Did The Hero of Kvatch Go Mad By The End of Shivering Isles?

[Spartan Delta 27]

Hey there folks.

Just for a quick question/discussion... Would it be safe to say the Main Character has gone "Insane" "Manic" or "Demented" by the end of the DLC, no matter what? I mean... A lot of crazy stuff has been done, like using Eyeballs for Staves and doing Ritual Killings to replace Dukes but... That seems pretty much par for the course, right?

I have not played through the DLC in awhile, but I do not remember anything in it that could not be chalked up to following the orders of a literal God or something which simply... Happens in Universe.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

[psychotron666]

Maybe not by the end of the dlc, but eventually the champion of cyrodil loses their entire identity and gets taken over by the timeless being that is sheogorath. Haskill pretty much straight up tells you that, because sheogorath and jyggalag were cursed into the same body, you becoming a vessel to house sheogorath is how they break that curse.

But seeing as how you mantle pelinal whitestrake, who was a literal madman (and possibly an android of sorts from the future) who was made to slaughter elves, and then mantle sheogorath, it's very possible that by the end of shivering isles you are already insane.

[Spartan Delta 27]

Diposting pertama kali oleh psychotron666:

Maybe not by the end of the dlc, but eventually the champion of cyrodil loses their entire identity and gets taken over by the timeless being that is sheogorath. Haskill pretty much straight up tells you that, because sheogorath and jyggalag were cursed into the same body, you becoming a vessel to house sheogorath is how they break that curse.

But seeing as how you mantle pelinal whitestrake, who was a literal madman (and possibly an android of sorts from the future) who was made to slaughter elves, and then mantle sheogorath, it's very possible that by the end of shivering isles you are already insane.

Hah! I believe I have heard that Pelinal Theory before, good stuff.

I agree with the first part mostly. Eventually the "Identity" of Sheogorath overtakes the player, although I am curious to see if there were any hints during The Shivering Isles Questline that may have implied it would happen sooner rather than later.

It should be interesting to see if more replies pop up with different notes on the situation

[Kieldoozer]

nah he toggles god mode at the end of shivering isles

[Valden21]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Spartan Delta 27:

Diposting pertama kali oleh psychotron666:

Maybe not by the end of the dlc, but eventually the champion of cyrodil loses their entire identity and gets taken over by the timeless being that is sheogorath. Haskill pretty much straight up tells you that, because sheogorath and jyggalag were cursed into the same body, you becoming a vessel to house sheogorath is how they break that curse.

But seeing as how you mantle pelinal whitestrake, who was a literal madman (and possibly an android of sorts from the future) who was made to slaughter elves, and then mantle sheogorath, it's very possible that by the end of shivering isles you are already insane.

Hah! I believe I have heard that Pelinal Theory before, good stuff.

I agree with the first part mostly. Eventually the "Identity" of Sheogorath overtakes the player, although I am curious to see if there were any hints during The Shivering Isles Questline that may have implied it would happen sooner rather than later.

It should be interesting to see if more replies pop up with different notes on the situation

It would be hard to see how the Hero of Kvatch would be able to avoid going insane, considering everything they go through. Insanity is built into the very fabric of the place, after all. The KoTN questline may have given you the blessings of the Aedra, but once you step foot into the Shivering Isles, you're in Sheogorath's territory, and he's the boss there.

[PsychoDino]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Spartan Delta 27:

Hey there folks.

Just for a quick question/discussion... Would it be safe to say the Main Character has gone "Insane" "Manic" or "Demented" by the end of the DLC, no matter what? I mean... A lot of crazy stuff has been done, like using Eyeballs for Staves and doing Ritual Killings to replace Dukes but... That seems pretty much par for the course, right?

I have not played through the DLC in awhile, but I do not remember anything in it that could not be chalked up to following the orders of a literal God or something which simply... Happens in Universe.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

probably

[Spartan Delta 27]

I might be replaying through the questline in the near future, to better gauge the full experience. Off hand, I have difficulty thinking of anything specific that-

.... Well, there was the time one literally is set on fire.

