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I've been an Elder Scrolls player a long time. I did not play Arena or the other minor short-lived games in the series. I did not play Oblivion, but that was because I'd had enough single player to last me for a long time. Skyrim lured me back in with its graphics and soundtrack, which reminded me of my old fondness for Morrowind. So, I say these things to give you some idea of where I'm coming from.
Daggerfall was amazing for its day. I truly enjoyed that game for the freedom it gave players. Story? meh... it wasn't really about that, at least not for me. There were great features in Daggerfall that I was sad to see were not carried on into Morrowind, just as there were features of Morrowind I was sad not to see carried into Skyrim, but it was about trading off player freedom for story and graphics.
Ignoring Oblivion because it never crossed my radar, I'd have to say the story elements of Morrowind is what placed the series on the map of serious interest in the genre. To say it's the worst of the franchise is a bit harsh and fails to account for how the game compared to other games of its time. The only serious competition to Morrowind at that time was the Neverwinter Nights series of RPG titles. I'm not talking about the MMO. I'm talking about the actual, let's get together on a LAN with a DM and play an RPG on computer, cause that's what NWN brought to the table. Who is even talking about NWN today? Yet Morrowind means enough that you felt the need to come in here and review it negatively.
Also, I find it hard to believe Morrowind is worse than that trash of an MMO that just about killed the series. I was a beta tester for that mess. Never again. Pay to play? You couldn't pay enough to get me to do so. Feh.... Bethesda finally makes a multiplayer ES game and goes MMO. What a lame cashgrab, 'cause that's what subscriptions are--a stinking bloated cashgrab.
So, back to the point, you're welcome to your subjective opinion. Next time, instead of trolling the forums, just submit a negative review for it and be done. Nobody will read that though, will they? So you came here, which is your right. Still, consider just giving a review next time.
Having said that, the elves of Morrowind are some of the ugliest I've ever had the displeasure of playing among. Even so, Morrowind is a game that really shines brightest when you have the map, so that you can investigate all the nooks and crannies of the world they populated, and once you've invested 200+ hours in the game. If you haven't done those two things at the very least, you don't know what you've missed, and that's a pity. You've judged this game by what you find most enjoyable, and that's okay, but by stating it's the absolute worst you've basically negated everyone who disagrees with you--people like me who actually like exploring the world they created.
How could I ever be sad with all those fishies gagging on my bait?
''Daggerfall was amazing for its day.''
And still is amazing for anyone willing to invest some time in learning to deal with its flaws. Im pretty sure I got at least 20 hours in to finish the MQ.
''Story? meh... it wasn't really about that, at least not for me.''
But the story still stands out from the others for anyone willing to follow it.
''To say it's the worst of the franchise is a bit harsh and fails to account for how the game compared to other games of its time''
We are comparing games as they are right now, and you didnt really convince me that Morrowind is good in 2018.
ustjay oday itway :P
Daggerfall was one of my most hated games that I purchased (not just in elder scrolls), but Morrowind was one of my favorites. I almost didn't even buy Morrowind because Daggerfall was so excruciating. But... now that I think about it, there were so many similarities in the main quest line in the first half - deliver a letter, deal with some boring court intrigue or internal politics without much happening at all.
What's different in Morrowind is that the side quests weren't the dumb Daggerfall style of "deliver $X to $Y who lives in $Z" format. Daggerfall was really generic fantasy, but Morrowind broke the mold with a very unique look and design especially when compared to fantasy games of the period. With Daggerfall the world you are in isn't very exciting, almost nothing happens between cities and dungeons, like Arena it's all a lot of nothing out there. With Morrowind there's a feeling of dread relatively early on, especially when you get your first view of blight creatures, and tons of stuff happens on the roads or in the middle of nowhere. Morrowind was also the game that hugely increased the number of those interesting books in the game.
Morrowind's world was just generic fantasy but pallete swapped with a swamp in line with the trend of its day to make things more dark and brown. Make a texture mod to change the mushrooms to trees and you're back to generic fantasy to the t.
Uhh.... You never are a prisoner in DF, you become 'prisoner' of a natural cave-in in a grotto, that is the starting dungeon.
You are sent to deliver a letter and/or investigate on a missing letter AND investigate rumors of an unresting ghost of an assassinated king. You are made fully aware of the high stakes and the importance of your mission, unlike Morrowind.
"The letter in Daggerfall was pretty boring overall, it should have ended the entire main quest once delivered."
