WW2 pacific

[Maddogtannen6989]

anyone else would love to see WW2 pacific theater carrier battles with all the trimmings

[fikmeinshizer]

yup, can't come soon enough

[NineLine]

Publicado originalmente por Maddogtannen6989:

anyone else would love to see WW2 pacific theater carrier battles with all the trimmings

We will be working on a WWII version of our Marianas map after the modern one is complete, and as such, what is a map without the stuff to go with it, right?

[Vanhala]

Publicado originalmente por razoleg (The Cunning Fox):

Publicado originalmente por startrekmike:

I doubt there is anyone who would actually say they wouldn't. That said. Such a project would take a rather long time to say the least.

I don’t find the theatre interesting or engaging. Bunch of blue aircraft attacking some grey boxes in a flat ocean and dodging green aircraft with bullseye on them. How exciting. I don’t mean to offend anyone, but taking off and flying in the blue over blue for hours, searching for ship wake, like in IL-2, gets old fast.

Korean War or Vietnam, seeing as we have the assets and the aircraft, would be much more exciting.

Not much of importance went down there anyway. Except maybe Midway, Guadalcanal, Kokoda. Those battles combined aren’t even close to like one day in Kursk.

That said, variety is always a good thing. But I would rather them flesh out the European theatre, make a dynamic campaign and then think about Pacific as an afterthought if they have resources.

I agree with you on some remarks, but I consider PTO very interesting. It's mainly due to my interest in carrier aviation; no other location has seen so much carrier action in three separate conflicts spanning some 30 years. Middle east is somewhat close.

I must say Vietnam would interest me also from the USAF perspective. Korean war if I get to fly F-84. Europe not so much, since the pinnacle of air war in Europe to me was Battle of Britain, something not covered in DCS at all. Aerial combats in the eastern front are something I could fly from the German perspective.

While it's obvious these are only my personal points of view, I still want to further underline that PTO related DLC's are something needed for us carrier aviation enthuasists. Then again, as of now we'll have to settle to combat the Jerry in the upcoming Corsair.

But I'll be ok with that.

[startrekmike]

Publicado originalmente por razoleg (The Cunning Fox):

Publicado originalmente por startrekmike:

I doubt there is anyone who would actually say they wouldn't. That said. Such a project would take a rather long time to say the least.

I don’t find the theatre interesting or engaging. Bunch of blue aircraft attacking some grey boxes in a flat ocean and dodging green aircraft with bullseye on them. How exciting. I don’t mean to offend anyone, but taking off and flying in the blue over blue for hours, searching for ship wake, like in IL-2, gets old fast.

Korean War or Vietnam, seeing as we have the assets and the aircraft, would be much more exciting.

Not much of importance went down there anyway. Except maybe Midway, Guadalcanal, Kokoda. Those battles combined aren’t even close to like one day in Kursk.

That said, variety is always a good thing. But I would rather them flesh out the European theatre, make a dynamic campaign and then think about Pacific as an afterthought if they have resources.

And then only if we have a big map with south china, Hong Kong, Philippines. I would rather fly in “Flying Tigers” than kill pathetic remnants of the IJA airforce in mid-late 40s. And — we have IL-2 1946.

Corsair is coming anyway. That Supercarrier module can be extended to WW2. And that’s about it.

So for those of us who have been playing flight sims for a long time, there have been a ton of pretty solid European theater combat flight sims. It has been comprehensively covered many times over. This isn't to say that such comprehensive attention is bad. It is good that we have had great titles like European Air War, Jane's WWII fighters, Microsoft Combat Flight sim 1/3, and so on. Likewise. the IL-2 franchise has provided us with a pretty solid look at the Eastern front.

In contrast, we have had two major pushes into Pacific theater air combat. The first that comes to mind is Microsoft Combat Flight Simulator 2. It was a solid, immersive experience but did lack a bit in the simulation department (compared to its peers). Likewise. We have had an expansion for the original IL-2.