But for the most part, it seems like a fairly straight forward "Go in, fetch this, grab that" kind of experience.

... Although I suppose extracting an Eye would be.... Unusual.

The influence of The Shivering Isles itself on a supernatural level might be a corrupting influence, but I am hoping to determine how much of the Shivering Isles Questline is "Crazy". Heh

[Samantha Raven]

No if you play threw the story and pay attention along with doing skyrim quest where sherogorath in.
You relise you break the curse/cycle that was troubling the shivering isles that bound jigalag and sheogorath togather and freeing sherogorath from the curse and jiggalag from sharing same body allowing them to both be free of each other and seperate entities and jiggalag to wonder off to form his own deadric realm leaving the shiving isles behind for good jiggalag litterly says all this in the ending quest and is confused by the player cause the player isnt sheogorath yet they hold the mantle of the realm as a deadric prince of the shivering isles he even says this stuff and is final words fare thee wall sheogorath.
Keep reading and ill explain what this means.

When you do the quest even haskill tells you this has never bin done before before u complete final quest and there still hope and there intent is you to hold the mantle of the realm basicly being the thing that keeps the shivering isles from falling apart and proventing jiggalag from fully gaining his power.

However before defeating jiggala if you pay close attention to the quest line and what haskill and sheogorath say you are basicly a vessal object that is a powerful being that is like the keeper/caretaker of the shivering isles your a version of sheogorath yet your your own being you keep your identity but you are the bodyment of the shivering isles as well as sheogorath is your both two sides of a single coin both connected but both seperate.

When you do skyrims quest and talk to sheogorath this is even more confirmed when he refers to the one sitting on his throne taking care of the shivering isles in his absent and I also believe this is how sheogorath is able to move across realms and nirn and shivering isles more freely cause you are the mantle of sheogorath but are not sheogorath your the shivering isles keeper/guardian/mantle of sheogorath.
When you consider all the quest you did in shivering isles you basicly did all of them to better the shivering isles and protect it and keep it togather making u the shivering isles guardian/caretaker and mantle of the realm and the bodyment of the shivering isles and holding its mantle as a form of a sheorgorath in away you are like barbas is to Clavicus Vile both are consider there own individuel yet both are connected yet both are there own beings and are both consider a deadric prince both having same power yet Clavicus Vile is consider the main deadric prince.

So ya your both sheogorath and at same time your not witch is madness, your one of sheogoraths faces of madness is one way to look at it like two sides of a single coin while both sides of that coin are diffrent and maintain there indedviduality yet they both share the same coin/power.

()()
(^,^)
()(")(") Thanks for taking time and reading my post. <3

[Spartan Delta 27]

Diposting pertama kali oleh ;1745647546860250635:

()()
(^,^)
()(")(") Thanks for taking time and reading my post. <3

Very thorough, I appreciate the effort you must have put into it. I think you have a pretty good grasp of the philosophical aspect to one assuming the "Mantle" of Sheogorath.

I did find the idea of a duality within the station to be very interesting. Your mention that by virtue of not being completely insane while assuming the title of Sheogorath who is the embodiment of insanity was a good note, quite possibly being what the developers were going for from the start. It is definitely something worth considering and I appreciate that you brought it up.

[WickedRequiem]

I will say, sherogorath and his quests in Skyrim were far kinder than his previous versions... so perhaps some of HoK is still alive in him.

[Jork]

CoC was always sheogorath, even before defeating jyggalag. He splintered part of himself off as the CoC and we become more of ourselves (sheogorath) over time.

"What's this prisoner doing here? This cell is supposed to be off limits!"

[Valden21]

Diposting pertama kali oleh WickedRequiem:

I will say, sherogorath and his quests in Skyrim were far kinder than his previous versions... so perhaps some of HoK is still alive in him.

