Dice roll on the combat system.

[SlashingExpectations]

So does anyone know exactly how the combat dice roll system works? i know it is focused on the skill of your weapon use but i dont get it past that point.

[The Flying Rodent]

solidap님이 먼저 게시:

There is NO DICE ROLL.

A math formula involving various stats IS NOT A DICE ROLL.

Baldur's Gate has literal dice rolls, Morrowind does not

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Combat

Chance to Hit in Morrowind has a dice roll element, in that it works off of percentages. The chance to hit formula is "Attacker's Hit Rate - Defender's Evasion" %, which is analogous to "attack bonus vs armour class"% (with an additional d20 determining if a hit lands or not, as opposed to a hypothetical 'd100').

Enemy NPC's/creatures also deal a random amount of damage depending on their damage range + other modifiers.

PLAYER DAMAGE however, DOESN'T have any random chance mechanics, unlike the randomly determined "damage values within a range" on enemy NPC's + particular weapons within Baldur's Gate or similar (e.g. 1d8 on a Longsword deals a random number between 1 and 8 determined by a dice roll). The ‘damage range’ on a player’s weapon in Morrowind instead dictates the damage dealt based off of how hard someone swings with their weapon (via 'small quick swings' vs 'large slow swings'), as well as other damage modifiers like weapon damage range/strength/fatigue/etc, vs a fixed enemy armour rating.

As such, against the same enemy, a 'large swing' with the same weapon should deal the same amount of damage with each subsequent hit each time (not accounting for condition in weapon & armour items, which themselves only shift the damage up or down slightly rather than adding a random chance).

[The Flying Rodent]

Nebgama님이 먼저 게시:

(Weapon Damage (Chop 1 - 7) * Strength Modifier * Condition Modifier * Critical Hit Modifier) / Armor Reduction

it would look like this for a damage roll for example. No not all the formulas are dice roll in nature but its in the game.

In this example, Strength Modifier is a fixed value depending on the users strength, Condition Modifier is dependent on the condition of the weapon (which, granted, will change slightly as the weapon is used but in slow incremental predictable amounts), and Critical hit Modifier pertains to Sneak Attacks which deal a fixed 4x damage or 1.5x for Ranged. The only component with a 'range' meanwhile, i.e. the 1-7 damage, is purely determined by how hard the user swings their weapon, which they can control and is thus not random.

However! If an 'enemy' had such a weapon and used it on the player, then the 1-7 damage would be randomly determined like a dice roll.

[Nebgama]

Its still a dice roil formula though because its 1 - 7 irrrespectful of the fact that it can be a fixed int value this is what i meant by dice roll because the weapon attack value is a die its just a fixed one.

Chop 1 - 7 is a 7 sided die a fixed one at that and then it applies its formula to the die
* Strength Modifier * Condition Modifier * Critical Hit Modifier) / Armor Reduction

in this formula the whole equation is a fixed one but on a percentage based formula its more dynamic like actual RNG role of the dice.

Does not matter if its not random because in this equation its a rigged dice that was the whole point of my post.
like it always rolls snake eyes or duces or what ever for example and if this was cards you can win the game ever single time for example.

[Dallas S]

Nebgama님이 먼저 게시:

Its still a dice roil formula though because its 1 - 7 irrrespectful of the fact that it can be a fixed int value this is what i meant by dice roll because the weapon attack value is a die its just a fixed one.

Chop 1 - 7 is a 7 sided die a fixed one at that and then it applies its formula to the die
* Strength Modifier * Condition Modifier * Critical Hit Modifier) / Armor Reduction

in this formula the whole equation is a fixed one but on a percentage based formula its more dynamic like actual RNG role of the dice.

Does not matter if its not random because in this equation its a rigged dice like it always rolls snake eyes or duces or what ever for example and if this was cards you can win the game ever single time for example.

What you described is not a dice roll.

The attack formula (to hit) is a dice roll, so is the cast chance. The damage formula has no dice roll mechanics

[Nebgama]

chop 1 - 7 is a dice though tell me its not genius its the exact same as D20 in D&D but its just not a RNG dice its a static fixed one.

The formula that comes after it is the bonus modifier. Just like in D&D in its own way though.

here is a attack roll in D&D

Dice + Dice modifier + Dice modifier
D20 + Ability Score Modifier + Proficiency Bonus

Attack roll for Morrowind

Dice + Dice modifier XYZ
(Chop 1 - 7) * Strength Modifier * Condition Modifier * Critical Hit Modifier) / Armor Reduction

D&D
RNG + Static INT + Static INT

Morrowind
Static INT + Static INT XYZ

This is only for the basic attack roll from a Melee Die though i did say at the start that there is some RNG formulas.

Yes the formula for this basic attack in MW is static because the die is static and the formula is a static modifier it uses the same numbers every roll meaning you hit with the exact same values every swing unless you sway the modifier externally.

it also means that you can hit for the same numbers every shot if you are good.

The only time this formula would be a RNG one is when you have low Agility or low Weapon condition.

[Nebgama]

Lets break it down further. We will just plug in some random values like from a player sheet.

(Weapon Damage * Strength Modifier * Condition Modifier * Critical Hit Modifier) / Armor Reduction

- Melee Weapon = Chop 1 - 7 > At full condition/Agility fixed value
- Strength = 20 > Fixed value
- Condition Modifier = 100% = Weapon Durability > fixed value
- Critical hit modifier not sneaking = 1 > fixed value
- Armor Reduction modifier = - Targets Armor so we will say 10 > Fixed value

So the whole roll is...
Fixed value * Fixed value * Fixed value * Fixed value / - Fixed value = Fixed value

yes the dice is rigged in this roll

[theo]

Die is a throwable object with marked sides. It rolls when you throw it, giving a random result when it settles down. It's RNG by definition.
If nothing is rolled (randomly determined), it isn't dice.

[Nebgama]

You don't throw a die in Dungeons and dragons video games either because its a theoretical die apart of an equation.

In a real game you of course have physical dice.

You grasping now. 1- 7 is a die its just one that can be rigged.
Else there would be no RNG 1 - 7 because you can hit a 1.

If you good then the die becomes rigged and you hit 7 + modifier every swing. Otherwise you can hit < 7

which is still a fixed value because weapon condition and weapon attack type is fixed int values

Current Condition / Maximum Condition

"Condition is a simple ratio - if your weapon has 50% Condition left (say, 400/800), you will deal 50% as much damage as you would have with a weapon in perfect Condition"

so at 50% weapon condition it would be a 3.5 + fixed modifier roll on a 7 sided die every time.

[theo]

There isn't a die with 7 sides. The number between 1 and 7 depends on how long you "charge" the attack, it isn't rolled, physically or otherwise

[Nebgama]

if its not a die then it would not be 1 - 7 and it would also not be in the equation its the first metric.

Stop arguing with me you wrong

[theo]

It's 1 - 7 because damage varies depending on player's input (duration of holding the attack button). Nothing is "rolled"

[Nebgama]

i swear you pull teeth out to the end its die

[theo]

By your unconventional definition of die, maybe. For normal people die is a generator of random values within a set range

[Nebgama]

i code these sort of algorithms because i make games 1 -7 is a die, if it wasn't then it would just be a flat int value like 1 or 7 not 1 - 7 which is RNG factor just like a die.

[Nebgama]

Here you go actually this is what that fixed Melee equation value is representing it is
pseudo random RNG which means there is factors but it is also a rigged sequence of factors.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudorandom_number_generation