Cant tell if trolling or just straight up stupid. Maybe its you who didnt pay attention. 'Walls of text, yawn, letter is tl;dr, DF sux'. I can turn this around and say that Morrowind's MQ should have started once the letter is delivered. Ill take the quest that doesnt end over the one that doesnt start...
"The letter in Morrowind was deeper"
Not sure if 'deeper' is the right word here... DF doesnt send you to do mundane tasks to make a name, it sends you straight into the action. Main quests are locked by a level req, not silly errands.
"But... now that I think about it, there were so many similarities in the main quest line in the first half - deliver a letter, deal with some boring court intrigue or internal politics without much happening at all."
Confirmed that you dislike heavier reading, or you prefer simplistic plots revolving around chosen ones and prophecies. I bet you rank Skyrim 2nd.
"What's different in Morrowind is that the side quests weren't the dumb Daggerfall style of "deliver $X to $Y who lives in $Z" format"
Overall they were pretty similar except that Morrowind quests werent randomized. Morrowind definitely had some good side quests but a lot of boring ones. You could say that Morrowind's quests had a 'follow the treasure map' format. Locating targets felt more like busy work for a teenager than actual exploration.
DF also had a couple of quests with unique and interesting back stories.
"Daggerfall was really generic fantasy"
That 'generic fantasy' argument is so weak... Baldurs Gate was generic fantasy, Lord of the Ring was generic fantasy...and yet...
"but Morrowind broke the mold with a very unique look and design especially when compared to fantasy games of the period"
Yet as of 2018 Morrowind's setting is generic as it gets. People living in giant mushrooms isnt special anymore.
"With Daggerfall the world you are in isn't very exciting, almost nothing happens between cities and dungeons"
Thats right, because there are no random encounters. Though Morrowind's world is pretty static as well. I have walked around quite a bit and havent found anything really exiting beside a side quest on the road. Other encounters involve combat which automatically makes it tedious.
Daggerfall was about sand box. sand box is about living and simulated world that can be alive without the player. that means other TES are not sand box at all.
time means a lot in Daggerfall, there are factions requires your help to conquer other factions.
tons of dungeons and quest that automatically generates. and lots of random events that can surprise player. I feel Mount and blade is more similar to Daggerfall than any other TES.
but in Morrowind, time is deleted, Npcs are fixed to their locations and world is not living.
Oblivion add some systems like NPC scheduling. that can make you feel more like a sandbox but it's just fake. both Oblivion and skyrim erased time. they don't have time limit nor special dates.
they are just pretending to be a sandbox.
The fact that you put Daggerfall and Oblivion before Skyrim & Morrowind says a lot about the types of games you like. It sounds to me that you're just not the kind of gamer that loves the Elder Scrolls style. Being thrown into the world with no direction was the best part in my opinion, but I respect your opinions.
2. Daggerfall
Then theres a big gap
3. Oblivion
Then theres another big gap
4. Skyrim
5. Battlespire
6. Redguard
7. Arena
Ive played every TES game to near completion or to completion, Arena awful, Redguard and Battlespire arent worth talking about, Dagger fall was an ambitious broken mess but it did do some cool things, Oblivion made some mistakes and went to far with stream lining and Skyrim went even further and dulled it down to a point where its no even worth paying attention to any of the lore, Morrowind hit the best balances between Action and RPG, the only thing that limits Morrowind is technology, if you gave it radient AI and other such things it would be the best game ever, and any game that forces stupid quest markers on you and doesnt give you a proper journal system that tells you where to go is a ♥♥♥♥ game.
Seems like you're ranking Morrowind based on what it could have been, not what it currently is.
The action in Morrowind is poor and so are the RPG elements.
All the hate for Oblivion is unjustified. Dont tell me that a silly quest marker alone is ruining this game, or even bad level scaling.
you know huge part of Daggerfall is finding direction. you don't know exactly where the goal is.
So, you have to ask any citizen about direction. and it is the most important part of the adventure.
so the biggest problem is that, Oblivion, removed adventure from adventure game.I, personally, like Oblivion. it showed good use of technology and side quest plots.problem is, that I can do nothing if the game doesn't allow. you can't even kill NPCs because they will give you quest or they are tied with the story "line". at least Oblivion showed player can be a master thief if you have enough skills and thefts. not only thieve's guild, but also other factions has good (or at least enjoyable) plots. but it makes me sad that what I actually doing is just following arrows.
and they are disconnected each other. Outside of the city gate, there are tons of oblivion gates, but no faction cares about that. I even doubt that all the events in Oblivion are in the same world or the time line.
