the merchant "creeper"

[Icedfate]

I dunno . . . there's something about this guy that feels kind of "exploity"

I know the devs put him in the game for you to use.

but like, he buys anything from you at the full value, regardless of your mercantile skill as well as having the second highest amout of gold of any merchant in the game.

It makes the mercantile skill 100% redundant while also making it pointless to sell to any other merchant.

I suppose he was meant to be a secret easter egg?
but it's not like he's all that difficult to find . . .
he's practically right there available to you right from the start of the game.
I wonder how other people feel on using him.

I mean, there lots of exploits in this game, like circumventing the bad effect of the blinding speed, reusing grand soul gems, increasing skills to astronomical levels(still exists even in skyrim . . .)

but I feel like using these exploits is what breaks the game and ultimately causes me to always lose interest and never finish an elder scrolls game.

[baumgartner]

I agreet FeMaiden. I think Bethesda missed an RP opportunity with Creeper and the Mudcrab. Maybe the Plan was to add some RP elements but the budget and schedule ran out: e.g. - the Player would have to sell part of his soul, or do a 'favor' prior to doing business. Perhaps someone has done a mod.?

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

The way I look at exploits is that they are all optional if you have any self control. If you don't like the idea of them bypassing Mercantile skill, then just don't use them or use a mod to disable them if you have to.

But I think it would have been better if Creeper and Mudcrab merchant were just a little more generous then other merchants when purchasing your items rather then fully bypassing Mercantile.

[Icedfate]

yeah, I realize that I could just "choose" not to use the obvious exploits. I'm deciding that it probably doesn't matter anyway, all the Bethesda games are fairly easy to break the game.

I feel torn . . . like, if I restrict myself into not using things the game offers me, then I am missing out on stuff, but then I feel like if I use them, then I'm spoiling the challenge.

like in skyrim, i exploited alchemy and enchanting to enhance smithing and make weapons that could 1-shot kill anything. I could have played without smithing but smithing is there and so like, well they put it there, they intend for us to use it.

now the mudcrab merchant is a little more well hidden and I understand if maybe we might not have been "meant" to find it, but creeper is right there in your face.

I admit, I've been selling to him just because it's so inconvenient to run around looking for vendors that can afford my stuff. I still ue the regular vendors when it's convenient.

I often just take the loss if I sell a 1200 gp item to a vendor that has only 800, I'll just take the 800 and be rid of it.

I've sold several 12-20k value items to creeper already and just took the 5k he had, so I guess that balances it a bit.

I was trying really hard not to break the game and stick to the main quest, but there's so much stuff in there to distract the player . . . I'm now level 23 and I broke the game anyway so I may as well just play it however.

I probably won't do any of those "super potion" and super human ability exploits though, the game seems easy enough already.

I also have morrowind comes alive mod installed because it seemed like some other mod required it and I'm encountering some modded enemies with valuable gear and I decided not to take the stuff because it feels like cheating .

I think the challenge is more about finding out how to complete all the vague things they want you to do.
the whole game is pretty much one huge "Guide-Dang-It", I end up using UESP to finish every quest because I can't find this npc or that dungeon or whatever. or like, I'll just be exploring and I'll find some odd item and it turns out to be a quest item and I never picked up the quest so now I need to quide to find out where to get closure.

(I'm stressed out right now because I sold 3 of the "sanguine" items and don't remember which merchants I sold them to)

TL:DR

I'm just ranting anyway, I know this is a 15 year old game and it's single player and it doesn't matter. I consider it a sandbox game because you have that freedom to play it however you want and mod it and change it.

[Rastrelly]

There are traders with 10000 gold in Mournhold.

[Icedfate]

Publicado originalmente por Rastrelly:

There are traders with 10000 gold in Mournhold.

oh, ok, I guess I never made it that far before. . .

[Icedfate]

lol, sounds gamebreaking . . .

actually right now my new conundrum is whether to let myself get sucked into the "new" skyrim "special edition" or not.
I just discovered last night that steam gave it to me free because I had the orginal version and all its DLC

[Rastrelly]

Publicado originalmente por FeMaiden:

lol, sounds gamebreaking . . .

actually right now my new conundrum is whether to let myself get sucked into the "new" skyrim "special edition" or not.
I just discovered last night that steam gave it to me free because I had the orginal version and all its DLC

Better wait a bit until SKSE comes out to let SkyUI and other SKSE stuff work, and stick with Morrowind (which is IMO better in almost every respect when modded properly) for now ;)

[Icedfate]

morrowind, huge landscape. no reasonable way to actually go everywhere and do everything

skyrim, huge landscape, filled with tons of detail.is actually possible to go everywhere and do everything...

