TIGRAN Help

[Flushing]

Sorry for being so extra over the last week, whenever I watch Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings Trilogy, I reinstall Age of Wonders 3 and deep dive into it. Don't ask me why, or how I've linked it with Tolkien in my brain.

All that aside, I love Tigran as a race, but I want to pair them with a decent class.

My issue is that I've played hundreds of hours and already have my Race Class favorites. So here are my two core questions:

1. Tigran Rogues - do Tigran make good rogues? Looks like they might, I have very little rogue experience.

2. What Tigran combos do you like?

So far, I have played a very decent Tigran Sorceror; and while I dislike the Arch Druid class (thanks again Iguana-On-A-Stick), I can see how Tigran Arch Druids would do particularly well because their Mytics get were-pather and their shaman get were-bear. I enjoy Tigran Sorceror so much, it has replaced my Draconian Sorceror combo. (Now I do Dwarf, Tigran, or Frostling).

I've seen posts giving them high praise for Warlord (they may have the "Best" Berserkers in the whole game), but Halfling Warlord is my favorite, and even though it can be a wonky combination I can't be convinced otherwise on that particular combo because I have too much fun with it, even though there are much better combos on paper. But, I am willing to pair Tigran with any non-Warlord class.

My all time favorite race is Dwarves. It seems like most posters either love them or hate them, I get it. It's just Forge Priests and Firstborn are my favorite race units in the game.

[Pie Master]

I think Tigran Necromancer is pretty cool too, because of their bonus spirit resistance. Tigran rogue also seems like it would be quite good, Tigran Assassins get pounce and pass wall. Could be a really strong assassin.

[GreyHuntr]

Tigran Dreadnoughts can benefit from their production bonuses. I forget the details, but you can get up to some shenanigans with them and outposts.

[Flushing]

Thanks guys.

1. Necromamcer - You see. This is another spot where Dwarves are insane. I believe the Forge Priest and Firstborn stay 100% fire immune as GHOULS! So the Tigran Spirit Resistence is great, and I will try them for Necro, but Dwarves are silly.

2. Dreadnaught - I'll give them a try.

[pipo.p]

As obvious as it sounds, every race paired with any class can be interesting to play with. And this is without speaking about specializations that can make a couple of units shine, either base or class, or both, and change the feel of it. You can either try and optimize synergies, or aim at having multiple ways of acting, depending on the advancement in the game, and feeling more the faction you are leading.
Have fun in experimenting. (for example, a Necromancer with Partisan, Explorer, and Empire Builder, or a leader with "opposite" adept specs: Fire/Water, Creation/Destruction).

[Pie Master]

Originally posted by Flushing:

Thanks guys.

1. Necromamcer - You see. This is another spot where Dwarves are insane. I believe the Forge Priest and Firstborn stay 100% fire immune as GHOULS! So the Tigran Spirit Resistence is great, and I will try them for Necro, but Dwarves are silly.

2. Dreadnaught - I'll give them a try.

1. Dwarves - okay yes, fire resist is nice. But comes with a huge downside - you have to play dwarves

Originally posted by pipo.p:

As obvious as it sounds, every race paired with any class can be interesting to play with. And this is without speaking about specializations that can make a couple of units shine, either base or class, or both, and change the feel of it. You can either try and optimize synergies, or aim at having multiple ways of acting, depending on the advancement in the game, and feeling more the faction you are leading.
Have fun in experimenting. (for example, a Necromancer with Partisan, Explorer, and Empire Builder, or a leader with "opposite" adept specs: Fire/Water, Creation/Destruction).

Playing a necromancer in one of my current games with partisan, that war anthem or whatever spell that reduces enemy morale, plus 3 banshees is just brutal with exploit despair on top. Really cool how many different strategies there are even within one class.

[Phirestar]

Tigran is a good choice for Rogue. That class has a focus on irregular units and buffs to irregulars, and the Tigrans have the Sphinx as their racial T3, which is an irregular. Assuming the wiki has accurate information, this means that empire upgrades like the one which grants backstab to all irregulars, as well as the base stat boosts from Mercenary Camp, will also apply to the Sphinx.

I’m personally a big fan of Tigran Rogue as a hero, as well. The combination of Athletics and Inflict Crippling Wounds means that you’re able to move up to two tiles and still have three action points for ranged attacks (effectively 7-tile range), which is great for being able to lower movement on high mobility enemy units like cavalry.

(I also just like Tigrans in general - my favorite race. Out of the 7 leaders I’ve made (one for each class), 3 of them are Tigrans.)

[Flushing]

Originally posted by Pie Master:

Originally posted by Flushing:

Thanks guys.

1. Necromamcer - You see. This is another spot where Dwarves are insane. I believe the Forge Priest and Firstborn stay 100% fire immune as GHOULS! So the Tigran Spirit Resistence is great, and I will try them for Necro, but Dwarves are silly.

