Can't make the mage apprentices essential for some reason

[Sola Fide]

Since I don't like followers to go dying on me, I went into the construction set to make all 10 IDs of mage apprentices essential. Yet when I test it in-game, they are not essential.

Making my frostcrag fire atronach essential worked perfectly but not mage apprentices for some reason.

[Lobo de hielo]

Maybe something to do with using the reference and not the base object.

see here - https://forums.nexusmods.com/topic/6343506-make-an-npc-become-essential-during-a-quest/

There also used to be a mod for it, but quite old.

https://www.nexusmods.com/oblivion/mods/20509?tab=description

I did notice it had a forum post from this month, from someone who has just used it.

[un sac rouge]

Originally posted by Sola Fide:

Since I don't like followers to go dying on me, I went into the construction set to make all 10 IDs of mage apprentices essential. Yet when I test it in-game, they are not essential.

Making my frostcrag fire atronach essential worked perfectly but not mage apprentices for some reason.

Have you unchecked the 'Respawn' box? I can't test myself because I'm not Arch-Mage in my game but looking at the NPCs in the CS I can see they are all set to respawn and only one can work so it's possible respawn is overriding essential. They all have the same script and I can't see anything that would prevent the essential flag from working.

[WhateverWorks]

There is a console command you can use to make a target essential. I think you just open the console, click the target, and then it's "setessential 1" but not 100%

[Wai]

In the CS, you can make your own unique mage apprentice using duplicate, Then use the unique flag to make that one essential.

Using the console, the command is:
set essential <base ID> 1

[un sac rouge]

Originally posted by Wai:

In the CS, you can make your own unique mage apprentice using duplicate, Then use the unique flag to make that one essential.

Using the console, the command is:
set essential <base ID> 1

The duplicate will be a copy of the base ID so will have the same problem. I've managed to find a fix after some testing but still can't work out why the mages are hardcoded to ignore the essential flag in the CS. A small edit to the script assigned to the NPC makes them essential when they become a follower.

The screenshots show the single line that needs to be added and the list of base IDs. In this example 0006AAAe is the base ID for mage 9. Just replace the base ID in the other scripts with the base ID that corresponds to that NPC.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3744249161

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3744248723
In the NPC editor next to the name of the script are 3 dots. Click on them to open the script for editing. Place the single line in and then click on the disk icon to compile it, save and exit. When you ask a mage to become your follower they will become essential and have the crown icon.

[Wai]

Originally posted by un sac rouge:

The duplicate will be a copy of the base ID so will have the same problem.

If you duplicate an object (like a weapon, armor, or NPC), you should Always, by default, assign it a unique Editor ID (start with a letter, never a number) so it doesn't overwrite the original base item ID. Once you have a unique version you can alter it anyway you wish and it will not affect it's parent item.
The tool is already available you do not need a workaround.

[un sac rouge]

Originally posted by Wai:

Originally posted by un sac rouge:

The duplicate will be a copy of the base ID so will have the same problem.

If you duplicate an object (like a weapon, armor, or NPC), you should Always, by default, assign it a unique Editor ID (start with a letter, never a number) so it doesn't overwrite the original base item ID. Once you have a unique version you can alter it anyway you wish and it will not affect it's parent item.
The tool is already available you do not need a workaround.

The issue here is that this group of NPCs are hardcoded in some way to ignore the essential flag in the CS which is unusual and probably tied to a quest stage that is still active and overrides anything in the CS to prevent it from breaking quests. Before suggesting a duplicate NPC you should test this yourself in the CS so people don't waste time duplicating an NPC to discover it still isn't going to work.

Duplicating one of the mages as you suggest does indeed work and the duplicate mage does become essential but unfortunately you also have to remove their script and AI packages which prevents the dialogue from working so there is no way of asking them to join you. At that point you might as well use a companion mod, use the touch spell mod suggested in this thread which I've tested and makes the mages essential or add a SINGLE line of text to the 'existing' script for an 'existing' NPC that I have also tested as working but you keep believing your duplicate NPC idea that you never even tested and doesn't work is the most suitable.

On the subject of references - when creating a duplicate it needs a unique name so it doesn't overwrite the original file which goes without saying but that duplicate ID is not the same as the reference editor ID which is created separately and required for scripting. A simple example would be the enable/disable command which only works with a reference editor ID.

SCN aaJAMNPC104Death

Begin OnDeath

aaJAMNPC101REF.enable

endif
end

In the above example aaJAMNPC101 is the base ID and aaJAMNPC101REF is the reference editor ID. This script would not complie if the base ID is used and will only work with a reference editor ID. The reference editor ID can be anything but keeping the base ID name with REF on the end is by far the most sensible approach to scripting.

