Glarthir

[ralphtobybob]

I've done that quest a lot of times before. Usually, when I get to his city, I'm on my way to do something else, so I don't start the quest until a couple or so game days later.

This game however, he wasn't waiting for me. When I asked around, it turns out he was "found dead". I almost restarted the game since I tie this in with the Thieves Guild later on.

I found Glarthir's body inside the city, by one of the gates.

This is a new one for me. There are different outcmes depending on how you play the quest, but this has never been one of them.

I don't want to look this up in a wiki, I'd rather poke around and see if this is a jack-in-box twist or just a random event or maybe a quest I've never stumbled on before.

Still, I've never seen anyone randomly killed in a walled city in Oblivion, other than as a result of a Red Dawn event.

This is mind-melting because it changes the nature of the entire quest and conflicts with all of my assumptions from previous games.

Anyone else seen this before?

[AC Denton]

This either a glitch or he was just killed due to some freak accident. A few things could have caused this, such as walking into the city while an enemy was chasing you, then the enemy came into the city & killed him.
Or you started a fight with a faction within the city and he got killed defending you or something.
I've seen this happen a bunch of times in these games.

[AC Denton]

It's defiently not MEANT to happen, it's not a part of the quest.

[SnickerToodles]

If you tell Glarthir you won't help him, he'll immediately go on a rampage.

If you haven't spoken to him, it's possible that he may have stolen food and been killed by the guards, as he has a very low responsibility.


The wiki notes: "This quest may conflict with Lost Histories due to the scripted appearance of guards." I have no idea what that means, but perhaps that has something to do with it.

[AC Denton]

Yeah if you done Lost Histories and the guards spawned because of the script then they could easily have killed him.
Also the rampage. Though I assume you should know this if you've done it so mnay times.

[Belanos]

There's a walk way to the palace above one of the gates, which is quite high up. I've seen guards fall of it and plunge to their deaths below. That happened fairly often in my games in fact, once a guard almost fell right on top of me. Perhaps he started wandering off to the palace and fell off that walk way like those guards I've seen.

[AC Denton]

Originally posted by Belanos:

There's a walk way to the palace above one of the gates, which is quite high up. I've seen guards fall of it and plunge to their deaths below. That happened fairly often in my games in fact, once a guard almost fell right on top of me. Perhaps he started wandering off to the palace and fell off that walk way like those guards I've seen.

He said in the city

[Dingbat]

Well, it's certainly odd. Not that NPCs don't turn up dead all the time, but I'm very surprised Glarthir wasn't marked as "essential", at least until the conclusion of his quest. Seems a shame to go back to an earlier save just for that.

[ralphtobybob]

Originally posted by SnickerToodles:

If you tell Glarthir you won't help him, he'll immediately go on a rampage.

If you haven't spoken to him, it's possible that he may have stolen food and been killed by the guards, as he has a very low responsibility.


The wiki notes: "This quest may conflict with Lost Histories due to the scripted appearance of guards." I have no idea what that means, but perhaps that has something to do with it.

He gets in your face the first time you enter the city, and asks you to meet him at midnight.

I showed up to do the Mage's guild recommendation quest and hadn't done any other quests there. Haven't gotten 'Lost Histories' quest.

The NPCs, when telling me he's dead, add something like 'someone must have gotten tired of him' .

It's probably a glitch, but sounds like the beginning of a quest similar to the serial killer investigation in Skyrim.

Still, it raises a lot of questions, not just about the nature of Glorthir's quest. Who killed Glarthir?

By the way, I on a vanilla version of Oblivion with no mods, but all of the DLC loaded.

[ralphtobybob]

Originally posted by Dingbat:

Well, it's certainly odd. Not that NPCs don't turn up dead all the time, but I'm very surprised Glarthir wasn't marked as "essential", at least until the conclusion of his quest. Seems a shame to go back to an earlier save just for that.

I just moved on, once I found his body. I lost some quest bucks but still got his house key.

[SnickerToodles]

Originally posted by ralphtobybob:

The NPCs, when telling me he's dead, add something like 'someone must have gotten tired of him' .

I believe this happens if he's killed at any stage of the quest, by anyone. Even the guard who kills him will say that right after, if you turn him in.

[Dayve]

I feel bad for Glarthir. I made a thread about him a while back on these STEAM forums.

He's obviously mentally ill, paranoid, perhaps some kind of schizophrenia (I have a family member with this so I know the signs).

However, when I did his quest to follow people, strange things happened. Firstly, after meeting him for the first time, I went to sleep at the inn. A guard came into my room at night and told me to stay away from Glarthir in a threatening manner.

Later, when following one of Glarthir's targets, a guard arrested me and put me in jail for being a thief. I hadn't stolen anything, ever. I'm a good guy knight, not a thief. I don't even trespass unless a quest demands it. Seems to me like they were obstructing me from following the guy!