The Hero of Kvatch is still there, in some form at least. I see no other way, lore-wise, to account for some of the things that Sheogorath says to Pelagius the Mad during his quest. He directly references the events of some of the quests from Oblivion, including his own Daedric quest from Oblivion.

Another thing to mention is if you do Sheogorath's Daedric quest after completing Shivering Isles, it's Haskill talking to you. He even says "Praying to yourself, My Lord? That's not a good sign. Or perhaps it is. Prince of Madness, and all that."

[psychotron666]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Valden21:

Diposting pertama kali oleh WickedRequiem:

I will say, sherogorath and his quests in Skyrim were far kinder than his previous versions... so perhaps some of HoK is still alive in him.

The Hero of Kvatch is still there, in some form at least. I see no other way, lore-wise, to account for some of the things that Sheogorath says to Pelagius the Mad during his quest. He directly references the events of some of the quests from Oblivion, including his own Daedric quest from Oblivion.

Another thing to mention is if you do Sheogorath's Daedric quest after completing Shivering Isles, it's Haskill talking to you. He even says "Praying to yourself, My Lord? That's not a good sign. Or perhaps it is. Prince of Madness, and all that."

Those references in Skyrim are simply Easter eggs referring to events in oblivion.

Otherwise it would imply that the COC became leader of all guilds as well as saved cyrodil, but yet nobody knows his name, gender or race, while having a resume that would make you as famous as Tiber septim.

All those events happened, but not by the same person. In all the elder scrolls games , it's only canon that the player character completed the main quests and dlc. While the other guild quest lines and side quests were completed, they weren't completed by the same person.

And the sheogorath we meet in Skyrim is not only none of the other races, but he has even the same voice and attitude he had when we meet him in oblivion.

The COC may have a tiny bit of him left within sheogorath, but sheogorath has full control.

It might be like talos where he's made up of 3 different people, but has only 1 aspect that is the overdiety with none of the 3 people having their identity anymore.

[Samantha Raven]

Diposting pertama kali oleh psychotron666:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Valden21:

The Hero of Kvatch is still there, in some form at least. I see no other way, lore-wise, to account for some of the things that Sheogorath says to Pelagius the Mad during his quest. He directly references the events of some of the quests from Oblivion, including his own Daedric quest from Oblivion.

Another thing to mention is if you do Sheogorath's Daedric quest after completing Shivering Isles, it's Haskill talking to you. He even says "Praying to yourself, My Lord? That's not a good sign. Or perhaps it is. Prince of Madness, and all that."

Those references in Skyrim are simply Easter eggs referring to events in oblivion.

Otherwise it would imply that the COC became leader of all guilds as well as saved cyrodil, but yet nobody knows his name, gender or race, while having a resume that would make you as famous as Tiber septim.

All those events happened, but not by the same person. In all the elder scrolls games , it's only canon that the player character completed the main quests and dlc. While the other guild quest lines and side quests were completed, they weren't completed by the same person.

And the sheogorath we meet in Skyrim is not only none of the other races, but he has even the same voice and attitude he had when we meet him in oblivion.

The COC may have a tiny bit of him left within sheogorath, but sheogorath has full control.

It might be like talos where he's made up of 3 different people, but has only 1 aspect that is the overdiety with none of the 3 people having their identity anymore.

Ya and all those events where not done by the character of oblivion other then like u said main quest and the dlcs.

You can find lore books and referances to this in skyrim the dark brotherhood in cyrodill before it fell had the same character running it when that crazy jester was there before he left for skyrim so they never got killed by the hero of kvatch.

But The shegoroath in skyrim isnt the hero of kvatch the hero of kvatch is still there own being but most likely still in the shivering isles.

I see it there is ether two Sheogoraths one is the Hero of kvatch other is Sheogorath from oblivion just two sides of a single coin both there own being wondering about.

Another possiablity.

