DCS World Steam Edition

DCS World Steam Edition

is this SUPPOSED to be impossible?
Seriously - is DCS **supposed** to be impossible? Or am I just not able to set up my HOTAS in any way that makes it possible **not** to crash whatever plane you're flying within the first few minutes...

Seriously, DCS really reminds me of F-16 Falcon 3.0 on the old commodore amiga - if you tried to copy the original disks, that is. Instant frustration right after take-off.

And I'm **not** new to computer based flight sims, my fave is doing the alps valley speed run on FlightGear (take a F16 from LOWZ, only two rules: stay below the mountain peaks and the afterburner stays ON), but in DCS I fly like a tossed brick - not at all.
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Showing 1-15 of 43 comments
fikmeinshizer Oct 25, 2019 @ 12:34pm 
Set your bindings first then make sure you adjust the curves you'll find it easier. If you need examples try the ED forums, they tend to have more in depth stuff.

Personally I find it easier to go through the tutorials mapping things as I go so I know where everything is
Lance Corrimal Oct 25, 2019 @ 12:37pm 
...everything. well, basically, the controls. flying anyting in DCS feels as if there's something that is constantly adding +/- 50% variance on all axes of my controller. Unstable as f*ck.

1. it's a decent controller (Saitek X56 HOTAS)
2. it does not do that in *any* other game - Elite: Dangerous, War Thunder (both linux and windows), Flight Gear, Project Wingman, you name them, it flies like richthofen himself, just not in DCS.
Maki Nishikino Oct 25, 2019 @ 12:40pm 
Sorry, deleted my post as the other poster made a good point.
Last edited by Maki Nishikino; Oct 25, 2019 @ 12:40pm
heartc Oct 25, 2019 @ 12:41pm 
You need to learn how to trim, probably. None of the other games you mention have anything near realistic flightmodels, including FlightGear when it comes to most military jets modelled there. The only mil jets that I found to be somewhat realistic in FlightGear are the Viggen, F-15 and Tomcat.
Troll Norris Oct 25, 2019 @ 1:06pm 
https://youtu.be/nIXdazooP30

And what was written. The real aircrafts does not fly straight. You have to balance them first by trim. The older aircrafts have no safety limiters or attitude holders so they will let you die/suicide if you do something wrong. E.G. if you excced the safe AoA on take off.
Last edited by Troll Norris; Oct 25, 2019 @ 1:14pm
startrekmike Oct 25, 2019 @ 1:38pm 
Originally posted by Lance Corrimal:
...everything. well, basically, the controls. flying anyting in DCS feels as if there's something that is constantly adding +/- 50% variance on all axes of my controller. Unstable as f*ck.

1. it's a decent controller (Saitek X56 HOTAS)
2. it does not do that in *any* other game - Elite: Dangerous, War Thunder (both linux and windows), Flight Gear, Project Wingman, you name them, it flies like richthofen himself, just not in DCS.

There is no real magic bullet answer. In games like Elite, War Thunder, or others that you listed, the flight dynamics are very, very forgiving and don't really require a lot of real world concerns like trim, good stick/throttle discipline, etc. The skills you learned from those games are not going to translate very well to something like DCS.

My suggestion. Start from scratch. Don't go into DCS thinking that it will be like War Thunder or something like that. Instead, just learn what it requires of you as a player and embrace that learning process as a key part of the experience.

It might help to lean HEAVILY on the manual that comes with a given module for this kind of thing. Take it one step at a time.

The big thing to keep in mind is that aircraft are not always inherently stable. You will need to trim as speed changes and you will need to understand proper flying techniques in order to not have mishaps. Understanding those techniques and applying them is one of the more interesting aspects of DCS. The same goes for systems, avionics, sensors, and weapons. Don't approach them with a mindset like "why are they harder than War Thunder or Elite?" and instead just learn them one step at a time and embrace that learning process.
Troll Norris Oct 25, 2019 @ 1:53pm 
Originally posted by startrekmike:
The big thing to keep in mind is that aircraft are not always inherently stable.

