The Writing Is A Bit Clunky

[Eguzky]

No offense intended to the writers, but I found a few things right in the first hour that really clashed & took me out of the game's story:

1. "It's all my fault!"
Claude's dad says this when Claude is teleported, and it makes no sense. He'd be worried, sure, but NOTHING about it is his fault:
1. Claude ignored HIS FATHER warning him away from the object multiple times! But even worse..
2. Claude's father IS CLAUDE'S RANKING OFFICER! This means Claude ignored the direct orders of a ranking officer.
I know the dude is worried, but he could have said something other than assuming fault in a situation for which he is 100% blameless.

2. "I Should Not Get Involved With The Villagers."
Claude says this...and then turns around and says he will talk with the villagers. Cognitive whiplash on that one.

3. "Something, Something, Technology."
I forgot what Claude calls it, but he worries about showing his gun on a lower-technology world.
...And then he turns around and, judging by the NPC villagers lines ("What's a speeseship? Can I eat it?" and "What's a masheen?"), he asks them about higher technology.
Right after worrying about higher technology on a lower tech world.
So much for whatever he was worried about, I guess?

I love RPGs. I have always wanted to play the Star Ocean games. But this writing is...not good? And an RPG needs to rely on it's story.
Claude turns around and contradicts himself TWICE within 10 minutes, and his dad irrationally blames himself for something that is not his fault in any way, shape, or form.

These things just kept being like story-based needle-scratches. Each time one of these events popped up, I stopped and went "Wait; What?" instead of enjoying the story the game wants to tell me.

[Chriziel]

It's pretty common fatherly instinct when ronyx blames himself for claude's mistake and a lot of dads or moms does this for their kids.

When it comes to claude... he's a 19 year old that grew up with a lot of people around him and probably highly dependent with his dad. So it's not really surprising that when he got transported alone to another planet he comes off really confused, helpless, and even contradicting himself at times. But he does get better as a person as the story goes on.

Then again star ocean second story is a 25 year old game and a product of it's time, so expect clunky writing, cheesy dialogue, outdated tropes, and even terrible voice acting because that was the norm of most games back then.

[Legion]

The first point actually makes sense if you listen to the personal action between Claude and Rena.

Didn't care about the rest of what you had to say since you decided to lead with something so easy to understand, but still butchered it.

[Azaeal]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Nomadic:

The first point actually makes sense if you listen to the personal action between Claude and Rena.

Didn't care about the rest of what you had to say since you decided to lead with something so easy to understand, but still butchered it.

What one, the one in Salva with 3 different dialogue paths for both Rena's Campaign and Claude's, so 6 dialogue options total? Do feel free to fill us in, as evidenced in other threads none of us know anything about the lore of the game, including later events that actually explain all this stuff that is being discussed here...

[Joerpg84]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Eguzky:

No offense intended to the writers, but I found a few things right in the first hour that really clashed & took me out of the game's story:

1. "It's all my fault!"
Claude's dad says this when Claude is teleported, and it makes no sense. He'd be worried, sure, but NOTHING about it is his fault:
1. Claude ignored HIS FATHER warning him away from the object multiple times! But even worse..
2. Claude's father IS CLAUDE'S RANKING OFFICER! This means Claude ignored the direct orders of a ranking officer.
I know the dude is worried, but he could have said something other than assuming fault in a situation for which he is 100% blameless.

2. "I Should Not Get Involved With The Villagers."
Claude says this...and then turns around and says he will talk with the villagers. Cognitive whiplash on that one.

3. "Something, Something, Technology."
I forgot what Claude calls it, but he worries about showing his gun on a lower-technology world.
...And then he turns around and, judging by the NPC villagers lines ("What's a speeseship? Can I eat it?" and "What's a masheen?"), he asks them about higher technology.
Right after worrying about higher technology on a lower tech world.
So much for whatever he was worried about, I guess?

I love RPGs. I have always wanted to play the Star Ocean games. But this writing is...not good? And an RPG needs to rely on it's story.
Claude turns around and contradicts himself TWICE within 10 minutes, and his dad irrationally blames himself for something that is not his fault in any way, shape, or form.

These things just kept being like story-based needle-scratches. Each time one of these events popped up, I stopped and went "Wait; What?" instead of enjoying the story the game wants to tell me.

Father and son relationships regardless of direct orders can change the dynamics. He feels he failed as a father, because he is rebellious and fatherly instincts where parents tend to blame themselves. If you played as Claude, you will see an explanation with his father Ronyx and isn’t too far in.