In other words, a duplicate is created without a reference editor ID which is required for more advanced scripting and can catch people out who do not understand why they are getting a scripting error.

[Sola Fide]

Originally posted by un sac rouge:

Originally posted by Wai:

In the CS, you can make your own unique mage apprentice using duplicate, Then use the unique flag to make that one essential.

Using the console, the command is:
set essential <base ID> 1

The duplicate will be a copy of the base ID so will have the same problem. I've managed to find a fix after some testing but still can't work out why the mages are hardcoded to ignore the essential flag in the CS. A small edit to the script assigned to the NPC makes them essential when they become a follower.

The screenshots show the single line that needs to be added and the list of base IDs. In this example 0006AAAe is the base ID for mage 9. Just replace the base ID in the other scripts with the base ID that corresponds to that NPC.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3744249161

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3744248723
In the NPC editor next to the name of the script are 3 dots. Click on them to open the script for editing. Place the single line in and then click on the disk icon to compile it, save and exit. When you ask a mage to become your follower they will become essential and have the crown icon.

This method worked for every apprentice except for the female breton with black hair. I have no idea why it didn't work for her but it's fine really since I can bring any of the others in her stead.

Thanks.

Also, I suppose this can work for Mazoga the Orc as well? It should be the same thing.

[Wai]

Originally posted by un sac rouge:

Originally posted by Wai:

If you duplicate an object (like a weapon, armor, or NPC), you should Always, by default, assign it a unique Editor ID (start with a letter, never a number) so it doesn't overwrite the original base item ID. Once you have a unique version you can alter it anyway you wish and it will not affect it's parent item.
The tool is already available you do not need a workaround.

The issue here is that this group of NPCs are hardcoded in some way to ignore the essential flag in the CS which is unusual and probably tied to a quest stage that is still active and overrides anything in the CS to prevent it from breaking quests. Before suggesting a duplicate NPC you should test this yourself in the CS so people don't waste time duplicating an NPC to discover it still isn't going to work.

Duplicating one of the mages as you suggest does indeed work and the duplicate mage does become essential but unfortunately you also have to remove their script and AI packages which prevents the dialogue from working so there is no way of asking them to join you. At that point you might as well use a companion mod, use the touch spell mod suggested in this thread which I've tested and makes the mages essential or add a SINGLE line of text to the 'existing' script for an 'existing' NPC that I have also tested as working but you keep believing your duplicate NPC idea that you never even tested and doesn't work is the most suitable.

On the subject of references - when creating a duplicate it needs a unique name so it doesn't overwrite the original file which goes without saying but that duplicate IDis not the same as the reference editor ID which is created separately and required for scripting. A simple example would be the enable/disable command which only works with a reference editor ID.

SCN aaJAMNPC104Death

Begin OnDeath

aaJAMNPC101REF.enable

endif
end

In the above example aaJAMNPC10 is the base ID and aaJAMNPC10REF is the reference editor ID. This script would not complie if the base ID is used and will only work with a reference editor ID. The reference editor ID can be anything but keeping the base ID name with REF on the end is by far the most sensible approach to scripting.

In other words, a duplicate is created without a reference editor ID which is required for more advanced scripting and can catch people out who do not understand why they are getting a scripting error.

I do not have time or any interest in arguing with you. I took it that the need to actually turn the clone into a follower as well as making it essential and giving it it's own unique script went, for someone who understands the CS, without saying. I did not think you would appreciate or need detailed step by step instruction. I have too much to do to waste time giving detailed instructions which should be superfluous.

[un sac rouge]

Originally posted by Wai:

Originally posted by un sac rouge:

The issue here is that this group of NPCs are hardcoded in some way to ignore the essential flag in the CS which is unusual and probably tied to a quest stage that is still active and overrides anything in the CS to prevent it from breaking quests. Before suggesting a duplicate NPC you should test this yourself in the CS so people don't waste time duplicating an NPC to discover it still isn't going to work.

Duplicating one of the mages as you suggest does indeed work and the duplicate mage does become essential but unfortunately you also have to remove their script and AI packages which prevents the dialogue from working so there is no way of asking them to join you. At that point you might as well use a companion mod, use the touch spell mod suggested in this thread which I've tested and makes the mages essential or add a SINGLE line of text to the 'existing' script for an 'existing' NPC that I have also tested as working but you keep believing your duplicate NPC idea that you never even tested and doesn't work is the most suitable.

On the subject of references - when creating a duplicate it needs a unique name so it doesn't overwrite the original file which goes without saying but that duplicate IDis not the same as the reference editor ID which is created separately and required for scripting. A simple example would be the enable/disable command which only works with a reference editor ID.