This is quite important specially for the modern ones. The modern fighter jets are intentionally made very unstable that lets them do very excessive maneuvers. This is achieved by turning the center of gravity very close or behind the center of lift. Those control surfaces are not controlled directy. But by computers. Because the human is not possible to keep the aircraft stable, the computer has to do it. So the stick input goes first to computer which will adjust the surfaces to wanted position. This system is called Fly-by-wire (FBW). The older aircrafts does not have this system (Just like the SU-25T) and the flight control surfaces are directly connected to controller. Fortunately the SU-25T is the very stable aircraft. Once you trim it properly. you can leave it hands-off and it will fly straight for long time. But mind the weight of aircraft is changing due to losing fuel. Also the center of gravity is changing. So you have to keep it balancing constantly. For balancing the aircraft the secondary flight controllers are used. Those are the flaps, pitch trim, roll trim and the yaw trim. You may use the primary flight controller (The stick), but it is very uncomfortable. Specially in aircrafts without hydraulic power boosters. Because the air moving around is forcing surfaces to move back to the neutral position. The faster you fly or the higher flight surfaces deflection is, the more force you have to apply. But the trim is just used to overcome those forces. You set it once and don't have to fight with forces anymore. Also mind in the DCS is simulated the pilot is able to push 30kgf. So E.G. in P-51D when you are too fast in dive, you won't be able to pull the stick. You will need to use the trim to level off the aircraft.

This is just the peak of flight dynamics iceberg. There are hundreds factors those coul'd be described in a veeeeeeeeeeeery long article.
Last edited by Troll Norris; Oct 25, 2019 @ 2:05pm
heartc Oct 25, 2019 @ 2:59pm 
Originally posted by Troll Norris:
Originally posted by startrekmike:
The big thing to keep in mind is that aircraft are not always inherently stable.

This is quite important specially for the modern ones. The modern fighter jets are intentionally made very unstable that lets them do very excessive maneuvers.

It should be said though in this context that those - as you said, modern - fighter aircraft that are built intentionally aerodynamically unstable are only those who also feature an actual, computerized fly-by-wire system, and as such do not really need trim. They still have trim available in some cases, but you are not going to have to manually trim them in most situations. Thus, this is not the problem the OP is having.

Those that need manual trimming are the older ones and up to 4th gen Fighters, that have either no flight augmentation system or only an analog one, and they were built aerodynamically stable. The ones that are not, are really only 5th generation fighters such as the Eurofighter and Rafale, but you won't notice them as being aerodynamically unstable because the computer(s) are constantly moving the control surfaces to keep them flying as if they were aerodynamically stable - only that you will be able to make some impressive high alpha moves or high Gs through a huge part of the flight envelope etc. that you would not be able to do with an aerodynamically stable plane. But, as I said, these are the ones who at the same time don't really need manual trim and as such don't really fit the problem the OP is having.

The F-16 is a bit of a mixture - it is still aerodynamically stable afaik, but at the same time features a computerized FBW system, which should also take care of trimming the aircraft. The F-117, on the other hand - and while still a 4th gen a/c - is aerodynamically unstable and would be uncontrollable without its computerized FBW keeping the plane in balance.
Last edited by heartc; Oct 25, 2019 @ 3:01pm
Havish Oct 25, 2019 @ 3:11pm 
What aircraft(s) are you flying, anyway?
peepeepoopoo man Oct 25, 2019 @ 4:27pm 
Have you tried checking/tuning your axis? make sure there's no double binds I have an X56 too and some times it maps multiple analogue sticks to the same axis resulting in my plane looking like its having a seizure.
Troll Norris Oct 26, 2019 @ 12:37am 
https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198025614872/recommended/223750/
I don't really know what to say... this game has the potential to be awesome, but I can't imagine that jets in real life are this hard to fly - no nation would have any kind of airforce...