Later, when spying on another guy for Glarthir, I observed this person leave the vineyard where they were working, walk out to a spot just beyond the vineyard, bend down to pick something up (or maybe put something down) and then immediately leave this spot and go home. I was roleplaying (as always) so I was very far away when observing my target so they wouldn't see me. I later went back to the spot where they bent down to pick something up, and I found holes in the grass where someone had been digging.

So Glarthir is obviously a paranoid maniac with mental illness, but the people in Skingrad are also suspicious.

[SnickerToodles]

Originally posted by Dayve:

Later, when spying on another guy for Glarthir, I observed this person leave the vineyard where they were working, walk out to a spot just beyond the vineyard, bend down to pick something up (or maybe put something down) and then immediately leave this spot and go home. I was roleplaying (as always) so I was very far away when observing my target so they wouldn't see me. I later went back to the spot where they bent down to pick something up, and I found holes in the grass where someone had been digging.

From the Oblivion Game Guide:

"One of the documents that will always appear is an account of Glarthir's own surveillance on Surilie at his vineyard west of the city. It refers to the winemaker going off by himself - possibly to bury secret evidence - and to a later finding that ground had been disturbed. [...]

North of the vineyard are two ponds. Sunk beside the central rock of the eastern one is a chest containing a bit of gold, probably some clutter, and a small chance of a lockpick."

Surilie is hiding his treasure, not espionage-related correspondence or dead bodies. :P

Surprisingly, this information is not on UESP. Lucky this passage is available to read on Google Books. I remembered reading something like this happening in the guide when I was a kid.

[ralphtobybob]

Originally posted by SnickerToodles:

Originally posted by ralphtobybob:

The NPCs, when telling me he's dead, add something like 'someone must have gotten tired of him' .

I believe this happens if he's killed at any stage of the quest, by anyone. Even the guard who kills him will say that right after, if you turn him in.

But that goes against the storyline. Everyone says they tolerate him The guards say they can't do anything unless he breaks the law.

Getting into spolier territory here, but he's left alone unless he snaps. The title of the quest says it all.

And it's your character's interaction that can lead him to snap.

[ralphtobybob]

Originally posted by SnickerToodles:

Originally posted by Dayve:

Later, when spying on another guy for Glarthir, I observed this person leave the vineyard where they were working, walk out to a spot just beyond the vineyard, bend down to pick something up (or maybe put something down) and then immediately leave this spot and go home. I was roleplaying (as always) so I was very far away when observing my target so they wouldn't see me. I later went back to the spot where they bent down to pick something up, and I found holes in the grass where someone had been digging.

From the Oblivion Game Guide:

"One of the documents that will always appear is an account of Glarthir's own surveillance on Surilie at his vineyard west of the city. It refers to the winemaker going off by himself - possibly to bury secret evidence - and to a later finding that ground had been disturbed. [...]

North of the vineyard are two ponds. Sunk beside the central rock of the eastern one is a chest containing a bit of gold, probably some clutter, and a small chance of a lockpick."

Surilie is hiding his treasure, not espionage-related correspondence or dead bodies. :P

Surprisingly, this information is not on UESP. Lucky this passage is available to read on Google Books. I remembered reading something like this happening in the guide when I was a kid.

The location of one of those ponds is given to you by Sinderion, I belieive. You also find notes about some off-the-wall cabal out to get him for "what he knows".

Even the guards tell you to leave him alone, but report any strange behavior. When you do, you're told nothing can be done unless he breaks the law.

And since it's your character's information that can make him snap, this really doesn't make sense.

[ralphtobybob]

Originally posted by Belanos:

There's a walk way to the palace above one of the gates, which is quite high up. I've seen guards fall of it and plunge to their deaths below. That happened fairly often in my games in fact, once a guard almost fell right on top of me. Perhaps he started wandering off to the palace and fell off that walk way like those guards I've seen.

I went back to take a closer look. There is a walkway near that gate, the gate leading to the castle. I know it wasn't the Count because other than for one quest, he normally doesn't leave the castle. (I entered his quarters after that quest rather than visiting during normal hours and he attacked me. I wonder if I can get him to attack, then chase me into the city...)

I also began to wonder if maybe a spider daedra or something poisoned him and he died inside the gate. But that area is walled in.

His body is on the side of the bridge opposite the gate and his head is pointing away from the gate.

I have seen NPCs doing tne Three Stooges thing in doorways and stairwells, so your theory that he fell off the bridge is plausible.

The other NPCs' comments that someone must have gotten tired of him sounds like what they say when you complete the quest and a guard doesn't intervene. That leaves your character as the only witness.

The other ending, when you encourage him, has the NPCs saying something completely different, somthing to the effect that he 'finally snapped'.

Whether this is how he got killed or not, I'm accepting that as the explanation so I can move on.