2. Dreadnaught - I'll give them a try.

1. Dwarves - okay yes, fire resist is nice. But comes with a huge downside - you have to play dwarves

Originally posted by pipo.p:

As obvious as it sounds, every race paired with any class can be interesting to play with. And this is without speaking about specializations that can make a couple of units shine, either base or class, or both, and change the feel of it. You can either try and optimize synergies, or aim at having multiple ways of acting, depending on the advancement in the game, and feeling more the faction you are leading.
Have fun in experimenting. (for example, a Necromancer with Partisan, Explorer, and Empire Builder, or a leader with "opposite" adept specs: Fire/Water, Creation/Destruction).

Playing a necromancer in one of my current games with partisan, that war anthem or whatever spell that reduces enemy morale, plus 3 banshees is just brutal with exploit despair on top. Really cool how many different strategies there are even within one class.

I hear you, I think Dwarves are awesome though.

That said, a lot of posters dislike Dwarves. Players really like them or hate them.

For me, Firstborn is amazing for capturing mythical and legendary treasure sites because he destroys many T4s with Giant Slayers and Dragon Slayer.

Outside City Walls, I think he's better than Orc Shock Troops and arguably the best T3 unit in the game.

Forge priests are also one of the only support units that have an independant heal. I believe human has the only other support unit that has a base heal and Forge priest has much better secondary attributes.

I understand that some of their T1 units suck, but I just don't understand the position that Dwarves are bad.

[Flushing]

Originally posted by pipo.p:

As obvious as it sounds, every race paired with any class can be interesting to play with.

I disagree. It's really a cliche that I've seen posted about many games but rarely AOW3. I've played for 100s of hours and it's clear as day when you have a suboptimal race class pairing. On Triumph's official website it even spells out some optimal combinations for many of the races.

Also, it sucks when you customize a hero and realize that by turn 20 it's a total failure. Fortunately, you can just quit and make a better combination.

If you capture an indepandant city that's a terrible macthup for your base race/class combo, then you migrate the settlement.

The only time I don't mind is during campaign because you have no choice. The only reason I can see for random combos is just to experience diversity.

[Flushing]

Originally posted by Phirestar:

Tigran is a good choice for Rogue. That class has a focus on irregular units and buffs to irregulars, and the Tigrans have the Sphinx as their racial T3, which is an irregular. Assuming the wiki has accurate information, this means that empire upgrades like the one which grants backstab to all irregulars, as well as the base stat boosts from Mercenary Camp, will also apply to the Sphinx.

I’m personally a big fan of Tigran Rogue as a hero, as well. The combination of Athletics and Inflict Crippling Wounds means that you’re able to move up to two tiles and still have three action points for ranged attacks (effectively 7-tile range), which is great for being able to lower movement on high mobility enemy units like cavalry.

(I also just like Tigrans in general - my favorite race. Out of the 7 leaders I’ve made (one for each class), 3 of them are Tigrans.)

Thank you! I will definitely try Tigram Rogue. What sub-classes do you choose for the Tigran Rogue Combo?

[Iguana-on-a-stick]

But, I am willing to pair Tigran with any non-Warlord class.

I recommend Warlord.

What?

You see, the thing is that whilst Halfling Warlord is a ton of fun, it plays very differently from other warlords. You rely on your monster hunters, on your mounted archers, on your very lucky extra hitpoints eagle rider. You play the Warlord in a more rogue-like fashion, using speed and nifty ranged attacks to win despite being small and squishy.

Tigran Warlord meanwhile relies on speed and aggression. By stacking bleeding and predator abilities you inflict immense damage. WIth barrens running and pounce you can be in the enemy's face on turn 1.

You rely on different units. You get Berserkers and Warbreeds and Manticore riders.

Also, Raise Militia + Cheetah = win.

It's a different experience.

Anyway, that aside:

* Rogue -> double down on speed, double down on squishyness. Irregular Sphinx gives some neat combos. Prowlers and Sunguard add some much needed muscle.
* Archdruid -> already mentioned
* Necromancer -> Goes great with the Egyptian theme. Otherwise not too much to offer, but spirit resistance helps.

Other races are pretty much default. Tigran racial units are good, Tigran economy is great, so they're a pretty good fit with everything, but don't offer too many obvious synergies.

[Flushing]

Originally posted by Iguana-on-a-stick:

But, I am willing to pair Tigran with any non-Warlord class.

I recommend Warlord.

What?

You see, the thing is that whilst Halfling Warlord is a ton of fun, it plays very differently from other warlords. You rely on your monster hunters, on your mounted archers, on your very lucky extra hitpoints eagle rider. You play the Warlord in a more rogue-like fashion, using speed and nifty ranged attacks to win despite being small and squishy.

Tigran Warlord meanwhile relies on speed and aggression. By stacking bleeding and predator abilities you inflict immense damage. WIth barrens running and pounce you can be in the enemy's face on turn 1.

You rely on different units. You get Berserkers and Warbreeds and Manticore riders.

Also, Raise Militia + Cheetah = win.

