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Bir çeviri sorunu bildirin
Tartışma Kuralları ve Yönergeleri
Bu iletiyi bildir
https://flightsimcontrols.com/product/gladiator-nxt-fast-restock/
If you are considering a Warthog then you should definitely first check out the VKB gunfighter range and Virpil range.
VKB Europe
https://flightsimcontrols.com/
Virpil English
https://virpil-controls.eu/
I want to clarify a few things that perhaps I didn't state very well and might have been lost in the text I wrote. The first is that the T.16000 FCS setup isn't bad. I did mention that a few times throughout but I make a strong distinction between "entry level" and "bad". If you really only have the money to get something in that specific price-point, it is a good setup to go with and won't really put you at any game-breaking disadvantage. You can certainly get by with it even if it will present some issues due to its basic design.
The next thing I want to clarify is the purpose behind my guitar comparison. It is true that when you are looking at two guitars of the exact same make and model, they may be a bit different. Obviously there are some other variables at play like how well a guitar store maintains its stock but even with all that, if you were to play a few guitars of the exact same make and model at a store, you won't find any differences in functionality or features. That last part is important and cuts to the reason I use the comparison. If you were to compare the features of a $200 to $300 Squier Strat and a $1700 Fender American Professional Strat, the differences would be pretty obvious. Some will reply to that with "Well, I upgraded my Squier so much that it is actually better than even a Custom Shop Stratocaster!" and to be blunt, my reply would always be "I doubt it". There are very real, technical, objective differences between different models of guitars in a given brand and the cheaper options are cheaper for a reason.
Perhaps it would be more useful to use guitar amplifiers as a point of comparison. If you were to buy a cheap practice amp with a 8" speaker, it is what it is. You will get a pretty mediocre amplifier that is meant to largely be disposable when you do get around to upgrading to something better. You will seldom see anyone play a gig with the aforementioned cheap practice amp and you are even less likely to see semi-experienced players use one at home if they can afford something better. That is kinda where the T.16000 FCS kinda sits. It is great for beginners who don't want to invest a ton into the hobby early on but care should be taken before making that choice. Sometimes it is better to get a setup that you can grow into from the beginning and be done with it.
That last part kinda is where my guitar comparison comes in. I would have loved to have a more experienced guitarist have a serious talk with my teenage self about buying gear and that it sometimes isn't the best idea to buy a bunch of "affordable", "just as good" guitars and to simply do what you need to do to get what you wanted in the first place. If I had gone straight to the American Stratocaster and a Fender tube amp early on, I would have saved myself a lot of money on stuff that I tried to convince myself was "just as good" even when it clearly wasn't.
This is why I tend to suggest different setups for people with different financial situations. I feel that the "beginner setup" is a flexible term that doesn't always match up with what I personally prefer or what I personally use. Some people are in a place where a T.16000 FCS setup is fine. It won't be perfect but it is the best they are going to get while still being financially responsible about the purchase. For others, the better beginner setup would be a Warthog because they can afford it and want the best "bang for the buck" early in the process. It is the same reason I will tell some beginners to get a Squier guitar while suggesting a American Fender to others. It really depends on their individual situation.
Now, I will reiterate one thing that does need to be said about the T.16000 FCS. It is a good entry level setup but in all honesty, the stick design is awful for HOTAS setups. All Thrustmaster did was design a inexpensive throttle and package it with a existing stand-alone entry level stick. Since the stick was originally just sold on its own, it is designed to be like all other entry level sticks. It has a single hat switch (not really acceptable for a modern HOTAS to be blunt) and a lot of its buttons on its base (which kinda contradicts the whole HOTAS concept on a deep level). Again. It isn't "bad" in the objective sense but for the beginner with a flexible budget to work with, there are better options that you won't need to replace as you desire more functionality.
I'm still using my X45 actually. I did just order a TWCS throttle however (they just came back in stock at one store - Staples) and plan on getting a Warthog stick, if it ever comes back in stock at a reasonable price. Rod White (has a channel) says he uses this setup (TWCS & Warthog) and really likes it.
I'll wait and see how this setup works first as I really like the X45 stick (other than the reaching required for the hats). The throttle however doesn't have enough usable switches for the A10C. I also have the TFRP pedals that will plug into the throttle now. Man I'm glad I bought those things 6 months ago before COVID and MSFS jacked the price of everything up.
I've seen that T16000m pack (with the pedals) as low as $210 CAD ($159 USD) around Xmas time, although that was in normal times. The pedals are worth it if you fly helicopters, but I also find them very nice in IL2.
Now that Gladiator stick is an intriguing option. I usually avoid those sites because they are more than double the price of even a Warthog by the time they get to me. The Gunfighter III for example would cost me around $700 CAD. This one would cost me less than $300 CDN for the premium, which is about the best price I've seen a Warthog go for.
