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Daniel 2019 年 11 月 18 日 下午 4:37
Reasons for no launch authorization?
Hello!
Training with Su-25T in the first mission (the one to kill SAMs) using the graphic fantasy pod and Kh-58 medium range missiles, I was glad to see the SAMs had less range than my missiles. Why could I not get the launch authorization? Had a SAM locked from a far distance. Only after IT fired me, I got LA and also got instant LAs on the rest of the SAMs in the pack then.

A minimum launch altitude? How do I know a minimum launch altitude of a weapon? If it was not that, then what else it could be? I had a clear line of sight (no visual). The range of these missiles is 70km I think and I had to get closer than 20km to them.

Thank you!
最後修改者：Daniel; 2019 年 11 月 18 日 下午 5:01
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引用自 Troll Norris:
You have to be hard locked by tracking radar of SAM system to guide the missile properly. The searching radar is poor source of signal for that. Or if the SAM will turn off its radar, the missile will lose its guidance.
And one note. It is phantasmagoria pod. Good tactic is to fly near the edge of their range. They don't have infinite amount of missiles. Once those are depleted, you have a lot of time for strike.
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Insônia 2019 年 11 月 20 日 下午 6:32 
Your welcome but sorry I make you feel uncomfortable.
it just make no sense.
I just want facts not thanks. even we put thousands hours still not confident to say know every detail in every aircraft and every weapon in every extreme condition in such complex system.

Only reason I'm still interested in because I want to know what cause. If it's just my "assumption". Please prove me wrong about this. out my hole of mind.
Even just a single screen shot about your hud when you lock the signal source at beginning under exact same condition. Will debunk this myth. The best way is still a repay track tho.

Let me sum up.

1: your idea on 70 km range is based on encyclopedia , not what elint and FCS calculate and shows in your HUD. Right?

2: it was very clear. If you said exactly as what you done from start to end. Kh58 will not go beyond 30 at that attitude. From ingame and wiki.

3. It's true for best guidance when you got hard lock by TR. But in any circumstance, it was not must requirements for putting pilot in extreme dangerous just for a launch authorit.
最後修改者：Insônia; 2019 年 11 月 20 日 下午 6:55
#16
Daniel 2019 年 11 月 20 日 下午 9:43 
引用自 Insônia：
Your welcome but sorry I make you feel uncomfortable.
it just make no sense.
I just want facts not thanks. even we put thousands hours still not confident to say know every detail in every aircraft and every weapon in every extreme condition in such complex system.

Only reason I'm still interested in because I want to know what cause. If it's just my "assumption". Please prove me wrong about this. out my hole of mind.
Even just a single screen shot about your hud when you lock the signal source at beginning under exact same condition. Will debunk this myth. The best way is still a repay track tho.

Let me sum up.

1: your idea on 70 km range is based on encyclopedia , not what elint and FCS calculate and shows in your HUD. Right?

2: it was very clear. If you said exactly as what you done from start to end. Kh58 will not go beyond 30 at that attitude. From ingame and wiki.

3. It's true for best guidance when you got hard lock by TR. But in any circumstance, it was not must requirements for putting pilot in extreme dangerous just for a launch authorit.
1: YES! That is correct!
2: That is the answer I was looking for. And explanation why the 70km range did not apply. Troll Norris explained the reason very well.
#17
Insônia 2019 年 11 月 20 日 下午 11:47 
AT 300mR AGL? 200~400mR AGL all the time?
are you serious. this is BS.
Design
It was designed to be used in conjunction with the Su-24's L-086A "Fantasmagoria A" or L-086B "Fantasmagoria B" target acquisition system.[1] The range achieved depends heavily on the launch altitude, thus the original Kh-58 has a range of 36 km from low level, 120 km from 10,000 m (32,800 ft), and 160 km from 15,000 m (49,200 ft).[1]

Do you understand this sybmol? and are you above this bar or below this bar when you not got LA, and what after you got LA? what's attitude?
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1917348682

alright , what ever..

i leave my posts for future player get better understand of weapon range and FCS.

as for 70km range from 300m AGL need be debunked:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1917334451
58 300m AGL @ 450TAS override launch

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1917346168
58 8000M ASL @ 750TAS override launch

X time
Y left total mechanical energy
Y right flying distance

missile engine burn out 15s after launch, reach maximum speed and energy state. at end of last 20~30 sec missile lost ablity to maneuvers due to low air speed. useless glide stage.

what gonna happens when a system or weapon burn every drop of fuel ,and lose almost all it EK and EP due to air drag and gravity at final end, almost near 0 joule total EM drop into ground. Do this thing still able move forward? by what, magic?

See the difference?

2.5x max EM difference, almost 3 times distance difference 120vs40. 2x flying time . the engery is not give by missile it self. your aircraft and attitude helps it reach such state. also low air density reduce the air drag increase speed and range.

At 300 AGL, with every engery it can get. before air drag and gravity completely kills it. in the chart. by Kh-58 fuel plus 400km/h aircraft EK at 300m AGL, how on earth and mother of physics will give you enough energy let it fight air drag and gravity for 70km long.

the same mission same target from 56nm 114KM kill. total none sense about signal.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1917319162

最後修改者：Insônia; 2019 年 11 月 20 日 下午 11:52
#18
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