Hybrid ideology

[Koby]

When trying to role play a civ that is not straight Pragmatic, the points required make it difficult to combine different ideologies. This penalizes, I think, attempts at mostly Benign or mostly Malevonat points of view. Kind of stifiles us Romantics.

Will the next update or DLC mitigate that?

[ColorsFade]

No it doesn't.

Originally posted by Koby:

When trying to role play a civ that is not straight Pragmatic, the points required make it difficult to combine different ideologies.

Only on small maps. Anything on "Large" or bigger it is easy to do all three Ideologies.

[jonnin]

As far as I can tell, the next perk you take is the same price regardless of which tree. If you pick up the ablity to generate points from all 3 early, you can get quite a bit in a long game.

... I highly suspect you can adjust the amount needed to get subsequent perks somewhere to make it like you want.

[Koby]

Thank you. I generally sandbox on the 2nd or 3rd largest galazies and the only way I can achieve much is to stick to almost straight Pragmatic, which restricts my inner role player. The fault must be mine for not pushing through a big time canvas.

So jonnin's comment "... I highly suspect you can adjust the amount needed to get subsequent perks somewhere to make it like you want" intrigues me.

[ColorsFade]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=698661261

I go over this in my guide (didn't have time to give you a proper lengthy reply last night).

To play all three Ideologies your first choices need to be the ones to get the BUILDINGS. Intimidation Center, Missionary Center, Prepardness Center). Then get those down on all your planets (or at least most). They EARN POINTS.

This is how you unlock all the Ideologies.

On the largest map, in the longest game, you should be able to unlock every branch of every Ideology.

[jonnin]

Also you can get at least 1 ship from mercenaries that gives points per battle. It can max out malevolent in short order in a good war if you have that DLC.

[ColorsFade]

Originally posted by jonnin:

Also you can get at least 1 ship from mercenaries that gives points per battle. It can max out malevolent in short order in a good war if you have that DLC.

You have to get a bit lucky though, with that ship, because it's an Escort ship. Escorst are targeted first in every battle. So you have to secure it by having a bunch of other Escorts in your fleet to try and (luckly, hopefully) take the hits instead.

But yeah, if you can make it work, that ship is great for Malevolent.

[Dray Prescot]

Each Ideology you take increases the cost for new Ideologies, 10 points in the same area, 5 points in the other two areas.

I have had many games where I take 3 Ideologies from Pragmatic (along the get 3 constructors and better Star Bases branch, or 2nd row) and then play mostly Benevolent.

I even tried some games as the Yor as mostly Maleovent, but also take the first 3 Ideologies in the top row of Benevolent. Turning 1 population point on a colonization ship into 3 population on a new colony is fantastic for any Race that has major population growth problems. Plus a free colony ship with 5 population points is pretty useful to anyone.

[ColorsFade]

Originally posted by Dray Prescot:

Turning 1 population point on a colonization ship into 3 population on a new colony is fantastic for any Race that has major population growth problems. Plus a free colony ship with 5 population points is pretty useful to anyone.

Problem I find with Benevolent => Prolific is that by thet time I get it I've already colonized most planets. I suppose you take it earlier than I do.

I put a lot higher priority on other Ideologies though. Pragmatic => Builder is always first, then the buildings for Malevolent and Benevolent, and then I run down the Malevolent => Motivation line because it is so good.

IMO, the lines that are worth taking every time are Malevolent => Motivation and Benevolent => Enlightenment. Every one of the five Ideologies in those lines is worth taking.

Malevolent => Greed is also worth taking, at least up to Tightfisted. I love rolling in cash so I can just buy tech from other factions and rush build things I want.

[wilsonstone]

Originally posted by ColorsFade:

Originally posted by Dray Prescot:

Turning 1 population point on a colonization ship into 3 population on a new colony is fantastic for any Race that has major population growth problems. Plus a free colony ship with 5 population points is pretty useful to anyone.

Problem I find with Benevolent => Prolific is that by thet time I get it I've already colonized most planets. I suppose you take it earlier than I do.

I put a lot higher priority on other Ideologies though. Pragmatic => Builder is always first, then the buildings for Malevolent and Benevolent, and then I run down the Malevolent => Motivation line because it is so good.

IMO, the lines that are worth taking every time are Malevolent => Motivation and Benevolent => Enlightenment. Every one of the five Ideologies in those lines is worth taking.

Malevolent => Greed is also worth taking, at least up to Tightfisted. I love rolling in cash so I can just buy tech from other factions and rush build things I want.

Interesting. Isn't Benevolent useful early on, depending on the map? Getting a free colony ship early on and a few Benevolent points later a class 10 planet helps out a lot. The "free" planet usually appears in the first system you clonize and comes in handy as a resource for a (usually your first) shipyard.

[ColorsFade]

Originally posted by wilsonstone:

Interesting. Isn't Benevolent useful early on, depending on the map? Getting a free colony ship early on and a few Benevolent points later a class 10 planet helps out a lot. The "free" planet usually appears in the first system you clonize and comes in handy as a resource for a (usually your first) shipyard.

The free colony ship and planet are both really nice and they are usually the first things that I get after the Missionary Center. But that's when I stop that row of Benevolence and switch to the Enlightenment line. The Research is king after that.

The way the Ideology points are earned, especially early in the game, I tend to have most things colonize by the time the third option is available. I spread my points out. I choose Pragmatic first, to get the Constructors. Then I choose Malevolent next, to get the Intimidation Center. Then Benevolent to get the Missionary Center. Once I have those three things, then it depends greatly on the options themselves. If a choice is going to give me Malevolent +10% Research civilization-wide vs. Benevolent and +10% Influence, well, I'm taking the Malevolent option because the perk is better.

So then it's a juggling game - trying to pick the best perks, but being mindful of what I need to get through points. I absolutely need the Pragmatic => Builder => Coordinated option because it is important to my strategy (100% shipyard decay reduction when playing Terran or a custom faction with the proper Trait). And since I don't have the Pragmatic Building I cannot earn points with it, so I have to use the colonization events. So that Ideology becomes very important to get picked and out of the way.

Once Pragmatic => Builder => Coordinated is done, then I'm just alternating Benevolent and Malevolent points in something like a 1-ot-2 ratio to try and scream down the Malevolent => Motivated line while still picking up Benevolent points for the Colony ship, planet, and then Research line.

And all of that is subject to a Large map. If I go to the next map up, the one that supports 12 factions, or anything larger, then I know I'm going to colonize enough planets and see enough Ideology points that taking two full lines in Malevolent and Benevolent becomes a real possiblity. So then Malevolent => Wealth becomes #2, and that's when I would take Benevolent => Outreach all the way to the end, for the extra tiles and the Class 16 Planet.