This game private server is doable if a team of competent people wants to revive this game

[Gatuno]

I've been a player of pservers since Ragnarok Online, and if there is a team interested into making a pserver of this game, it will be made.

Pservers aren't the "hardest" thing to do. Someone out there still might have the game files saved somewhere, all it takes now is a team interested in the project to reverse engineering the launcher and rebuild the whole server database by feeding the game every single server side call it asks for, like logins servers and characters created. It does take time, but it 110% doable.

Some ignorant people think that for a game to have its version of a private server, it needs the server source code, and you are deeply wrong.

World of Warcraft didn't have its source code leaked, the WoW Core used by many pservers was built from scratch by listening to the client's calls for the server and creating those calls to fulfill the requests made.

This is how you make a pserver, of course some code leaked would be great and speed up the process, but it not 100% needed.

Also, about the "BUT THE LAWS OF IP" lol dude, really? You think pservers are hosted on lands where US law takes place? No, it usually hosted on servers outside of US legislation and there is no sht the companies can do about it, unless they want to spend a few millions to chase some random group of nerds to shutdown some small pserver project in the other side of the globe. And if they manage to close one, others pservers will pop up and it will be an endless and pointless chase and a lot of money wasted just to "try" to close all the pservers.

[Numenorean]

Originally posted by Cowtoast:

Both sides can be right.

You do not need the original source code to recreate a private server -- although it is _extremely_ helpful and generally makes for better private servers.

The other way to do it is a herculean effort that generally involves packet capture of live servers, so you can see what the game is sending, and what it is receiving back, and reverse engineering that way. Attempting to do it without the captured data would take enough effort/be near-impossible enough to make it cheaper to rewrite the game from scratch.

The key to making a private server for a game that does not have server code leaked is captured data from a live server. Which this game no longer has.

Indeed I never said that it can't be done as absolute statement. I mention that it can be done by putting a LOT of efforts in decode the communication protocol used; and I assume that people as skilled as the dev team that made 3 online games (of which one is still up and running), would make it so easy so anyone can hassle their server with spoofed data or make their own server by simply listening to the traffic requests.

[Numenorean]

Originally posted by Cowtoast:

Originally posted by Gatuno:

No, the client itself will attempt to connect to the webserver and make requests to get responses, you can that way feed those by emulating a server and slowly provide everything the client needs.

..And how do you know the response the client is expecting? How do you know the format of the response? There's no examples to go off of. You know you sent a login request with your username and password to your webserver. Cool. What's the server responding with? A version check to ensure the user's software is up to date? What does that look like - is it a build number, is it a version number, is it prefixed with something... A list of running servers? What does that look like - IP addresses, server names, ports, user counts? How is that data encoded in the response?

Bingo.

Usually when you initiate a request from the client, the first thing the server does is to authenticate the client based on specific rules set by the server. If the client does not respond as the server expect, the connection won't even be established and terminated.

This is how 99% of the client server works; try to reverse engineer the server from facebook, tiktok or any other we application that require authentication, and you will discover that even if you can fake the request, you do not know what to put in the request, beside username and a password.

On top of that, you need to know what data the server has; what is the name of each of the field in the database and how to address those via API calls. If you do not know the API calls, you are talking French to a person that speak Mandarin... Ain't gonna work unless they draw things instead of talking.

Even if the protocol is the same used for every server-client setup, the order of data and content is most likely different, because nobody like the idea of someone getting on their server and compromise their network. This is security 101; even if you are not a devops or work in networking, those are things they teach you on your first day at work (assuming the person works in anything remotely related to computers and software).

[Metr0]

now now gentleman no need to fight, we can all at least agree we want this game back and hope somebody with determination and know how comes along.

[GameNerdVeggie]

They should sell the Game for Singleplayer Modus.

[Gatuno]

Originally posted by Cowtoast:

Originally posted by Gatuno:

No, the client itself will attempt to connect to the webserver and make requests to get responses, you can that way feed those by emulating a server and slowly provide everything the client needs.

..And how do you know the response the client is expecting? How do you know the format of the response? There's no examples to go off of. You know you sent a login request with your username and password to your webserver. Cool. What's the server responding with? A version check to ensure the user's software is up to date? What does that look like - is it a build number, is it a version number, is it prefixed with something... A list of running servers? What does that look like - IP addresses, server names, ports, user counts? How is that data encoded in the response?

Softwares like Wireshark can help you with that.

[Gatuno]

Originally posted by Bearweiser:

Originally posted by Gatuno:

No, the client itself will attempt to connect to the webserver and make requests to get responses, you can that way feed those by emulating a server and slowly provide everything the client needs.