The reason why people find this theater interesting in a combat flight sim sense is because it just isn't well covered. What's more. the selection of airplanes is pretty different compared to what you might find in a European theater focused sim in terms of design focus and priority.

Lastly. Saying "Not much of importance went down there anyway. Except maybe Midway, Guadalcanal, Kokoda. Those battles combined aren’t even close to like one day in Kursk." is pretty messed up. It isn't a competition of importance and there are a great number of people across many nations who would not be happy to see their efforts (or the efforts of their parents or grandparents) so flippantly trivialized. WWII saw a great many aviation innovations and one of the larger ones was effective, practical carrier operations. Obviously that is of great importance.

[The Cunning Fox (raZoleg)]

Never played MS Flight sim. Don’t think many people played it for Pacific Theatre. Most of people played it in IL-2 original.

The planes aren’t so different. You get a few that carry torpedoes. Amazing. This is “whole ‘nother level”. Some fold wings.

It is a competition of importance, as you can’t mention every battle in a sim if you have limited resources. So, good luck misinterpreting in order to get offended. If we’re talking visual entertainment and being offensive as well as battlefield coverage, let’s not talk about operation Overlord and MoH, CoD, RTS like the godawful CoH 2 which portrays western allies as space marines in the first installment and Russians as uruk-hai orks in the second, every FPS title you can name except maybe RO2.

WW2 is covered by DCS (West) and IL2 (East). Both Russian companies, meaning European theatre is of vast importance.

Why is it then, that US companies can’t make a coherent flight sim on Pacific Theatre if it’s that important? They’ve done the FPS where US and its western allies is the only side that fought in WW2 (implying everyone else is either unimportant subhuman that doesn’t need to be mentioned, or was “evil as well”). Bulk of the gaming industry is there, so is Hollywood that orchestrates the importance of Allies landing in 1944, like Russia doesn’t even exist.

Here is a thought: make one yourself. Until then, PTO is an afterthought.

[startrekmike]

Publicado originalmente por razoleg (The Cunning Fox):

Never played MS Flight sim. Don’t think many people played it for Pacific Theatre. Most of people played it in IL-2 original.

The planes aren’t so different. You get a few that carry torpedoes. Amazing. This is “whole ‘nother level”. Some fold wings.

It is a competition of importance, as you can’t mention every battle in a sim if you have limited resources. So, good luck misinterpreting in order to get offended. If we’re talking visual entertainment and being offensive as well as battlefield coverage, let’s not talk about operation Overlord and MoH, CoD, RTS like the godawful CoH 2 which portrays western allies as space marines in the first installment and Russians as uruk-hai orks in the second, every FPS title you can name except maybe RO2.

WW2 is covered by DCS (West) and IL2 (East). Both Russian companies, meaning European theatre is of vast importance.

Why is it then, that US companies can’t make a coherent flight sim on Pacific Theatre if it’s that important? They’ve done the FPS where US and its western allies is the only side that fought in WW2 (implying everyone else is either unimportant subhuman that doesn’t need to be mentioned, or was “evil as well”). Bulk of the gaming industry is there, so is Hollywood that orchestrates the importance of Allies landing in 1944, like Russia doesn’t even exist.

Here is a thought: make one yourself. Until then, PTO is an afterthought.

I am going to pretend you didn't resort to the rather tired "go make one yourself" routine. I will also pretend that you didn't try to make this about being "offended" or some such nonsense.

You may not care much about the Pacific theater on a personal, individual, highly subjective level but that has no real impact on how others feel. Anyone who has spent ANY amount of time on the various combat flight sim related forums (even ED's own forums) would know that the Pacific theater is in very, very high demand. As I have said before, the theater is not well represented in the genre and while there are reasons for that, they are certainly not insurmountable reasons by any means.

As far as the aircraft being different. One need only open up a book or two and look up the design focus on Pacific theater aircraft to see that there are differences. On the USN side of things, you had a focus on smaller aircraft with large radial engines (as opposed to the P-47 in the ETO). In contrast, the Japanese aircraft were focused far more on being lighter and more maneuverable when compared to their German or Italian counterparts. This is all pretty basic stuff that even a glance at the aircraft would reveal.