With the village, as humans, a lot tend to usually say “we shouldn’t do this” but do it anyway lol. For example if I was Claude, I would be thinking “I shouldn’t interact because it breaks the underdeveloped preservation pact” but then how will I ever learn where I am or get back! So logically I feel like I would explore…

Another thing about people’s perspectives is like how people play games to get achievements, while others think it’s pointless. We all have our set views, morals, beliefs and doesn’t mean we are right or wrong, it’s just the differences might not be similar to how you would act or think. I didn’t vibe with some other JRPG characters where lots of people did, whilst I feel the story and responses in this feel fitting, not perfect but I can relate a bit or understand why. Xillia was the best for me in regards to relating to Jude, whilst others may not because I have the same thoughts ans him and work in the medical field :). We are so similar.

Sometimes overanalysing isn’t ideal, however I still do it and am a perfectionist with missables xD.

Also if you play a bit more, it picks up, as I do understand what you mean in the beginning, but it does have a better sense of direction the more you play.

Also, Star Ocean 1 has his father in it, and rebellious teen. I know many parents of rebellious teens who have their parents blame themselves because they don’t come with an instruction manual. You could be the top CEO, or manage multiple businesses but still feel you fail as a parent.

Life is complex. Hope you enjoy the game and this has shed a little bit of another persons perspective :).

Otherwise start with Rena and you skip the intro with Claude and his Father and show Rena’s story ;)

[Legion]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Pie:

Początkowo opublikowane przez Nomadic:

The first point actually makes sense if you listen to the personal action between Claude and Rena.

Didn't care about the rest of what you had to say since you decided to lead with something so easy to understand, but still butchered it.

What one, the one in Salva with 3 different dialogue paths for both Rena's Campaign and Claude's, so 6 dialogue options total? Do feel free to fill us in, as evidenced in other threads none of us know anything about the lore of the game, including later events that actually explain all this stuff that is being discussed here...

Playing as Claude, and doing the personal action in Salva immediately upon getting Rena as a member shows you that Claude's father blames himself because he chose to go down to the planet himself even though Claude objected based on the captain's position. His father also guilt tripped Claude into not arguing against him wanting to go down to the planet himself, just as well for making Claude go with him when several others thought Claude was not truly ready and was only being favored to go because of who he is.

[Azaeal]

Ronyx was always impulsive, despite his Admiral rank (which he obtained from Captain in the span of a single event (Star Ocean 1). He never really grew up from that younger impulsive self, even despite the 20 year time gap. You see this evidenced later on in the story.

Despite his rank, Ronyx never really wanted a "desk" job, wanting to be actually involved himself. While this could be better explained during SO2, it is explained in the prequel to some degree, albeit not a great degree.

I personally never argued that it was not Ronyx's fault, but that Claude made the decision, in the moment, to disobey his ranking officer and father, and to approach the device due to his own dismissal of rank. Always feeling as if he got special privilege because of his father (which he did for the most part, a fact he hated)

Again if you are new to the story this is all explained during an event or 4 (5?) that comes later in the story (although you need to play Claude's campaign to see them)

Really, they both share the blame. Ronyx for wanting his son on the planet Milokeenia over more disciplined and experienced crew, and Claude for disobeying his father and getting close to an OPA (play SO3 to understand what that is, Claude did not know what that is, but should have obeyed his father and not approached anything unknown, on an unknown planet, in an unknown highly advanced dome, in a universe where magic and super advanced tech is known about widely)

EDIT: It could also be an ancient Nedian piece of technology, instead of an OPA, but its never explained.

[Legion]

Yes, which is why his father blames himself. He knows his son and could have done more to prevent Claude from acting childishly. I never said Claude was not in part to blame, but only that the story explains why OP's first point actually does make sense despite his claiming otherwise.

Realistically, Pie, I 100% agree with you.

[knarflook]

I just played the demo and what turned me off was how bad the dialogue is. It has that awful "As you know..." quality to it where everything only serves to inform the player about ongoing events, not to establish believable, relatable characters. There's zero literary or poetic quality to it as well, everyone in the game talks like a naive simpleton who has never had a real conversation in his or her life.

[Joerpg84]

Początkowo opublikowane przez knarflook:

I just played the demo and what turned me off was how bad the dialogue is. It has that awful "As you know..." quality to it where everything only serves to inform the player about ongoing events, not to establish believable, relatable characters. There's zero literary or poetic quality to it as well, everyone in the game talks like a naive simpleton who has never had a real conversation in his or her life.

I used to play cryptic JRPG’s back on the GB and NES where the townsfolk just give a few words on a hint on story without any direction, and games slowly evolved to having NPC’s having more dialogue in FF series, but still older games on NES and SNES have the same…well actually less dialogue than this.