Holy sh*t shut uuuppp.... do you really think you're the first one to say that people can start a private server for this game? You're not. Like someone said: if it could be done it would've been done already. Did you even poke around to see how WoW servers were emulated or did you just think you just- what, figured it out? A good comparison would be trying to build a car perfectly by just stealing the frame and having to build the rest yourself. Is it doable? Well. sure. Is it really ret*rded? Beyond so, yes, and that's not even what you're purposing people try and do.

The cherry on top of this sh*t sundae is that what you're purposing is actually illegal. It doesn't matter if you're not in the US the company and IP are US based and you're openly discussing stealing then illegally distributing someone else's product in a public forum. That's how I know you're full of sh*t. You can say nuh-uh and wag your head back and forth like a toddler all you want but- it doesn't change anything. Blizzard successfully sued quite a few of the people that started private servers in the beginning.

Preemptive Self Defense: Do it. Get your group together and do what, I believe his name was Nightwing, bragged that he knew someone that knew someone could totally do. That's the best way to shut me and everyone else up. You can't, but that's the best way to do it.

Lmao, you literally know nothing dont you? "Oh no, it illegal" no ♥♥♥♥ sherlock? Thats why private servers are hosted where US laws do not apply.

Providing information is not illegal. You can literally teach how to open a car without keys and turn it on, it not illegal to provide such information, the act of doing so however, is in fact illegal.

Also, I can tell at least 5 WoW private servers that are open right now since years and Blizzard doesnt even care anymore and they cant do anythimg about it.

[Gatuno]

Originally posted by Numenorean:

Originally posted by Cowtoast:

..And how do you know the response the client is expecting? How do you know the format of the response? There's no examples to go off of. You know you sent a login request with your username and password to your webserver. Cool. What's the server responding with? A version check to ensure the user's software is up to date? What does that look like - is it a build number, is it a version number, is it prefixed with something... A list of running servers? What does that look like - IP addresses, server names, ports, user counts? How is that data encoded in the response?

Bingo.

Usually when you initiate a request from the client, the first thing the server does is to authenticate the client based on specific rules set by the server. If the client does not respond as the server expect, the connection won't even be established and terminated.

This is how 99% of the client server works; try to reverse engineer the server from facebook, tiktok or any other we application that require authentication, and you will discover that even if you can fake the request, you do not know what to put in the request, beside username and a password.

On top of that, you need to know what data the server has; what is the name of each of the field in the database and how to address those via API calls. If you do not know the API calls, you are talking French to a person that speak Mandarin... Ain't gonna work unless they draw things instead of talking.

Even if the protocol is the same used for every server-client setup, the order of data and content is most likely different, because nobody like the idea of someone getting on their server and compromise their network. This is security 101; even if you are not a devops or work in networking, those are things they teach you on your first day at work (assuming the person works in anything remotely related to computers and software).

By changing the original IP the client connects to an emulated server, the first connection attempt will request for something. By analyzing the request the client does through package analyze softwares (wireshark for example) you can then implement the expected response for the client. Thats how server emulators are built, it a slow but beautiful process.

[StubbNubb]

Originally posted by Gatuno:

Originally posted by Bearweiser:

Holy sh*t shut uuuppp.... do you really think you're the first one to say that people can start a private server for this game? You're not. Like someone said: if it could be done it would've been done already. Did you even poke around to see how WoW servers were emulated or did you just think you just- what, figured it out? A good comparison would be trying to build a car perfectly by just stealing the frame and having to build the rest yourself. Is it doable? Well. sure. Is it really ret*rded? Beyond so, yes, and that's not even what you're purposing people try and do.

The cherry on top of this sh*t sundae is that what you're purposing is actually illegal. It doesn't matter if you're not in the US the company and IP are US based and you're openly discussing stealing then illegally distributing someone else's product in a public forum. That's how I know you're full of sh*t. You can say nuh-uh and wag your head back and forth like a toddler all you want but- it doesn't change anything. Blizzard successfully sued quite a few of the people that started private servers in the beginning.

Preemptive Self Defense: Do it. Get your group together and do what, I believe his name was Nightwing, bragged that he knew someone that knew someone could totally do. That's the best way to shut me and everyone else up. You can't, but that's the best way to do it.

Lmao, you literally know nothing dont you? "Oh no, it illegal" no ♥♥♥♥ sherlock? Thats why private servers are hosted where US laws do not apply.

Providing information is not illegal. You can literally teach how to open a car without keys and turn it on, it not illegal to provide such information, the act of doing so however, is in fact illegal.

