest way to do that is put it in the category name, so when you are budgeting your income, you can see what comes next, and assign it there (if you drag them into order as well that can help).

[sheehanje]

Makes sense - I will check out the pre-recorded ones and maybe write questions down if I decide to sign up for a live session. Thanks RodeoClown!

[Shuck]

I currently track (and project) the family budget manually in a spreadsheet and I do need and want to know future income, expenses, and more importantly timing of those flows. This is the same process we would use for setting a yearly budget and a 3 or 5 year plan in the business world. Yes, there can be changes that need to be adjusted in flight, but better to have a solid idea of future activities when they have a 98%+ probability of occuring (I *could* lose my job or be paid a day late but that almost never happens...).

I want to know that the trip we're planning 6 months from now or that our expenses are out of whack next April when tuition, taxes, license tabs, and such are all due on the same paycheck so I can adjust my spending/saving while I still have time to do so without the lights being cut-off or the kids going hungry.

Is there any mechanism in YNAB to do this type of forward looking analysis as a report if not in real-time?

Even if not, I think I may give YNAB a try for my wife's portion of the budget... She is an absolutely wonderful person, but she can't budget her way through a single week. Having a mobile app to sync this data also seems quite useful...

[RodeoClown]

Hi Shuck,
YNAB is essentially an envelope budgeting system, where you plan out with what you have. So we are effectively doing the reverse of your planning. Rather than saying "how much will I have in the future?", we say "what do I need in the future?", and then work out how to get there.

It's a different way of dealing with money. I can attest that it works really well, but it's not for everyone.

[Selmate]

Everyone saying their spread sheets are better and such need to realize NOT everyone has the know how to or software to do it that way. YNAB started as one of those spreadsheets, and evolved in to what it is today.

You also can't judge the software just on the software, it's designed around a specific method."The method" also works for anyone. Whether you have 5 grand in the bank, or are $200 in the hole owing the bank for over draft charges. If you try to "forcast" your income you shoot yourself in the foot.
"Well, in 6 months I'm going to have to pay $5,000 in tuition, So I'll have to not spend money on X that month". What happens in 4 months when your company downsizes, or god forbid you are struck by some sort of medical issue?

WIth YNAB you say: "Well, in 6 months I'm going to have to pay $5,000 in tuition. I need to set aside some money to cover that" and you allocate a portion of your income each time it comes in for that expense. When the time comes you have that money sitting there waiting to be used on what it was allocated for.

This is the same way the "Method" is used to get people that are living paycheck to paycheck to a point where they are living on last months income. Each time you get money you sit down and say Okay I have to pay rent, cable, electric and get some gas and groceries before I get paid again. I have about $100 left so I'll allocate myself $20 for fast food, $40 into savings for an emergency and $40 into my buffer. After a while, that buffer gets to the point that you have enough to pay all of your bills for the next month. It's hard. It requires you to work at it, and change the way you spend money. But the system works. Is it for everyone? Of course not. But hey, I can't stand FPS games or DOTA, I'm not out saying those games shouldn't be made, because they work for some people.

TLDR; Don't judge the software without going through the system it's intended to work with. It's not an electronic check register.