It is not hard to fly if you know how to do that. Feel free to ask someone for help. The community is friendly and willing to help you. Join someone via Discord or Teamspeak.

Because if you know how, the very bad weather landing looks like it is easy peasy:
https://youtu.be/Cuyi5cnKxm0
Last edited by Troll Norris; Oct 26, 2019 @ 12:52am
bignewy  [developer] Oct 26, 2019 @ 1:09am 
Our flaming cliffs range of aircraft are a good starting point for beginners, you can also use game flight and game avionics to make things much easier.

Our full study aircraft are as a real aircraft would be, this is very much a study sim at this level and can be challenging to learn. Some find that part of the appeal.
You can still use game flight and game avionics.

We have a forum here for help
https://forums.eagle.ru/index.php

youtube is a great source for guides and tutorials also.

I would also recommend joining a squadron or flying with friends, it is much easier to learn with friends.

Hope that helps

Lance Corrimal Oct 26, 2019 @ 5:13am 
Originally posted by Sukhoi-kun:
Have you tried checking/tuning your axis? make sure there's no double binds I have an X56 too and some times it maps multiple analogue sticks to the same axis resulting in my plane looking like its having a seizure.

now we're actually getting somewhere other than just "learn, bub"... I have a 3d connexion space explorer connected to my computer as well, that I can't easily disconnect without getting on my hands and knees under my desk - could that be the issue? It maps as a 6 axis 6DOF device...

Should I go through all the controls of all the planes and make sure that nothing's mapped onto that device?
Lance Corrimal Oct 26, 2019 @ 5:15am 
Originally posted by Havish:
What aircraft(s) are you flying, anyway?

I'm usually trying the first "power up and take off" training with either the frogfoot from the main game or the flanker from the flamings cliffs addon, and throw my hands up in disgust after not even being able to taxi onto the runway in some cases o.0
startrekmike Oct 26, 2019 @ 5:42am 
Originally posted by Lance Corrimal:
Originally posted by Sukhoi-kun:
Have you tried checking/tuning your axis? make sure there's no double binds I have an X56 too and some times it maps multiple analogue sticks to the same axis resulting in my plane looking like its having a seizure.

now we're actually getting somewhere other than just "learn, bub"... I have a 3d connexion space explorer connected to my computer as well, that I can't easily disconnect without getting on my hands and knees under my desk - could that be the issue? It maps as a 6 axis 6DOF device...

Should I go through all the controls of all the planes and make sure that nothing's mapped onto that device?


It is generally a good rule of thumb (with only very few exceptions and only with certain conditions) to pretty much disregard default mappings and completely redo it yourself. This is ESPECIALLY the case when you have multiple devices/peripherals connected.

For example. I have a TM Warthog HOTAS, a Saitek X56 throttle, and my rudder pedals connected at any given time. Whenever I get a new module, it is not unusual to see DCS automatically bind stuff to my pedals or even my Saitek throttle in odd, undesirable ways.

This even goes beyond axis bindings. It is a good idea to completely wipe the default bindings on all your peripherals (except keyboard and TrackIR when applicable) and start from scratch. It is easy to place blame on Eagle Dynamics for this with lines like "why can't they just set it up so it binds properly!" but in reality, there are so many devices and combinations of devices that could be used that such a task is outright impossible.

When it comes to actually binding controls and knowing what is important to bind, that information can be generally found in the manuals that come with modules. Usually there is a diagram showing the real throttle/stick. You can use this to see what you should focus on binding to your own stick/throttle without a whole lot of trouble. Likewise, you can use Chuck's guides for similar information. Another thing to keep in mind is that some modules include sub-categories like "HOTAS" in the controls menu and in those cases, it is a good idea to bind EVERYTHING in that sub-category.

Beyond that, you get into the learning curve that one should reasonably expect from a flight sim.
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Date Posted: Oct 25, 2019 @ 12:28pm
Posts: 43