Morrowind, on the other hand, blight storm affects tons of factions, and the relationship of faction matters. that make the world is connected and alive even system is lacking of technology. that's why I think Morrowind is still a worthy RPG even better than Gothic 1 and 2 which have better technology.
and for skyrim.. all of the contents are just "go dungeon, kill everything, grab some trash and go back." even main quests are like that and sucks and other faction quests are same.
even in the thieve's guild, even I get into a factory that is legal, I can kill everyone and the factory feel like a lion... while other TES tried to make dungeon feel like a real place, they just dumped tons of lines. I don't want to say dungeons in skyrim is a dungeon. they are more like attractions in theme park.
In Daggerfall, asking around and getting information is a major part of the game. isn't it? and actually, that is the most important part for a CRPG. combats of CRPG are not that notable.The story doesn't need to be good because many people don't care about story that much. but RPG should have decent adventure game part. The whole quest for beating game itself should be the player's story and real game part. repeating combat is boring and making combat only game part of the game is dumb. I want more than combat. I want adventure.
Daggerfall showed random adventures and Morrowind showed unique adventure.but in Oblivion, instead of playing adventure, I just move my character for watching storys. in skyrim, it's worse because even the story of skyrim is stupid, boring and meaningless.The quest is just for giving money to players and introduce same linear dungeons over and over.
Talking about quest marker, they can give directions to player to play it without quest marker. In Risen series, most part of quests give you directions so even you can use quest marker, you can turn them off and enjoying adventure without walkthrough.
Plus, it is poorly executed so I can see quest's script. they should hide the plot to make quest more mysterious and interesting. but quest marker, which is poorly designed ruined too much.
and for level scaling, I can fix it with mods. so maybe it's not big deal.
well it is surely worst part of Oblivion. but it can be fixed.
but mods can't fix quest design.
Oblivion also has plenty of unique quests that dont involve quest markers. Those quests alone are enough to make up for the marker.
Morrowind had unique quests but still limited in their design. Many of the quests are as mundane as ''Go there, kill X, grab Y''. I stopped caring about exploring and talking to people when I realized how simple the quests were. Add the fact that the monsters level arent scaled, you are locked from doing many quests unless you do some mindless grinding.
''In Daggerfall, asking around and getting information is a major part of the game.''
I wouldnt say that this feature is THAT good. It was fun for a while but it eventually becomes dull. A proper investigation with unique NPCs giving unique directions is the best way to go. Morrowind just gives you the instructions in your journal so IIRC the game doesnt incolve asking around too much.
''The story doesn't need to be good because many people don't care about story that much.''
Actually it needs to be great, because if the story is boring then ignoring it also becomes boring. Oblivion has a great MQ (even though poorly executed/repetitive), which is why its one of the best game if you want to ignore the MQ altogether. The story is the backbone of any good RPG.
And yes, dialogue system of Daggerfall isn't that good and sometimes it's annoying because some citizens are rude. but at least, I should use Daggerfall's world system for finding clues. it looks like a small thing, but this system makes a huge difference. removing this make game arrow following simulator...
and Morrowind also suffers simple quest design. but they have connections between them.what you did affect to other factions. and the plot of Morrowind makes it stronger.every factions care about disaster occurring in Vvardenfell. this makes simple part of quests emerge into the huge cost. and talking about simple and repetitive quest design, no TES are free from that. isn't it?
Oblivion has some quest without quest marker.
but they also lacking of informations. what I want is for clues to win the game.
I don't want the game itself plays games or I have to wander around without any clue.
as I said, quest marker of Oblivion is poorly designed and Oblivion doesn't have enough information to play it without quest marker.
and Oblivion's quests are... disconnected each other. what happens to the world doesn't matter to other people. The fighter guild does nothing for hunting Daedra even they are huge threats and hunting them is profitable. Mage's guild also don't care about Oblivion gate even ingredients from Oblivion are valuable.
As I said, I like Oblivion and it surely showed good things.
but also, they removed huge part of the game: adventure.
well, finding ayleid statues requires an adventure without quest markers, but also they don't have much information or directions to find them. all I know is that they are in ayleid ruins.
and I don't know whether you know or not, but, lores of Morrowind is also part of the game.
they are not just bonus storys for the game. it is a real game part. with the lore, you can solve a huge puzzle of the game. and I never saw any game like that. reading book also leads you to goal of the game. that is very unique characteristic of Morrowind.