Some games have silent protagonists, and some have too much NPC dialogue that people don’t like where in Grandia you talk multiple times to the same NPC and it’s different with walls of text each time, or Xenogears where people complained they rambled on forever and they thankfully said you can move or leave while they chat. I personally love both of those games a lot and even the old school style too, and have no complaints for either as they both fulfil the world building, and I feel the townspeople in this game to be great. It’s a nice balance of simple and even feel Octopath had similar, but also feel there are personalities for NPC’s and little details of continuing stories between some that move from towns you might be missing out on.

This game also has Private actions where each party member split up in towns and you can bond and get to know more about them that alters your friendship with them. They can get quite extensive as they happen at so many story events and are optional.

Also, If you don’t like NPC’s, steal from them lol…You should also only steal when alone and not when you have the party with you otherwise it can affective their friendship levels. It’s an awesome feature.

[Azaeal]

The dialogue gets better as the game progresses. The "as you know" is a way to explain something anyone on that planet should know, while also being like "yeah let's discuss this world altering event without being too vague."

The Prophecy Stone has only just hit Expel within the last few months, and you start in a fairly disconnected village, pretty much as far away from Eluria as possible, which is the place the stone landed. It does make sense for the Mayor, or the King, to explain what they know in a bit more depth, while also saying "You know this big f-off rock landed way over there, and now monsters are getting more antsy".

As you explore (and if you actually read) the story, a lot of things start to slot into place, especially at the mid point of the game. (There's also secret lore, but you might need a guide to unlock that, or read it online, but that's very heavy spoilers)

Ultimately the story is your classic JRPG story. Start off in the middle of nowhere, end up aiming to save the world Kill a few godlike beings after finding the power of friendship and make it home in time for lunch. Its not super deep, it does have philosophical ponderings for a few moments, but overall its a fine story. Your classic emotional moment here, your edgy side characters, and the "oh that's a twist" moments.

[REhorror]

Eh, it seems OK to me.
You are expecting characters to make sense too much, instead of acting like natural persons.

[Sishiya]

Keep in mind that writers for video games aren't, generally speaking, trying to cater to the fine prose crowd. If you're curious why that might be, I suggest taking a few random samples from random threads of random game discussion forums here on Steam.

[knarflook]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Sishiya:

Keep in mind that writers for video games aren't, generally speaking, trying to cater to the fine prose crowd. If you're curious why that might be, I suggest taking a few random samples from random threads of random game discussion forums here on Steam.

Awful comparison. Ever since its inception, JRPG has shown itself to be a subgenre that aims to be more than just run-jump-kill. It has always had a strong focus on character development and plot. Many classics draw inspiration from disciplines such as history, philosophy, literature, psychoanalysis, and religion, and many deal with profound issues such a moral dilemmas, existentialist crises, and repressed trauma. To excuse a game in this genre with writing as base as this one by referring to the lowest common denominator of gaming is just bad.

[Azaeal]

Początkowo opublikowane przez knarflook:

Początkowo opublikowane przez Sishiya:

Keep in mind that writers for video games aren't, generally speaking, trying to cater to the fine prose crowd. If you're curious why that might be, I suggest taking a few random samples from random threads of random game discussion forums here on Steam.

Awful comparison. Ever since its inception, JRPG has shown itself to be a subgenre that aims to be more than just run-jump-kill. It has always had a strong focus on character development and plot. Many classics draw inspiration from disciplines such as history, philosophy, literature, psychoanalysis, and religion, and many deal with profound issues such a moral dilemmas, existentialist crises, and repressed trauma. To excuse a game in this genre with writing as base as this one by referring to the lowest common denominator of gaming is just bad.

Oh boy are you in for a treat come halfway thru the story then.

[Sishiya]

Początkowo opublikowane przez knarflook:

Początkowo opublikowane przez Sishiya:

Keep in mind that writers for video games aren't, generally speaking, trying to cater to the fine prose crowd. If you're curious why that might be, I suggest taking a few random samples from random threads of random game discussion forums here on Steam.

Awful comparison. Ever since its inception, JRPG has shown itself to be a subgenre that aims to be more than just run-jump-kill. It has always had a strong focus on character development and plot. Many classics draw inspiration from disciplines such as history, philosophy, literature, psychoanalysis, and religion, and many deal with profound issues such a moral dilemmas, existentialist crises, and repressed trauma. To excuse a game in this genre with writing as base as this one by referring to the lowest common denominator of gaming is just bad.

Out of curiosity, what game from the PS era (and platform) are you holding up as the literary standard by which you're judging this title?