Has anyone here actually used this stick? Are the sensors as good or better than the Warthog? Is the Premium version worth the extra cost (extra $40)?
Very good post.
Basically the exact reason you see so many good reviews of the T.Flight Hotas X/One/4... objectively it's the worst quality mainstream HOTAS on the market -for various reasons-, with it's only redeeming quality being it's cheap as dirt. But many people who praise it have literally never handled anything else.
I like the Thrustmaster FCS HOTAS for the simple fact it gives people a lower cost, complete kit entry that isn't actually complete garbage. But 100% people should be under no illusions of its shortcomings.
Thrustmaster is happy to re-brand sticks. The new Airbus unit that's getting all kinds of praise is literally a T16000m with a slightly different stick.
Why? A good HOTAS shouldn't break under normal usage. If you break it I would think it's pretty clear indication that your normal usage requires something a little more robust.
The short answer is yes, VKB and Virpil sticks (and some of the other high end brands) are better than the thrustmaster and logitech stuff in my exprerience. They are quality sticks, and bases. And on top of that, the bases are very customizable, with different cams, springs, extensions, etc. VKB is also very programmable, you can make it do a lot of things, have buttons have multiple functions in combination with other button presses etc. etc.
VKB are also planning add-ons (that also work for the NXT) with switch panels, throttles etc. And not too expensive, $50-$70 range (they are also releasing a new fighter jet throttle, somewhere late this year/early next year). VKB also has a North American website/webshop. If you order it from there, with shipping/import tax, you're probably looking at 250-300 CAD for the NXT.
I bought my gladiator from a Canadian retailer (which was a little cheaper), but they seem to be out of business.
Personal note; the previous gladiator was more limited than the current one, but as I began to do some serious flying, I moved to a gunfighter setup. So I could have saved myself the money of the gladiator in hindsight. The gunfighter is better, and more modular, although it seems they have addressed these issues with the NXT. However, if you plan on doing lot of flying, and especially if you plan on building a setup, I'd recommend the gunfighter, simply because it is still going to be more modular/versatile for different setups.
VKB also have adapters for the thrustmaster sticks (which you buy separately $$$ from thrustmaster), so you can use the A-10, F-16C and F-18 stick on a VKB base. The adapter is another $40 I think.
But all in all, flight simming is an expensive hobby.
I have one. I am pretty happy. Did not break the bank. Feels solid. Can be upgraded with a throttle and pedals if you so wish. Cant go wrong. And the sensors will last a long time. I cover mine with the plastic bag in came in when i am not playing to stop it from getting dusty.
Would you buy your own child who has never played guitar a Gibson SG as their first guitar?
Its only a few thousand dollars but gives them a real guitar as opposed to an epiphone knock off.
A week later your child decides that they dont want to play guitar at all but wants to play soccer instead and asks for the full nike kit.
Get the idea?
The T16000m HOTAS FCS is fine, as you said, and it has its place in the hierarchy of sticks. If they want to upgrade later. They can. I may. I may not. If anything i am going to get the throttle first but i doubt ill get the pedals.
Well, the type of first guitar I would get for my hypothetical child would really depend on the situation. As I said before, it isn't so much that everyone should get the most expensive thing first. It is that there are going to be people who actually benefit from doing so early on while others may not. If I were to buy my hypothetical child a Gibson as their first guitar, I wouldn't sweat it too much since they tend to hold their value pretty well and if said child were to lose interest, I would be able to either keep it myself or sell it without losing too much in the process.
At the same time, It really is important to understand that not every beginner (in any given hobby) is the same. Some new guitarists benefit from starting with better instruments and equipment because they get more freedom to get what they really want from the start as opposed to getting a $250 starter kit that they outgrow in less than six months and then becomes wasted money that could have been spent on something better from the start.
Also, I never insinuated that Epiphones are "knock-offs" in a dismissive fashion. There are certainly bottom of the barrel models in that brand (the $150 to $250 stuff) but they are not inherently bad guitars. You are just getting what you pay for and acknowledging that shouldn't be a bad thing.
As far as your T16000m goes, I am glad you are happy with it. I suspect that it will serve you well until you eventually upgrade. That being said, if this is your first HOTAS setup, I think you will find that as you get some experience with other models, you might not see the T16000m as the bang for the buck some make it out to be. It is fine. It is adequate for its purpose as a entry level HOTAS but Thrustmaster has been lazy with its entry level stuff for a long time now (the HOTAS-X being a perfect example) and they could have done better while still keeping in that price point. That is my big beef with the T16000m. For the price they are charging, the stick should be a HOTAS specific design and not just their entry level stand-alone stick repackaged with some other stuff. The throttle is generally fine and the pedals are fine but that stick really should have been a purpose built thing with HOTAS features.