SCN aaJAMNPC104Death

Begin OnDeath

aaJAMNPC101REF.enable

endif
end

In the above example aaJAMNPC10 is the base ID and aaJAMNPC10REF is the reference editor ID. This script would not complie if the base ID is used and will only work with a reference editor ID. The reference editor ID can be anything but keeping the base ID name with REF on the end is by far the most sensible approach to scripting.

In other words, a duplicate is created without a reference editor ID which is required for more advanced scripting and can catch people out who do not understand why they are getting a scripting error.

I do not have time or any interest in arguing with you. I took it that the need to actually turn the clone into a follower as well as making it essential and giving it it's own unique script went, for someone who understands the CS, without saying. I did not think you would appreciate or need detailed step by step instruction. I have too much to do to waste time giving detailed instructions which should be superfluous.

I'm not arguing with you I'm correcting you and I don't need you to explain step by step anything. I could cut out the middleman and just use Google AI.Kelly Ripa

When you make suggestions that do not take in to account the specific issue and without even bothering to test it I'm going to mention it so hopefully other people realise you don't know what you're talking about and you throw out suggestions copied from a screen without first trying it yourself or knowing how to assist if they need more specific instruction. When someone calls you out on something your immediate response is exactly what you just posted. A lot of words about not having time to explain it to me which is a classic straw hat response with your unmistakable passive aggressive flair.

The clone method you have suggested would create a clone of the NPC that can be made essential but has lost the ability to become your follower so that's additional time to add the AI packages and dialogue. It's a lot more work than just cloning an NPC and something you should really be checking first before suggesting it. Also, you mention that the clone requires a unique script but this is inaccurate and further suggests you don't understand how the process works because an NPC is made a follower using dialogue attached to a quest stage and AI packages, not the script attached to an NPC.

[Wai]

Originally posted by un sac rouge:

Originally posted by Wai:

I do not have time or any interest in arguing with you. I took it that the need to actually turn the clone into a follower as well as making it essential and giving it it's own unique script went, for someone who understands the CS, without saying. I did not think you would appreciate or need detailed step by step instruction. I have too much to do to waste time giving detailed instructions which should be superfluous.

I'm not arguing with you I'm correcting you and I don't need you to explain step by step anything. I could cut out the middleman and just use Google AI.Kelly Ripa

When you make suggestions that do not take in to account the specific issue and without even bothering to test it I'm going to mention it so hopefully other people realise you don't know what you're talking about and you throw out suggestions copied from a screen without first trying it yourself or knowing how to assist if they need more specific instruction. When someone calls you out on something your immediate response is exactly what you just posted. A lot of words about not having time to explain it to me which is a classic straw hat response with your unmistakable passive aggressive flair.

The clone method you have suggested would create a clone of the NPC that can be made essential but has lost the ability to become your follower so that's additional time to add the AI packages and dialogue. It's a lot more work than just cloning an NPC and something you should really be checking first before suggesting it. Also, you mention that the clone requires a unique script but this is inaccurate and further suggests you don't understand how the process works because an NPC is made a follower using dialogue attached to a quest stage and AI packages, not the script attached to an NPC.

I have nothing more to say to you, it would be a waste of time. Afterall, I am only a programmer who currently has bigger fish to fry.

[un sac rouge]

Originally posted by Wai:

Originally posted by un sac rouge:

I'm not arguing with you I'm correcting you and I don't need you to explain step by step anything. I could cut out the middleman and just use Google AI.Kelly Ripa

When you make suggestions that do not take in to account the specific issue and without even bothering to test it I'm going to mention it so hopefully other people realise you don't know what you're talking about and you throw out suggestions copied from a screen without first trying it yourself or knowing how to assist if they need more specific instruction. When someone calls you out on something your immediate response is exactly what you just posted. A lot of words about not having time to explain it to me which is a classic straw hat response with your unmistakable passive aggressive flair.

The clone method you have suggested would create a clone of the NPC that can be made essential but has lost the ability to become your follower so that's additional time to add the AI packages and dialogue. It's a lot more work than just cloning an NPC and something you should really be checking first before suggesting it. Also, you mention that the clone requires a unique script but this is inaccurate and further suggests you don't understand how the process works because an NPC is made a follower using dialogue attached to a quest stage and AI packages, not the script attached to an NPC.

I have nothing more to say to you, it would be a waste of time. Afterall, I am only a programmer who currently has bigger fish to fry.

No worries. Enjoy your fish.

