Assessing Tevi vs RR?

[Sukaiba]

What's your assessments? The improved and the botched?

v Previous, pre-game finish throughts
Granted so far I'm as far as Tartarus so admittedly I've yet to see everything (I miss the spanner spin and air dashing SO MUCHHHHH) but imo,
I think the only area which is inequivocably improved from RR is the pixel art (and having voice acting)

The map has a lot of single tiles paths that makes navigation a pain (Also I've seen 0 exploration upgrades that weren't storygated)

The artstyle is a lot softer and less distinct than RR (Admittedly I also like seeing skin lmao), although the designs are really unique

I feel like all the good themes were in the Demo; I feel RR hit a better middle ground between memorability and immersion

And imo Tevi is a farcry from Erina
And I feel its because she lacks the quirks that made Erina fun (ie momentum and movement tools)
I do appreciate the default combo being more elaborate, but so far unless you're backflip slashing (Or air dashing), Tevi is at a complete standstill
Meanwhile with Erina I could already be hammer rolling, air whirling and bunny striking

And quickdrops being just botched, momentum-less whirl bounces REALLY bums me out man

Finished the game

And most of these thoughts remain the same, just now that the story crumbles like a house of cards on the later Chapters due to constantly adding plot twist and SURPRISE! reveals with no foreshadowing at all

[11clock]

I am near the endgame of TEVI and my opinion on the game has slightly changed. This is not basically Rabi-Ribi 2, but more like a side game to it. The gameplay itself is very much Rabi-Ribi 2, sure, but the game's structure is different, more like that of a JRPG. I personally enjoy the game more than Rabi-Ribi, though, because the gameplay feels a lot smoother and I enjoy the exploration, boss fights, the story and setting. as well as the soundtrack. In Rabi-Ribi I specifically only liked the boss fights and soundtrack, and found everything else subpar. Yes, Rabi-Ribi has nonlinearity and sequence breaking, but I hold little value in those, since I prefer to go down the game's intended route anyways. Also as said earlier, I don't think that those two elements are core functions of a metroidvania. I have always seen a metroidvania as basically "Legend of Zelda* if it was a platformer." (Actually, Zelda 2 IS exactly that lol) Most metroidvanias I have played were super linear, and they're still great.

*I mean Legend of Zelda series as a whole, since most games in the series are linear.

[New Breakfast]

Originally posted by Darkshadovv:

Um... Best Boi Sable? Dummy Bear Ribauld? Waffle of Wonder Greasetrap? Yandere Mermaid Serulea? Demon Lord DIO? Angelic Vergil? "Erina and Ribbon"? Heck I even remember the Golden Hands, Travoll Industries, and Peacekeeper NPCs.

Though I won't deny with how many of them exist much of them don't get a whole lot of screentime. Phantom was pretty much a wasted character.

i guess you can add greasetrap and spoiler (made me hopeful for rabi-ribi voice acting update). wish i could care about the others as much as you did.

[nrook]

I finished Tevi recently, and played Rabi Ribi on Hard (so not a super deep engagement but not nothing either). My take:

I really like the changes made to the melee system and to combat in general. The submissive/dominant system, despite its silly name, makes it natural to tell when to keep attacking in melee and when to back off; in comparison, in Rabi Ribi bosses stop being stunned at what feel like arbitrary times, and occasionally this would result in a surprise hit that felt very frustrating. I do agree that there are rather a lot of sigils and they blend together, but eh, I like more-ish stuff so I didn't mind.

The boss fights feel much more elaborate but Hard on Tevi is too easy for me to really tell much about the pattern design beyond the spectacle. However the spectacle is very cool. Honestly Hard felt way easier in Tevi than it did in Rabi Ribi; I'm looking forward to playing on harder difficulty levels later. I am a bit worried it'll make fights drag; hopefully a mode similar to "Critical" in Kingdom Hearts is added at some point.

The area design is much better in Tevi, and the enemies feel much fairer. Rabi Ribi had a lot of baddies that you just fight from long range because you'll get clipped by something if you close in. It's a good thing, too, since traversing zones is much more of a part of Tevi than it was Rabi Ribi.

I do miss the unique structure of Rabi Ribi, with a nonlinear world and a host of boss fights to enjoy. The bosses in Tevi are longer but there are many fewer of them, and of course there's usually only one way to explore. It's still rewarding to explore "side areas" but much less so.

The area music is a step up in Tevi from Rabi Ribi. I thought it was great all game; standout tracks include "Morose", "Blushwood", "Heaven's Valley" and "Snowveil". However most of the boss music didn't make an impression on me.

Rabi Ribi's bright colors and cheeriness were a delight and a mode very rare in the genre, so I do miss it. It's not really fair to criticize Tevi for having a different vibe, of course, and I think it conveys its own charms successfully.