morrowind, no player housing exceot for the places where you murder everyone and then use there containers for storage, with limited capacity

skyrim, player housing. with near infinite storage and the ability to display your hoarded loot


morrowind, user defined character classes, annoying level up system causing you to spend lots of time min/maxing

Skyrim, build your character smoothly anyway you like without having to micromanage and min/max


morrowind, tons of npcs, that act as vendors, or don't really say anything important, or send you across the country for hours on end completing a menial task for a 100 septim reward...

skyrim, tons of npcs, all voice acted, which as as vendors, don't say anything important, or give quests.

morrowind, quests are abstract and vague, take forever and need a guide to complete them and most of them have crappy rewards

skyrim, quests are organized and the goals are clear and the rewards are worth it

morrowind, dungeons are plentiful and full of loot, with not much lore behind most of them

Skyrim, every dungeon is handcrafted, unique, with it's own lore and backstory.

morrowind, lots of "books" with lots of little stories in them.

Skyrim, lots of "books", most of which are grandfathered in from morrowind, with many new ones AND the ability to display them in your player home and read them at your leisure

Morrowind, skillbooks... you pretty much read them when you find them because who is gonna remember where they are and go back for them later

Skyrim, pick up a skill book without reading it and save it for later

TL:DR

I like both games, but I'm not going to vote one over the other. both are good on their own merits, don't be a hater.

P.s.
wait, they don't have skyrim script extender for special edition? but I see it in the steam workshop . . .

[Rastrelly]

Publicado originalmente por FeMaiden:

wait, they don't have skyrim script extender for special edition? but I see it in the steam workshop . . .

Workshop is not applicable to SSE, SSE works with bethmods or Nexus.

Publicado originalmente por FeMaiden:

...

* morrowind, huge landscape. no reasonable way to actually go everywhere and do everything
* skyrim, huge landscape, filled with tons of detail.is actually possible to go everywhere and do everything...
- What? There is a way to get to each and every point in Vvardenfell. If you use your resourses well, and so some cool enchantments, you can run around with some ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ speed of light, or basically fly with some levitation, plus teleport spells, interventions and transport. Skyrim has much less options.

* morrowind, no player housing exceot for the places where you murder everyone and then use there containers for storage, with limited capacity
* skyrim, player housing. with near infinite storage and the ability to display your hoarded loot
- I won't even mention Morrowind housing mods, but each guild provides you with a room or several, and by reaching highest ranks in the Great Houses you can build your own Stronghold

*morrowind, user defined character classes, annoying level up system causing you to spend lots of time min/maxing
*Skyrim, build your character smoothly anyway you like without having to micromanage and min/max
Yes, and in Skyrim leveling has basically no meaning at all, while in Morrowind gameplay significantly differs for early, mid and late game.

* morrowind, tons of npcs, that act as vendors, or don't really say anything important, or send you across the country for hours on end completing a menial task for a 100 septim reward...
* skyrim, tons of npcs, all voice acted, which as as vendors, don't say anything important, or give quests.
- Yes, but Morrowind at least allows you to drain some lore-important information from almost any NPC who likes you enough, in Skyrim there is no such thing as idle conversation, only quest-important ones plus some really small expositary stuff for current Hold.

* morrowind, quests are abstract and vague, take forever and need a guide to complete them and most of them have crappy rewards
* skyrim, quests are organized and the goals are clear and the rewards are worth it
- I.e., in Skyrim one needs not to think. Huge disadvantage.

* morrowind, dungeons are plentiful and full of loot, with not much lore behind most of them
* Skyrim, every dungeon is handcrafted, unique, with it's own lore and backstory.
- And each and every dungeon in Skyrim, except for some big quest related, are played exactly the same way; not much improvement, TBH

* morrowind, lots of "books" with lots of little stories in them.
* Skyrim, lots of "books", most of which are grandfathered in from morrowind, with many new ones AND the ability to display them in your player home and read them at your leisure
- Same applies to Morrowind - you can display your books in your room or Stronghold, or modded in house.

* Morrowind, skillbooks... you pretty much read them when you find them because who is gonna remember where they are and go back for them later
* Skyrim, pick up a skill book without reading it and save it for later
- Is there an actual reason not to read a skillbook?

While I like Skyrim as well, Morrowind is superior pretty much in every way as a ropre RPG. Basically, skyrim is not an RPG any more, it's more akin to GTA.