The character from oblivion maintaince there identity but gains madness and has a seriuse split personality disorder =P
Where they change into sheogorath then back to there old selfs it would explain why sheogorath ended up going on there so called adventure and why they seemed so confused and hestant to go back to the shivering isles. =P

Even before you take on the role of the mad god the original shegoroath him self has could change his appearance in khajit culture they refer to him as the mad khajit god or the tricker god but his apperance in there lore he looks like a crazy khajiit wearing same attire you expect from the mad god.

So another way to see it assume you kept your identty from cyrodill character you can consider the form of the sherogorath in skyrim is your oblivion character just taking that form cause u are in the mind of Pelagius Septim III so your character would change there form to look like what Pelagius Septim III remembers sheogorath to look like.
After all when you consider elder scrolls online the elder scrolls online sheogorath looks similer to the one in skyrim but what makes this intresting is the time periods.
Elder scrolls online takes place 1000s of year before oblivion and skyrim.

So it would make perfect sense your character from oblivion would change there apperance to match Pelagius Septim III memory.
Also the referances Sheogorath says like you know who they are cause they are you character from oblivion like and also they are sheogarth.

Here a quote from him: "I am a part of you, little mortal. I am a shadow in your subconscious, a blemish on your fragile little psyche. You know me. You just don't know it."

Clearly easter egg to your character from oblivion.
Cause u cant say its referance to sheorgath being the mad god cause you already know this when you entered the portal into Pelagius Septim mind.

()()
(^,^)
()(")(") Thanks for taking time and reading my post. <3

[MSgt Peterson]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Samantha Raven:

No if you play threw the story and pay attention along with doing skyrim quest where sherogorath in.
You relise you break the curse/cycle that was troubling the shivering isles that bound jigalag and sheogorath togather and freeing sherogorath from the curse and jiggalag from sharing same body allowing them to both be free of each other and seperate entities and jiggalag to wonder off to form his own deadric realm leaving the shiving isles behind for good jiggalag litterly says all this in the ending quest and is confused by the player cause the player isnt sheogorath yet they hold the mantle of the realm as a deadric prince of the shivering isles he even says this stuff and is final words fare thee wall sheogorath.
Keep reading and ill explain what this means.

When you do the quest even haskill tells you this has never bin done before before u complete final quest and there still hope and there intent is you to hold the mantle of the realm basicly being the thing that keeps the shivering isles from falling apart and proventing jiggalag from fully gaining his power.

However before defeating jiggala if you pay close attention to the quest line and what haskill and sheogorath say you are basicly a vessal object that is a powerful being that is like the keeper/caretaker of the shivering isles your a version of sheogorath yet your your own being you keep your identity but you are the bodyment of the shivering isles as well as sheogorath is your both two sides of a single coin both connected but both seperate.

When you do skyrims quest and talk to sheogorath this is even more confirmed when he refers to the one sitting on his throne taking care of the shivering isles in his absent and I also believe this is how sheogorath is able to move across realms and nirn and shivering isles more freely cause you are the mantle of sheogorath but are not sheogorath your the shivering isles keeper/guardian/mantle of sheogorath.
When you consider all the quest you did in shivering isles you basicly did all of them to better the shivering isles and protect it and keep it togather making u the shivering isles guardian/caretaker and mantle of the realm and the bodyment of the shivering isles and holding its mantle as a form of a sheorgorath in away you are like barbas is to Clavicus Vile both are consider there own individuel yet both are connected yet both are there own beings and are both consider a deadric prince both having same power yet Clavicus Vile is consider the main deadric prince.

So ya your both sheogorath and at same time your not witch is madness, your one of sheogoraths faces of madness is one way to look at it like two sides of a single coin while both sides of that coin are diffrent and maintain there indedviduality yet they both share the same coin/power.

()()
(^,^)
()(")(") Thanks for taking time and reading my post. <3

Not gonna lie, I've never thought about it that way but that does makes sense and is more than plausable.