I do have mixed feelings about Tevi's story and plot. On one hand, the voice acting performances are great (as one would expect from its absurd cast), and the character designs are almost all really good and fun too. Celia stands out as having really fun and evocative facial expressions. On the other hand, the plot itself felt a bit melodramatic, and I would have appreciated more opportunities later for the story to make Tevi herself seem more impressive. Rabi Ribi of course had a very lightweight plot that never made much of an impact on me one way or another.

I really enjoyed both games!

[11clock]

Originally posted by nrook:

The boss fights feel much more elaborate but Hard on Tevi is too easy for me to really tell much about the pattern design beyond the spectacle. However the spectacle is very cool. Honestly Hard felt way easier in Tevi than it did in Rabi Ribi; I'm looking forward to playing on harder difficulty levels later. I am a bit worried it'll make fights drag; hopefully a mode similar to "Critical" in Kingdom Hearts is added at some point.

It's actually recommended to play one difficulty level higher than you would in Rabi-Ribi. I played Rabi-Ribi on Normal, so for TEVI I started on Hard, and upgraded to Hard+ after chapter 4. For both games I also refuse to use consumables. (I buy at least one of each for the sake of completion though and then waste them.)

So far I can confirm that Rabi-Ribi on Normal and TEVI on Hard have felt similar, at least for the boss fights. Enemies in TEVI are considerably more dangerous due to sparse healing, though.

[Hauteclere]

I loved just about everything about Rabi-Ribi: Exploration, combat, OST, (most) character designs, even the story worked for me in its own way. So yeah, TEVI had a lot to live up to, and honestly, I didn't expect it to be as good. Ultimately, I don't think I like TEVI quite as much, but it's still really good, and I can see why some people would prefer it, or at least prefer parts of it. I still like it enough that I'm going achievement hunting.

[Juno Brier]

Personally I just like how Tevi's combat is much more melee-focused than Rabi-Ribi's. No SP bar, more variety in moves, and ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ that whirl slam attack is satisfying to use.

But maybe it does come at the cost of the magic attacks being a bit less interesting. You can go pretty much the entire game with no issue using only the A-type shots for combat. (The other types at least have some puzzle-based applications.)

[nrook]

Originally posted by 11clock:

Originally posted by nrook:

The boss fights feel much more elaborate but Hard on Tevi is too easy for me to really tell much about the pattern design beyond the spectacle. However the spectacle is very cool. Honestly Hard felt way easier in Tevi than it did in Rabi Ribi; I'm looking forward to playing on harder difficulty levels later. I am a bit worried it'll make fights drag; hopefully a mode similar to "Critical" in Kingdom Hearts is added at some point.

It's actually recommended to play one difficulty level higher than you would in Rabi-Ribi. I played Rabi-Ribi on Normal, so for TEVI I started on Hard, and upgraded to Hard+ after chapter 4. For both games I also refuse to use consumables. (I buy at least one of each for the sake of completion though and then waste them.)

So far I can confirm that Rabi-Ribi on Normal and TEVI on Hard have felt similar, at least for the boss fights. Enemies in TEVI are considerably more dangerous due to sparse healing, though.

Ah, that makes sense. Maybe I'm wrong about this, but when I played Tevi I was under the impression difficulties over Hard needed to be unlocked, so I never even considered raising the difficulty. But I am looking forward to revisiting the game at a higher difficulty level at some point.

[Darkshadovv]

With all the comments about TEVI's exploration being "too linear", wouldn't it make sense to compare Rabi-Ribi to Free Roam instead of Story Mode? If the beta branch is anything to go by, it seems like the devs are adhering to removing Free Roam's unlock restriction.

I'm grateful Free Roam even exists at all and that's something the vast majority of Metroidvanias don't have. Like, imagine if could wander wherever you wanted in Metroid Fusion without plot gates and railroading.

[Sukaiba]

Originally posted by Darkshadovv:

With all the comments about TEVI's exploration being "too linear", wouldn't it make sense to compare Rabi-Ribi to Free Roam instead of Story Mode? If the beta branch is anything to go by, it seems like the devs are adhering to removing Free Roam's unlock restriction.

Yeah but the point is that if Rabi-Ribi was able to be open AND have the story on the same mode, there's no reason Tevi should get to use a special mode, specially to band-aid a problem IT decided to create

It would be as if to compare RR vs Tevi difficulty, I decided to compare Hard+/Expert Tevi with RR Bunny Hell mode so its 'more fair'

Originally posted by Darkshadovv:

I'm grateful Free Roam even exists at all and that's something the vast majority of Metroidvanias don't have. Like, imagine if could wander wherever you wanted in Metroid Fusion without plot gates and railroading.