I've used all kinds of setups over the years from Thrustmaster FCS/WCS Mark I, FLCS, F-22 Pro, CH Fighterstick Pro, CH Pro Throttle, CH Pro Pedals, Thrustmaster Warthog, and Virpil MongoosT-50CMv3. This isn't even all of them, as Saitek/Logitech is in there somewhere, but I can't remember the names.
I can tell you right now that I never knew what I was missing before owning better equipment or having all the controls needed. I flew for the longest time without rudder pedals thinking why do I need these, now I can't go back. Did the same thing concerning track IR, also can't go back. There's no way I could go back to the Warthog throttle after using the Virpil, etc...
Here's the thing, ignorance is bliss, and you really aren't going to know what you're missing if you've never experienced it, so you're likely to be happy with your entry level purchase right up until you experience something better.
The full FCS system will have everything that's needed in terms of controls for about 150 bucks compared to the Warthog which will cost 500 maybe 450 at discount + 100 / 150 bucks for additonal rudder pedals. So that's 150 vs. +600 bucks. You could buy VR or TrackIR instead of going for a max quality setup. And there's nothing you can do with a warthog setup that I can't do with my FCS setup. So if money is a factor, which the OP clearly stated, then there's no sense in talking about high-end market products tbh.
And about guitars... just because you buy a Gibson instead of an Epiphone doesn't mean it will make you sound better. So many factors that manipulate the sound of a guitar, first of all the skills of the player. Having a Gibson vs. an Epiphone will not guarantee you a better sound. As this is always very subjective. Also there's so many ways to manipulate the sound if you really know what you're doing you can even make a LP sound like a Strat and vise versa. So imo this example is completely going a different way than talking about a hotas. There's also not that much stuff on the market so the range of options is pretty comprehensible. If you have the money then sure go for Vipril or Warthog, but if not take the FCS. What else needs to be said?
If I were looking for an entry level stick having the knowledge I have today I wouldn't go with the T.16000M. Now a days I look for more than just functionality (which it doesn't have enough), but ease of use, and comfort among other things, so I'd be looking at the VKB GNX and its expandable modules.
Again. I will reiterate in advance that the T16000 FCS is fine. It is a good entry level solution for those that want a adequate setup to start out with. That being said, I have used a bunch of different HOTAS setups (going from entry level to my current setup) and to be honest, for casual flight where you are not routinely getting into high-precision stuff, just about any entry level HOTAS will do okay. The moment you start reaching that point where you are routinely doing air to air refueling, formation flight, and even carrier landing, having a good throttle becomes VERY useful.
Interestingly enough, pretty much everyone in my DCS group started with a T16000 FCS setup and all of them were VERY happy when they upgraded to other setups. Again. I am not saying it is bad. I am saying that it is a entry level setup that gives you entry level results. That is fine but I wouldn't be so quick to say that it does everything until you sample some other setups and get a feel for what other setups provide or don't provide.
As far as the guitar stuff, I think we run into a similar problem. I have owned a lot of guitars and have put a lot of time into learning how to get different sounds with different setups. One thing I learned is that the whole "you can make a Les Paul sound like a Strat" only works when you don't have a lot of experience with either. It is true that you can install a coil tap control on a Les Paul to KINDA make the humbuckers sound like single coils but even then, their basic arrangement makes getting the sounds of a Strat pretty much impossible. It is good enough for bar gigs and the like but there are reasons Strats sound like Strats and Les Pauls sound like Les Pauls. It isn't just "marketing mumbo jumbo" as some online guitar pundits like to say. There are key technical differences that can't easily be overcome without serious modification.
As far as player skill goes, this gets into the whole "tone is in the fingers" thing and to be honest, that line is nonsense. I know it feels good to believe but it is silly when you actually stop and think about it. If I were to go to your place with my setup and we were to swap them temporarily, I would PLAY like me but I would SOUND like I was playing through your setup. Likewise, you will PLAY like you but you will SOUND like you are playing through my setup. My fingers can't magically make my Egnater and my PRS sound like my Deluxe Reverb and my Strat. They are entirely different setups with entirely different basic sounds.
I also don't think I have been very precise about my guitar example. My main intention was to point out that some guitars can do certain things that others can't. Likewise. Some amplifiers can do certain sounds that other amplifiers can't. It isn't about one being "better" but more about the construction, features, and other elements that make one model different from another. No guitarist can make a 15 watt solid state amplifier with a 8" speaker sound like a Deluxe Reverb. It is simply impossible on a basic, technical level.