How to stop revolts?

[VEF215]

I have plenty of food, plenty of money, 3 circuses, 2 music theaters, 2 schools for pleasure rating. But huge revolts keep happening for an unknown reason

[Myrkana]

Right? I have 32 rats in need of joy right now and all 3 of my circus' are going :l

[eternalsway]

Originally posted by VEF215:

I have plenty of food, plenty of money, 3 circuses, 2 music theaters, 2 schools for pleasure rating. But huge revolts keep happening for an unknown reason

there's a chance that the entertainers didn't get entertainment and stop working and cause all this

[Flavalicious]

Sometimes rats get stuck (they mine their escape) or it snows and blocks a path. Best you can do it check the statistics screen and click on unhappy rats. Itll zoom the camera to em, can help figure out whats wrong.

I think theres actually a joy bug related to schedules. The rats working those venues dont work long enough for all the rats to cycle through the buildings. And i think some rats just cant find an open building when on free time

[Jagermaestro]

The circus only services 2 rats at a time, you need a fair amount of them to account for down time and travel time. I have only slightly more toilets than circus. I think there should be some additional early pleasure buildings so it doesn't feel so samey.

Music theaters only work for middle class and above, so unless you have something other than peasants they are doing nothing.

There is really only one solution for pleasure until you stratify your economy, more circuses. Also if you're circus workers are part of the riot they can't fix the issue.

This game gets a bit Dwarf Fortress on you if you let things get out of hand.

[Flavalicious]

Originally posted by Jagermaestro:

The circus only services 2 rats at a time, you need a fair amount of them to account for down time and travel time. I have only slightly more toilets than circus. I think there should be some additional early pleasure buildings so it doesn't feel so samey.

Music theaters only work for middle class and above, so unless you have something other than peasants they are doing nothing.

There is really only one solution for pleasure until you stratify your economy, more circuses. Also if you're circus workers are part of the riot they can't fix the issue.

This game gets a bit Dwarf Fortress on you if you let things get out of hand.

Problem is we are rat capped at 100 rats. So to keep them happy we need like 30 entertainers..... lol. They need to make the service buildings open to a larger crowd of rats per show.

[Jagermaestro]

Originally posted by Flavalicious:

Originally posted by Jagermaestro:

The circus only services 2 rats at a time, you need a fair amount of them to account for down time and travel time. I have only slightly more toilets than circus. I think there should be some additional early pleasure buildings so it doesn't feel so samey.

Music theaters only work for middle class and above, so unless you have something other than peasants they are doing nothing.

There is really only one solution for pleasure until you stratify your economy, more circuses. Also if you're circus workers are part of the riot they can't fix the issue.

This game gets a bit Dwarf Fortress on you if you let things get out of hand.

Problem is we are rat capped at 100 rats. So to keep them happy we need like 30 entertainers..... lol. They need to make the service buildings open to a larger crowd of rats per show.

How is population cap the problem? Ratio's don't change at scale and pleasure working isn't a fixed cost so there is no economy of scale here.

I understand you may be upset about the population cap but that really isn't relevant here.

I agree with your first post, they can get stuck due to snow (though that does throw a warning), finish before finishing service or while rats are enroute to receive service, can go on strike because of the issue they are there to solve and become criminals.

That being said I needed about 4-5 circus with around 30 rats. so around 1:7 should be safe. You might have brief increases due to everyone being on break at once (since you can't set schedules).

I think it's really that the idea of having so many circuses is silly, but it is the tier 1 pleasure building so idk what to say. Maybe busker (like Tropico) would make more sense. It takes up a big footprint too.

To be fair I think that is what they are going for.

[Flavalicious]

Originally posted by Jagermaestro:

Originally posted by Flavalicious:

Problem is we are rat capped at 100 rats. So to keep them happy we need like 30 entertainers..... lol. They need to make the service buildings open to a larger crowd of rats per show.

How is population cap the problem? Ratio's don't change at scale and pleasure working isn't a fixed cost so there is no economy of scale here.

I understand you may be upset about the population cap but that really isn't relevant here.

I agree with your first post, they can get stuck due to snow (though that does throw a warning), finish before finishing service or while rats are enroute to receive service, can go on strike because of the issue they are there to solve and become criminals.

That being said I needed about 4-5 circus with around 30 rats. so around 1:7 should be safe. You might have brief increases due to everyone being on break at once (since you can't set schedules).

I think it's really that the idea of having so many circuses is silly, but it is the tier 1 pleasure building so idk what to say. Maybe busker (like Tropico) would make more sense. It takes up a big footprint too.

To be fair I think that is what they are going for.