[un sac rouge]

Originally posted by Sola Fide:

Originally posted by un sac rouge:

The duplicate will be a copy of the base ID so will have the same problem. I've managed to find a fix after some testing but still can't work out why the mages are hardcoded to ignore the essential flag in the CS. A small edit to the script assigned to the NPC makes them essential when they become a follower.

The screenshots show the single line that needs to be added and the list of base IDs. In this example 0006AAAe is the base ID for mage 9. Just replace the base ID in the other scripts with the base ID that corresponds to that NPC.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3744249161

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3744248723
In the NPC editor next to the name of the script are 3 dots. Click on them to open the script for editing. Place the single line in and then click on the disk icon to compile it, save and exit. When you ask a mage to become your follower they will become essential and have the crown icon.

This method worked for every apprentice except for the female breton with black hair. I have no idea why it didn't work for her but it's fine really since I can bring any of the others in her stead.

Thanks.

Also, I suppose this can work for Mazoga the Orc as well? It should be the same thing.

I just noticed the female breton has the wrong script assigned to them so change it to the one above it which is ArcaneUApprentice1Script and add the line setessential 0006A833 1 to that one. Someone must have changed it from 1 to 2 by mistake and probably with the mouse wheel as they moved the curser over the box. A 20 year old bug that's lay dormant until now :D Someone needs to develop a padlock button next to a drop down menu so the selection can be locked in place and there's no risk of it being changed in error.

If the essential flag in the CS doesn't work for Mazoga the Orc adding the setessential line to the script should be ok because she isn't scripted to die so it shouldn't conflict with anything.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3745539456

[BENZ_PALADIN]

Nah!!,Setting essential on NPC may be good, However If your companions just go too strong to invulnerable, Would the game still be fun?
-Incase of mine, I just set her initial base level to 10 (by using "setlevel #" command) which automatic increasing her HP&SP (and some skills) to high enough to stay alive during the battle. She still be growth along with your MC as well.
-She still need your care to heal & buff her during the battle. I also doing this to other girl type ex. KoTN NPC 5( replaces of Sir Geimund). She is an expert of illusion, So adding some special illusion spell (Ex.aggressive "Calm") to freeze her enemies as well.
- If you not fast travel with them, they still use the old equipment, just fast travel alone,then use bat file to teleport them to you by ("ID".moveto 14)
- Even without essential flag,You can also make them nearly invincible by equipment or add ability spells to them such as 100% reflect damage,100% resist magic from eg.. unicorn ability(100% resist normal weapon)....etc.
(Note that,You can't modify some stat to "Respawnable type" NPC directly, Their stats will be replaced by their level after reload new game soon,However you can still be reedit your atronach familiar's stat, It's stat won't change by it's level after reload new game!!! )

Which follower play styles do you like?
1 I like "Musketeer rifle girls" style, Just giving them staves or bow and see how machine gun work!!!
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3747089376
2 Sometime, I divide my team at some Intersection by teleport my self to each team.
3 Flame Atronach the flash, this is my most reliable follower "No any mod" is need only right of your spell or equipment to buff and heal her(with some secret special tricks)
- dagger of friendship to heal her
- absorb mana&Fortify magicka 100 (3 sec) daggers this will change her to be "restore magicka potions" for you which lighter and cheaper.
- You can also do "permanent speed buff" to her at any altar of the nine.
- You can also do 120 sec buff with "aggressive" fortify Heal ,fortify magicka, resist frost + shock shield spell dagger combo with weakness to magic.(this is my secret special tricks)
Again,As I said at this point from above!!! "No any mod or console command is required to make super flame atronach familiar" at low level. However at higher level you may add some spell like "Venemous Vapors 98099 " to make her better than other atronach familiar.

[BENZ_PALADIN]

Originally posted by un sac rouge:

I just noticed the female breton has the wrong script assigned to them so change it to the one above it which is ArcaneUApprentice1Script and add the line setessential 0006A833 1 to that one. Someone must have changed it from 1 to 2 by mistake and probably with the mouse wheel as they moved the curser over the box. A 20 year old bug that's lay dormant until now :D Someone needs to develop a padlock button next to a drop down menu so the selection can be locked in place and there's no risk of it being changed in error.

If the essential flag in the CS doesn't work for Mazoga the Orc adding the setessential line to the script should be ok because she isn't scripted to die so it shouldn't conflict with anything.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3745539456

Your idea is nice, However be warn that, before any further modification,(By the advantage of this glitch ) you can choose another mage apprentice girl pair with the black hair Female Breton "6a83f".
- In my case I also choose the red hair "6aab9" in my team.
If you complete fix this, You may have only one choice of them left.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3747092587