Why TOZ-194?

[pvt]

I'm wondering here why would devs pick that piece of junk as a combat shotgun for this game?
I'm Russian and I'm much into 12ga, I'm closely familiar with all the local weaponry and I just don't get it why would one pick that one for the game. You may believe me or not, but TOZ-194 is a completely raw, poorly-engineered and unreliable piece of junk. Quite rare sight on our gun markets, however, no one would ever want that one unless that person is a gathering pumps for a collection.
If devs just wanted some Russian-made 12ga pump from, say, 90's era, then IZH-81 would be their best pick for sure. It's quite simple and crude, but sturdy and somewhat reliable enough. MP-133 which is it's successor (produced since 00's) outclasses almost every other shotgun in IPSC if properly tuned, that says a lot about that platform's performance.
So it's quite unclear for me why TOZ-194 was their choice here, hope they examine all the potential options better for their upcoming Sandstorm.
And as a side-note: this game has quite good 12ga action, however it lacks realism compared to RS2: Vietnam. You don't really need any penetration to disable a heavily-armored human, 12ga punch is high enough to squish the body's internals all right, be it a slug or 00 buck.

EDIT: changed the model name to the actual one.

[Jeff]

They should have picked Saiga-12

[Rymd]

Did you even play the game ? The Insurgents' Shotgun is the TOZ-194 not the -87.

[Andbrew]

Цитата допису Rymd:

Did you even play the game ? The Insurgents' Shotgun is the TOZ-194 not the -87.

It's still a TOZ though.

[Rymd]

Цитата допису A. Max.:

Цитата допису Rymd:

Did you even play the game ? The Insurgents' Shotgun is the TOZ-194 not the -87.

It's still a TOZ though.

So ? The -87 is a semi automatic shotgun while the -194 is a pump action shotgun

[Sterling]

Because they can make it have any stats they want, aka making it not be as bad as you say it is.

[Andbrew]

Цитата допису Sterling:

Because they can make it have any stats they want, aka making it not be as bad as you say it is.

Fair point.

[pvt]

That pump was based off the semi-auto base model, you're right, my apologies for writing the wrong model number. I played quite a long time ago, too.
Anyway it doesn't change the topic's overall sense.
Saiga is a nice thing, however, having box-fed shotguns for real prolonged combat is a questionable thing. 10-round magazines are HUGE and once depleted, you kinda off the game, while tube-fed shottie can be fed with ammo at any given time.

[Rymd]

Цитата допису 6083:

That pump was based off the semi-auto base model, you're right, my apologies for writing the wrong model number. I played quite a long time ago, too.
Anyway it doesn't change the topic's overall sense.
Saiga is a nice thing, however, having box-fed shotguns for real prolonged combat is a questionable thing. 10-round magazines are HUGE and once depleted, you kinda off the game, while tube-fed shottie can be fed with ammo at any given time.

Uh, you're forgetting that this game is hardcore call of duty
Not a milsim, go play Arma or Squad / Project Reality for that experience.

[pvt]

That's not the main point of my post (however shotguns do lack performance here), the point is why there was such a weird decision on shotgun model represented for the insurgents.

[Stint Lint Flipliptip]

Because the insurgents mainly use old eastern bloc weapons, and the TOZ qualifies

[pvt]

Qualifies? Really? Care to read the OP?
It even has false model here, since RL TOZ doesn't have any Ris/Picattinys at all, and it cannot be customized in any way.

[Rymd]

Цитата допису 6083:

Qualifies? Really? Care to read the OP?
It even has false model here, since RL TOZ doesn't have any Ris/Picattinys at all, and it cannot be customized in any way.

It's a video game first and foremost, you have to do things that you wouldn't normally do in life to balance things out, if the TOZ can't attach grips and optics then it's pretty much inferior to the M590.

Why don't you go complain to DICE/EA for using the same TOZ-194 in Bad Company 2 as well ? Also maybe it's because back in 2014 or earlier there was enough references for the -194 but not the other russian shotguns ? Maybe it's just a artistic choice even, or even a homage to the bad company games ?