I think your 1:7 ratio is pretty generous lol. I think its much closer to 1:5 and only if placement is optimal. And those numbers are strictly for using the circus, a majority of the other entertainment buildings are 1:1 performers/attendees. And I don't see how a hard population cap isn't a problem, not everything in this game is a scale able ratio. Stuff like soldiers are pretty locked in numbers, in the early game once its no longer manageable on your own, you need around 5 soldiers, for late game you need 10 if your not wanting to repair half of your city after every fight. Some of the necessity production buildings are also responsible for too many critical items to have adjustable rates, I dont think for example you can run a city over 50 rats without having 2-3 grinders. That goes for water haulers as well. In an emergency situation you may have 8 downed rats at the same time, how many hospitals can you divert limited manpower to with 100 cap? 1-2? I disagree at the concept of the entire games economy being flatly ratio based. Its less about it being limited to 100 rats at the moment and more about how the values of production are setup to cause that limitation to be restrictive. We probably shouldn't need 3 sawmills at the start of the game to get stuff going. A grain farm should produce more per plot with the limited manpower we have. Each rat should be worth more, there is not really any reason i can think of that an entertainer cant give joy to 5 rats at a time instead of 2-3. The tech tree is massive, the games got so many options, but I bet you can't survive with 1 of everything in your city without starving to death, so that would hint to me that some things need to be tuned.

[Caidryn]

1:7 Seems pretty reasonable, actually. But it might depend on how you work your layout. I currently have 35 rats with just 4 circuses, and the only times I've had any riots were from an unemployed rat who couldn't afford their needs. I've since fixed that with a daily stipend for those under a certain amount, but I'm having no troubles meeting all my rats needs.

I use a central shaft with lifts as the heart of my city, so nothing should ever be particularly far away. I also put my circuses in pairs so when a circus worker needs a joy break, they only have to walk next door.

If you're curious as to what that looks like, you can see here: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1058504304832557096/1172159362198929418/Ratopia_2023_11_09-07_59_52.png?ex=655f4d79&is=654cd879&hm=a0dbab13981db700af3d307dddcd7020cdcecf1da534a84054c8bd7d2eb5bc29&

But yeah, depending on layout and how you work things, you can do even better than 1:7.


As for rat value, I'd say that depends on the rats your recruiting. All rats get work bonuses from their stats. I'm really picky about who I recruit, and I turn away rats more often than taking them in. Stats matter, and negative traits can be pretty hard to manage if you're not careful.

The longer you have your rats, and the more carefully you place them, the better they get at their jobs. There's no time limit to do what we need to do, and growing brings its own burdens. I decidedly have not used more than one of any building other than gatherers (for wild grain and grass), Circuses, and bathrooms, and I'm getting along just fine so far.

[Latol]

i tried the arena seems like it servers more people even lower class. i see it working more then the circus

[Jagermaestro]

Originally posted by Flavalicious:

Originally posted by Jagermaestro:

How is population cap the problem? Ratio's don't change at scale and pleasure working isn't a fixed cost so there is no economy of scale here.

I understand you may be upset about the population cap but that really isn't relevant here.

I agree with your first post, they can get stuck due to snow (though that does throw a warning), finish before finishing service or while rats are enroute to receive service, can go on strike because of the issue they are there to solve and become criminals.

That being said I needed about 4-5 circus with around 30 rats. so around 1:7 should be safe. You might have brief increases due to everyone being on break at once (since you can't set schedules).

I think it's really that the idea of having so many circuses is silly, but it is the tier 1 pleasure building so idk what to say. Maybe busker (like Tropico) would make more sense. It takes up a big footprint too.

To be fair I think that is what they are going for.

I think your 1:7 ratio is pretty generous lol. I think its much closer to 1:5 and only if placement is optimal. And those numbers are strictly for using the circus, a majority of the other entertainment buildings are 1:1 performers/attendees. And I don't see how a hard population cap isn't a problem, not everything in this game is a scale able ratio. Stuff like soldiers are pretty locked in numbers, in the early game once its no longer manageable on your own, you need around 5 soldiers, for late game you need 10 if your not wanting to repair half of your city after every fight. Some of the necessity production buildings are also responsible for too many critical items to have adjustable rates, I dont think for example you can run a city over 50 rats without having 2-3 grinders. That goes for water haulers as well. In an emergency situation you may have 8 downed rats at the same time, how many hospitals can you divert limited manpower to with 100 cap? 1-2? I disagree at the concept of the entire games economy being flatly ratio based. Its less about it being limited to 100 rats at the moment and more about how the values of production are setup to cause that limitation to be restrictive. We probably shouldn't need 3 sawmills at the start of the game to get stuff going. A grain farm should produce more per plot with the limited manpower we have. Each rat should be worth more, there is not really any reason i can think of that an entertainer cant give joy to 5 rats at a time instead of 2-3. The tech tree is massive, the games got so many options, but I bet you can't survive with 1 of everything in your city without starving to death, so that would hint to me that some things need to be tuned.

We aren't talking about soldiers. Continue grasping to make your pet issue relevant to this discussion.