Yeah it would be cool
But that means that railroad is the intended experience
With Tevi, the pressence of a Free Roam mode is almost an admission of "Yeah we had to gimp the exploration in service of the story"

[11clock]

Rabi-Ribi’s plot was a nonsensical garbage excuse plot for the sake of fanservice, though. I don’t consider having no story at all to be worse than that lol.

When it comes to story in games though I prefer how Hollow Knight does it, telling the story through the environment and keeping dialog sparse. TEVI’s story is getting pretty tiring and reminding me why I don’t play JRPGs that often. They could’ve just written a book or something.

[Sukaiba]

Originally posted by 11clock:

When it comes to story in games though I prefer how Hollow Knight does it, telling the story through the environment and keeping dialog sparse. TEVI’s story is getting pretty tiring and reminding me why I don’t play JRPGs that often. They could’ve just written a book or something.

The only time I felt Tevi did this was with the Valhallan underside aka Cloister of Redemption

But then again, unless its decay, the game is constantly adding stuff that only matters for an hour or two and then is completely forgotten about

I finished the game yesterday and the more you near the endgame, the more the game throws out surprise plot twists and asspulls with (to my recall) no sense of subtlety or foreshadowing

I would almost go as far as saying the plot is, while much more elaborate, about the same quality as RR's; Its just that RR's is considerably less wordier

[Darkshadovv]

Originally posted by Sukaiba:

I finished the game yesterday and the more you near the endgame, the more the game throws out surprise plot twists and asspulls with (to my recall) no sense of subtlety or foreshadowing

Idk, "Empress Dahlia" was actually foreshadowed if one was paying attention to what Vassago was saying about her and Cyril, and maybe what Memloch says in the opening cutscene. Actually that twist I don't even mind considering what Celia says about how human society values the illustrious individual and places them above all others; in their eyes there's no "second place".

Revenance though? I got nothing. Well the decay manifestation was actually hinted at even in the opening cutscene and her sprite being partially green in one of the flashback cutscenes and the final boss, but I'm not a fan of it being sentient. The only thing I can think of is Celia saying that spectres display signs of intelligence that transcend basic instincts.

There are hints strewn out here and there but most of them are extremely subtle.

[[UPRPRC] Harlequina]

Finished TEVI today on Expert. Rabi-Ribi is one of my favourite metroidvanias (still keeping UPRPRC in my name!), so my expectations were pretty high going into this game.

My opinion on it has definitely changed over time. Initially, I actually felt pretty good about the story and characters. I cared more about it than I ever did in Rabi-Ribi. But by chapter 5+'ish it just... got too much, and especially in the endgame. New characters and plot points introduced left and right, some of which are promptly dropped or forgotten about. Felt like I didn't get a good reason to feel invested in most of it, in the end. At least I like Tevi herself.

The combat i like more in TEVI, even though it was already my favourite thing about Rabi-Ribi. Big fan of the large amount of sigils that lets you customize how you wanna deal damage. Melee is a bit cooler with the addition of more special attacks.

Exploration.... ehhhh. Yea I'm not a fan of there not being any hidden techs in the main game mode, and that all the main traversal upgrades are locked behind story. It felt annoying just how many times I tried to tackle a hidden item/area after getting a new traversal move, only to find out that NOPE, still need even more ♥♥♥♥. Basically, it almost felt like a waste of time to try to explore thoroughly in the beginning or even in the midgame. Because there's so much ♥♥♥♥ you need to unlock through story progression.

I picked Expert, which is the hardest difficulty you can start with, but it's easier than Hard was in Rabi-Ribi. By the midgame I never died to any boss anymore. The game can't keep up with the powerful sigils and stats you get.

Overall it was a fun game. Fun (but easy) boss fights. The story in both Rabi-Ribi and TEVI are meh, but unlike Rabi-Ribi's story, the one in TEVI feels like it gets in the way.

[Sukaiba]

Originally posted by UPRPRC Harlequina:

The story in both Rabi-Ribi and TEVI are meh, but unlike Rabi-Ribi's story, the one in TEVI feels like it gets in the way.

This is what I was thinking all this time but never found the words, ty

Maybe that's why I'm so intolerant about the structure of Tevi;
It was sacrificed for the sake of the story... which if most of the players are to be believed, they started skipping and zoning out of

Frankly the more I think about it, I'm almost thinking if this game should have instead just been stage-based, up until the later Chapters it gains almost nothing out of being a Metroidvania

[Error 404]

I just completed this story myself and.. I don't actually see where it crumbles.. almost everything has been aluded too at least once in an earlier segment... also much like Rabi-ribi before it.. I expect the story to be expanded on as dlc is added.. which in RR was free but probably wont be with this