I have no illusions that such a project would take a long time and would involve years of making modules and assets. It would be a massive undertaking. That said. ED has also expressed interest so even if you are not personally interested, it doesn't really matter, a lot of other people (ED and its third parties included) are. You might have some weird need to diminish the importance of the theater but in the end, those wheels are going to turn even if you are not on board.

[The Cunning Fox (raZoleg)]

Pretend all you want, I guess you're into RPG’s. If you’re ignoring my point, that means it worked.

1. Gib links that it’s in “high demand”.
2. No, I care for PTO (I grew up and lived most of my life in South East Asia), as long as it’s an FPS or a Naval Sim (check out my time in Silent Hunter), or done well like in IL-2. But I will say again: flying over a blue ocean and under a blue sky for hours is not something I wanna do for fun often. Maybe a big plane, like Catalina, maybe a scout plane deployed off a japanese battleship… maybe Midway or Battle for New Guinea. Sure. Then again, I want other theatres finished first.
3. P-47 had a radial engine. I don’t need to open up books — been reading them for 30+ years. The aircraft are not that different. Maybe the older ones in Malaysia, that fought the japanese, like the Fokkers, because they were hopelessly outdated. But otherwise — no.
4. Yes, not because it was “meant to be designed that way”, but because of material shortages and lack of fuel, hence one of the reasons war started is because US stopped shipping fuel to Japan and they had to expand. Bulk of Zeroes fought P-40s and I-16s in the 30s, it wasn’t much different. Then think Finnish theatre with “light radial” Buffalos, Gladiators. Finns had other lighter aircraft too, like Mörko Morane. That means that theatre almost or fully fits your description of what makes PTO special.
5. I said variety is nice and ED is doing in my view way too much to please the Western side of the playerbase, it’s gonna bite them on the ass eventually (like that time when DCS was on the news because of a certain information leak). However, if you really want to believe that devs would listen to fans, especially seeing how they got their hands on limited equipment (that they can digitise) and resources, you are dellusional. Of course they’re gonna say “Oh yeah we are so excited/on it/out top priority!”. This has always been the case.

Also, making a map with oceans and maybe like three islands, like Midway, isn’t gonna take much resources, to be the devil’s advocate here. Neither is things like Zero, that had virtually the most basic equipment. I don’t have deep hatred for PTO, I just have flashbacks from nearly falling asleep in the Dauntless in IL-2 where missions took HOURS, and all you saw was 50 shades of blue.

And who am I kidding? I am a completionist, so of course I would buy all those DLC up, but like I said — not my idea of sim fun.

In fact, I would rather see IL-2 do the theatre, as they have the whole WW2 theme, and are not spanning across multiple timeframes.

[Vanhala]

Sorry to interrupt but Mörkö Morane wasn't exactly light airplane (unlike Reisen which was very light): neither was the Buffalo. Common misconception. What made Finnish aerial combats special was the wide variety of outdated planes we fought with. Fokker D.XXI and Brewster B-239 were both outdated when we used them, yet they played the key role in our air defenses.

I highly recommend checking how many types of combat aircraft we had. At one point I recall the number was 17 different aircraft types in service simultaneously.

[The Cunning Fox (raZoleg)]

I am (very slowly) reading a book about Lentolaivue 24.

https://www.amazon.com/Lentolaivue-24-Osprey-Aviation-Elite/dp/1841762628

I believe that Morane was as light fighter as it only had pretty much MGs for armament. The cannon had just 60 rounds. Buffalo had just 4 50 cals, light armament, even though the Finnish version was upgraded to have more armour. Gladiator was pretty much a light biplane by 1940's. Then you've had Hurricanes MK I and Fiats with MGs.

Anyway, I'm not trying to derail the thread, but the theatres are similar. You even have the naval warfare.

[Gryper]

P-38, P-40, F4Us, SBDs, Kates, Vals, etc. hell yeah.

[sparc]

yeah id love to see a pacific theater. war thunder is too cheesy pun intended.