It's a different experience.

Anyway, that aside:

* Rogue -> double down on speed, double down on squishyness. Irregular Sphinx gives some neat combos. Prowlers and Sunguard add some much needed muscle.
* Archdruid -> already mentioned
* Necromancer -> Goes great with the Egyptian theme. Otherwise not too much to offer, but spirit resistance helps.

Other races are pretty much default. Tigran racial units are good, Tigran economy is great, so they're a pretty good fit with everything, but don't offer too many obvious synergies.

I totally get it.

I have no counterargument for Tigran Warlords, it's an awesome pairing and Tigran Berzerkers are no joke, especially considering how fast you can get them.

I just have a special Hafling Warlord and fell in love with the combo from the Golden Realms Campaign.

I am not saying that I will never play Tigran Warlord.

[pipo.p]

Originally posted by Flushing:

Originally posted by pipo.p:

As obvious as it sounds, every race paired with any class can be interesting to play with.

I disagree. It's really a cliche that I've seen posted about many games but rarely AOW3. I've played for 100s of hours and it's clear as day when you have a suboptimal race class pairing.

Having "decent" combinations is not the only way to play this game when you are not in a match against humans, and other combinations don't "suck" in my opinion, as far as they don't get boring because they play like another one. At worst, they are chosen handicaps when playing against a lot of strong AIs, or on the wrong map. As I wrote, this may even help the player in feeling a faction or a class diffrently. But don't fear, you will prevail in the end, and it should be fun.

I'd think that someone sensible to the Lord of the Ring would agree with this argument.

My custom Tigran heroes?
- Warlord with Creation Adept, Wild Magic Adept, Explorer.
- Rogue with Partisan, Explorer, Empire Builder.
Don't look for soome logic or optimization; I just wanted to role play those archetypes.
I too haven't experimented a lot with Tigrans. Perhaps the vanilla "archmage" Theocrat could be fun as well (Earth, Wind and Fire).

[Flushing]

Originally posted by pipo.p:

Originally posted by Flushing:

I disagree. It's really a cliche that I've seen posted about many games but rarely AOW3. I've played for 100s of hours and it's clear as day when you have a suboptimal race class pairing.

Having "decent" combinations is not the only way to play this game when you are not in a match against humans, and other combinations don't "suck" in my opinion, as far as they don't get boring because they play like another one. At worst, they are chosen handicaps when playing against a lot of strong AIs, or on the wrong map. As I wrote, this may even help the player in feeling a faction or a class diffrently. But don't fear, you will prevail in the end, and it should be fun.

I'd think that someone sensible to the Lord of the Ring would agree with this argument.

Ok

Originally posted by pipo.p:

My custom Tigran heroes?
- Warlord with Creation Adept, Wild Magic Adept, Explorer.
- Rogue with Partisan, Explorer, Empire Builder.
Don't look for soome logic or optimization; I just wanted to role play those archetypes.
I too haven't experimented a lot with Tigrans. Perhaps the vanilla "archmage" Theocrat could be fun as well (Earth, Wind and Fire).

Thank you

[Pie Master]

Originally posted by Flushing:

Originally posted by Pie Master:

1. Dwarves - okay yes, fire resist is nice. But comes with a huge downside - you have to play dwarves

Playing a necromancer in one of my current games with partisan, that war anthem or whatever spell that reduces enemy morale, plus 3 banshees is just brutal with exploit despair on top. Really cool how many different strategies there are even within one class.

I hear you, I think Dwarves are awesome though.

That said, a lot of posters dislike Dwarves. Players really like them or hate them.

For me, Firstborn is amazing for capturing mythical and legendary treasure sites because he destroys many T4s with Giant Slayers and Dragon Slayer.

Outside City Walls, I think he's better than Orc Shock Troops and arguably the best T3 unit in the game.

Forge priests are also one of the only support units that have an independant heal. I believe human has the only other support unit that has a base heal and Forge priest has much better secondary attributes.

I understand that some of their T1 units suck, but I just don't understand the position that Dwarves are bad.

I give dwarves a bit of grief but i am actually having a lot of fun with my dwarf dreadnought at the moment. I like to play themed characters/armies so my army is actually just 5 x axemen with as much armor increase as possible. I’ve also been fighting a dwarf warlord AI in another game and their phalanx and manticore riders are scary.

Its more just the fact they are small filthy and noisy that i dislike them :p also i almost never play with underground on, unless its a completely underground game so its harder to make use of their racial benefits

Tigran are my favourite race, particularly sunguard are such a visually cool unit to me. Halfling is probably next because they have some really neat class units.

[Reality]

I've always felt like Dwarf have the most boring racial units but just hit the "class unit" jackpot in multiple ways (the +1Def+1Res only being the tip of the iceberg)

For me Tigran's best feature is their 28 move units getting that extra step from barren's running. Makes me like them on low movement classes like Theocrat/Necro. (Pushing the high movement higher doesn't appeal as much because they never feel punchy enough to justify it)