Also, I can tell at least 5 WoW private servers that are open right now since years and Blizzard doesnt even care anymore and they cant do anythimg about it.

Name the 5 servers and also- put your money where your mouth is and get this done already, I'm just going to keep calling you an idiot until you do.

[Gatuno]

Originally posted by Bearweiser:

Originally posted by Gatuno:

Lmao, you literally know nothing dont you? "Oh no, it illegal" no ♥♥♥♥ sherlock? Thats why private servers are hosted where US laws do not apply.

Providing information is not illegal. You can literally teach how to open a car without keys and turn it on, it not illegal to provide such information, the act of doing so however, is in fact illegal.

Also, I can tell at least 5 WoW private servers that are open right now since years and Blizzard doesnt even care anymore and they cant do anythimg about it.

Name the 5 servers and also- put your money where your mouth is and get this done already, I'm just going to keep calling you an idiot until you do.

Warmane, is one of the oldest Wotlk servers, been up since 2011
WoW Brasil - Brazilian Wotlk server
WoW freakz
WoW Circle
Ether Side
RetroWoW
WoW Mania
Unlimited WoW

Just google "World of Wacraft Private servers" and you will get a list of top100 / top10 best WoW Private Servers.

[StubbNubb]

Originally posted by Gatuno:

Originally posted by Bearweiser:

Name the 5 servers and also- put your money where your mouth is and get this done already, I'm just going to keep calling you an idiot until you do.

Warmane, is one of the oldest Wotlk servers, been up since 2011
WoW Brasil - Brazilian Wotlk server
WoW freakz
WoW Circle
Ether Side
RetroWoW
WoW Mania
Unlimited WoW

Just google "World of Wacraft Private servers" and you will get a list of top100 / top10 best WoW Private Servers.

I'm so super proud that you Google'd something. I don't understand why this small portion of the thing we're talking about is the only thing you'd actually look into despite the fact that you have multiple people telling you that you're wrong, but- whatever. That's great, bud, hey how's that private server coming along? You know the one that if it's made will make all of this stop? That private server. How's that coming.

[Metr0]

lmao at this point

[Green'Parfaits]

plz let me in to private server i dont live in US

[UltraMagnus]

Both sets of folks arguing are right. What Gatuno is saying is right. There are a lot of things out their that act as proxies and produce a certificate of trust to listen in and redirect traffic. An easy one to demonstrate, non game related would be Charles Proxy.

Its used a lot to test different scenarios in the UI which can't easily be reproduced on demand. You can add in latency etc, redirect the traffic to a different location or to a flat file containing the response. And for encrypted calls you can produce a cert and read the calls in plain text.

Wireshark is a version of that that runs and intercepts more than just RESTful API calls. You just have to be able to interpret and filter through what's important. I personally hate working with Wireshark because its like trying to find a needle in a haystack at times with how much is captured and how to boil it down to just what you want.

The World of Warcraft servers are a fair example. But the state they are in now took years and years of work and entire teams of individuals doing open source work to get it there. In 2007 or so, about 3 years after launch a lot of them still had like lvl 20 wizard npcs only able to melee attack because no one had figured out how to trigger their spell casting logic in a realistic way. Around the launch of TBC it was still like that. It wasn't till probably mid 2015 with a lot of the individual teams collaborating that you got something similar to real encounters and boss fights.

all considered. Both sides are saying things that ring true. Yes there's a way to start the process, and with capable enough folks you could eventually get to a close approximation. The difference being Wow started with something like 14 Million subscribers I think and so had a pool of interested parties spawn as some % of that. At max if Heroes ever eclipsed even 100k I'd be shocked. By the time the game closed they were under 1000 people still interested. So we're playing a much smaller numbers game even tho a lot of folks might remember the game fondly. They won't be spending hours or years to write their own source.

[ShANk117]

Originally posted by Wick:

Originally posted by ShANk87:

wow 500 dollars to rewrite an mmo from scratch who would turn down such an enticing offer

I can't even see the distance in which you covered in total to miss the point.

Imagine having a stick so far up your ass your sense of humor is this dulled. I feel sorry for you

[thawn4444]

Originally posted by Gatuno:

Originally posted by thawn4444:

World of Warcraft does not run on non-official private servers due to reverse engineering of it's source code, rather it has been rewritten from scratch.

having worked on 5:M personally for a time, I laugh at you thinking that you can reverse engineer source code by grabbing a few packets. . .god are you dumb.

You just agreed with everything I said, thanks.

if it was as easy as you claim somebody would of done it already. . .