[bird]

with how expensive useful enchantments are I don't feel bad at all selling to creeper

[Icedfate]

Publicado originalmente por ultimate cyber bully:

with how expensive useful enchantments are I don't feel bad at all selling to creeper

I assumed that you weren't meant to "pay" for the top tier enchantments and you were supposed to max out your skill and do it yourself . . .
but after playing for a while I'm actually inclined to agree, I no longer feel bad selling to creeper, I don't think it's impacting my gameplay at all. I always end up with too much money in every bethesda game

as for the other guy, I'm not gonna get into it with you.

both games are good in their own way, I don't think one is superior to the other. but I am enjoying skyrim much more. it is prettier and the stuff is more detailed and organized. it still feels like elder scrolls, your comparison to GTA is flawed.

I'll answer one point though.
yeah you can plausibly do everything in morrowind but

without the compass and the fast travel that were introduced in oblivion and fallout, finding everything and going everywhere without a guide is nearly impossible,

it is doable but not in a reasonable way.
examole the uesp wiki says at the bottom of the quest to find all the sanguine items that they think the devs never actually meant for the player to find all the sanguine items considering that one of the items is hidden so well on a certain npc with no hint or clue to indicate that particular one has it

[Rastrelly]

Publicado originalmente por FeMaiden:

without the compass and the fast travel that were introduced in oblivion and fallout, finding everything and going everywhere without a guide is nearly impossible,
it is doable but not in a reasonable way.

Oh my god, how do we handle these situations in real life??? Seriously, and after speeches like this the case of dumbing games down is still considered overblown. I had zero to few problems finding ANYTHING in Morrowind. I just read what I'm told, then looked at the map and in 9 case out of 10 I got where I was meant to. And in harder cases they actually mark objects for you on the map. I do not and will not get this map marker ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

[Icedfate]

Publicado originalmente por Rastrelly:

Publicado originalmente por FeMaiden:

without the compass and the fast travel that were introduced in oblivion and fallout, finding everything and going everywhere without a guide is nearly impossible,
it is doable but not in a reasonable way.

Oh my god, how do we handle these situations in real life??? Seriously, and after speeches like this the case of dumbing games down is still considered overblown. I had zero to few problems finding ANYTHING in Morrowind. I just read what I'm told, then looked at the map and in 9 case out of 10 I got where I was meant to. And in harder cases they actually mark objects for you on the map. I do not and will not get this map marker ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

yep... trollbait.

I'm done after this last piece.


I didn't say "finding anything needs a guide" I said "finding EVERYTHING needs a guide"
practically nothing is marked on the map for you, and most directions to stuff are vague or nonexistent. like for example, you go in a cave and find an object and it has someone's name on it, and there's no clue as to where to take it.

or like, the morag tong tell you to kill someone, and the guy is in a public place, surrounded by witnesses and won't move, or talk to you, and the "secret" is to think outside the box, take off all your clothes off to shock him off guard and then he will talk to you and you can taunt him into attacking you first.
I'll admit, that's kind of creative but who the ♥♥♥♥ would think of that?

and then if you don't take care of the tasks immediately, you forget who gave you the task to begin with or where they were

I guess you think I'm a filthy casual because I like the more straightforward style of skyrim's tasks.
I don't see much difference in skyrim with variety of the tasks, they have just as many minor things that random people tell you to do but at least it's clearly marked where you need to go for them.

I get it, you like morrowind better than skyrim.

I like them both, but I just started playing the new "Special edition" of skyrim so I guess I'll be doing that for the next 400 hours . . .

[feliscon]

Publicado originalmente por FeMaiden:

morrowind, user defined character classes, annoying level up system causing you to spend lots of time min/maxing

Get the GCD mod, turns Morrowind into (in my opinion) the best character development system in any computer game I've ever played.

[Icedfate]

Publicado originalmente por feliscon:

Publicado originalmente por FeMaiden:

morrowind, user defined character classes, annoying level up system causing you to spend lots of time min/maxing

Get the GCD mod, turns Morrowind into (in my opinion) the best character development system in any computer game I've ever played.

I'll consider it. I did read about it and I was torn for the reasons I was talking about in this thread . (fear of breaking the game and spoiling it)

I realize, this was a dumb idea to bring this topic up anyway.

I always end up breaking bethesda games and going with it.

I guess that's just my style, I like to try and go everywhere and steal everything and min max my skills and use the all the tools the game gives me. I do try to stay away from obvious eploits like boosting my mercantile so high i can buy below cost and sell above cost and make a profit buying the same stuff and selling it back.
I guess the secret merchants aren't really "cheating", since the game gives you so much high value stuff, you need to have some way to sell it for a decent price.