" Creative freedom or Artistic visions are unappreciated since people are too dumb to appreciate that and only compare everything to Realism since it's the only easy thing they know how to do "

[pvt]

Maybe as a Russian I know better what is widespread and has more tuning options, than some abroad smartheads?
Various flashlights/laser dots can be snapped on practically every shotgun, even double-barrels, while questionable bullcrap like collimator sights and grips is barely needed for a good shottie. Go see how US mil use M590. It's not even 8+1 at times, 5+1 is even more common. Cus people prefer simplicity and reliability over tact1c00l bullcrap, and ESPECIALLY it's well fits the shotgun niche.
Why they pick that retarded piece of pipe while they have IZH-81 of the same era - got no freakin' idea.
I don't care for any DICE crap, I care for Insurgency and other hardcore shooters.
You might be too young or whatever, but you barely understand how badly shotguns are depicted in games ever since they were first introduced in Doom. There's less games with realistic shotguns than fingers on one of my hands. And while Insurgency strives to be good at realistic combat, I care for it.
Creative freedom? Artistic visions? Dafuq is that bullcrap? If the product is being advertised as a realistic one, think we gonna expect it to be so, nah?

[T-Bone Biggins]

Цитата допису 6083:

That pump was based off the semi-auto base model, you're right, my apologies for writing the wrong model number. I played quite a long time ago, too.
Anyway it doesn't change the topic's overall sense.
Saiga is a nice thing, however, having box-fed shotguns for real prolonged combat is a questionable thing. 10-round magazines are HUGE and once depleted, you kinda off the game, while tube-fed shottie can be fed with ammo at any given time.

Did this guy make an argument for tube mags? You hit a pet peeve of mine!!!

In the same time you can insert a single shell into a tube-mag shotgun I can swap the entire box mag on one of the new 870-DM's (box mag fed 870) or a Saiga. Plus you can have colored tape on various mags for slugs, LTL, buck, duplex, whatever. All that would take to swap your shells is a box-mag change and pump, then bam you ready to rock. A tube-fed shotgun you would have to get the shell out of the lifter or pump the entire tube dry before inserting your desired shell, and even then you only have 1 shell of what you wanted to use.

I know some tacti-nerds go on how they can load say a LTL rubber shell into the chamber then buck and a slug after that into the tube, that way an intruder comes in the first shot is a legit lawyer proof attempt not to kill (even if the rubber slug is lodged in his brain). Supposedly this lets you choose what shell you want before firing, pull trigger you got LTL, pump once and fire you got close range buck, pump twice and fire you have longer range. Or you can just fire each shell sequentially to increase lethality/range. Where does this fall apart? I can take a box mag and load it the same way, except I can also swap it for another mag I want :)

Do not argue against box mags, there is no benefit to tube-mags besides how narrow and low profile they allow the gun to be. Even hesitant professionals who made money all these years teaching people how to feed and run a tube-fed shotgun with expensive classes are admitting the box mag is better in every way. My personal opinion they are also more reliable, when hunting I had a handful of times the lifter or extractor got jammed up or broken on my old 870 or my dad's winchester 1300, had to keep spares in the truck. Also tube-mag springs go bad if kept loaded a lot quicker than box-mags do in personal experience keeping a shotgun behind my door.

[Rymd]

Цитата допису 6083:

Maybe as a Russian I know better what is widespread and has more tuning options, than some abroad smartheads?
Various flashlights/laser dots can be snapped on practically every shotgun, even double-barrels, while questionable bullcrap like collimator sights and grips is barely needed for a god shottie. Go see how US mil use M590. It's not even 8+1 at times, 5+1 is even more common. Cus people prefer simplicity and reliability over tact1c00l bullcrap, and ESPECIALLY it's well fits the shotgun niche.
I don't care for any DICE crap, I care for Insurgency and other hardcore shooters.
You might be too young or whatever, but you barely understand how badly shotguns are depicted in games ever since they were first introduced in Doom. There's less games with realistic shotguns than fingers on one of my hands. And while Insurgency strives to be good at realistic combat, I care for it.
Creative freedom? Artistic visions? Dafuq is that bullcrap? If the product is being advertised as a realistic one, think we gonna expect it to be so, nah?

Congratulations on missing most of my points !

The game wasn't even advertised as a realistic shooter, look at the store page, the only mention of realism was weapon behavior, and I think that the weapon behavior in game lives up to the description of the store page.

>assuming age of people on the internet

jesus christ dude, how low can you go