Training Grounds Design Logic

[Ennuisel]

To build a training ground requires 2 training dummies, but gnomes can only train there if they have a partner to spar against - which implies that the dummies aren't being used at all.

Not sure if this is meant to change at some point, but it does seem to be a bit if an oversight.

[Nailfoot]

My problem with training ground is that it appears only EXACTLY two gnomes can train. If you have a 4 gnome squad, only two train at a time.

I guess its not a big deal as the skill is still increasing, but It is likely more effecient to build 2-gnome squads and assign each pair its own traing ground.

[The Silver Santana]

Well, training with a partner should (obviously) be more benefical than training with a practice dummy, though it should still be possible. Personally, I would like to see a progression of XP so that

A. no partner practices yield lowest XP. This should be equvilent to going outside and swinging at some leaves. You might learn something, but it ain't gonna be how to paint a picasso.

B. Partner practices with less experianced partners yield low XP.

C. Partner practices with equally experianced fighters yield baseline XP.

D. Partner practices with a more experianced partner [than yourself, from each indivdual gnomes perspective] yield higher XP.

E. Real combat is supreme, by either an order of magnitude or a "cut-off" point. I.E. once you've reached 50 combat levels, combat practice no longer cuts it.

F. Even *more* XP should be gained by defeating physically superior foes, like Ogre's and Mants, as opposed to naked goblins.

Additionally, more experianced fighters should naturally increase the XP gain of their entire squad, even if not specifically sparring with them; I.E. at any sparring range, three fights can be ongoing; for each fight, the lower XP member levels his combat skills faster, but both level. Additionally, the highest XP combatant gives a boost to all the combatants, with the possible exception of himself.

[Ennuisel]

In addition to being less effective than sparring with a partner, it would make a certain amount of sense if using a dummy only allowed you to train weapon skills (as opposed to armor). But I suppose the real problem I have is that, due to the lack of a publicly visible list of planned features, it is difficult to say which mechanics are finalized and which are placeholders.

[Nailfoot]

Originally posted by The Silver Lion:

Well, training with a partner should (obviously) be more benefical than training with a practice dummy, though it should still be possible. Personally, I would like to see a progression of XP so that

A. no partner practices yield lowest XP. This should be equvilent to going outside and swinging at some leaves. You might learn something, but it ain't gonna be how to paint a picasso.

B. Partner practices with less experianced partners yield low XP.

C. Partner practices with equally experianced fighters yield baseline XP.

D. Partner practices with a more experianced partner [than yourself, from each indivdual gnomes perspective] yield higher XP.

E. Real combat is supreme, by either an order of magnitude or a "cut-off" point. I.E. once you've reached 50 combat levels, combat practice no longer cuts it.

F. Even *more* XP should be gained by defeating physically superior foes, like Ogre's and Mants, as opposed to naked goblins.

Additionally, more experianced fighters should naturally increase the XP gain of their entire squad, even if not specifically sparring with them; I.E. at any sparring range, three fights can be ongoing; for each fight, the lower XP member levels his combat skills faster, but both level. Additionally, the highest XP combatant gives a boost to all the combatants, with the possible exception of himself.

Not sure if I would endorse "E". While it may be a bit logical, it just wouldn't be fun. IMHO of course.

[lPaladinl]

I don't see the Point of A, since Training is already pretty damn slow, and you're already limited to only two Gnomes training at a time. (You want to limit it more? I thought the complaint in this thread was that is was illogical how Gnomes weren't training all at once.)

B, C, and D are already in the Game. Veterans trains newbies at faster rates, while gaining very minor Experience themselves. When Gnomes are of Equal Strength, they have a more balanced leveling scheme.

I personally disagree with E, I do not think it would be fun, especially for people wanting to play on Hardcore mode where Goblins grow stronger all of the time, whether you're fighting them or not. Combat is already the "ultimate experience" and grants much, much more combat experience than Training ever does.

and F... also already in the Game. Your Gnomes gain experience with Weapons everytime they make a Hit, and learn Defense/Dodge Experience everytime they take a hit or dodge. Larger Enemies like Ogres grant more Experience Naturally, since they take more Hits to kill, and much more effort to severely Damage. Ogres and Mants also have more opportunities to attack your Gnomes and grant your Gnomes defensive Experience for the same reason.

[The Silver Santana]

Originally posted by lPaladinl:

I don't see the Point of A, since Training is already pretty damn slow, and you're already limited to only two Gnomes training at a time. (You want to limit it more? I thought the complaint in this thread was that is was illogical how Gnomes weren't training all at once.)

B, C, and D are already in the Game. Veterans trains newbies at faster rates, while gaining very minor Experience themselves. When Gnomes are of Equal Strength, they have a more balanced leveling scheme.

I personally disagree with E, I do not think it would be fun, especially for people wanting to play on Hardcore mode where Goblins grow stronger all of the time, whether you're fighting them or not. Combat is already the "ultimate experience" and grants much, much more combat experience than Training ever does.

and F... also already in the Game. Your Gnomes gain experience with Weapons everytime they make a Hit, and learn Defense/Dodge Experience everytime they take a hit or dodge. Larger Enemies like Ogres grant more Experience Naturally, since they take more Hits to kill, and much more effort to severely Damage. Ogres and Mants also have more opportunities to attack your Gnomes and grant your Gnomes defensive Experience for the same reason.

Huh. Guess I missed that B/C/D Were already in the game. I never noticed any effect, and don't read the changelogs all the time, so...

Anyway...

Personally, I enjoy a challange. E. Would provide one. It's something that could be a hardcore mode option in any case.

F. Is *not* in the game. Look, I can already see an easy way to abuse the system I proposed in E-grab a weak enemy (like a goblin) in a trap, arm all your troops with wooden weapons and steel armor, and let 'em rip. No real danger of damage, but it's "real" combat. The point is that actually being theatened should convey more XP. It's very easy to bypass the current limitations with some fore-thought.