Can Voidborn Sanctic Psyker Officer dump Fellowship?

[Boomer simpson]

Just finished WotR and looking to jump back into this game (I know it's still bugged to all hell but hopefully not as bugged as what I experienced on release).

I'm reading up on all the skills and abilities you get and if I'm reading correctly, you still would have to pump Fellowship up even if you get the 'Be Smart' feat because it only uses the Int Bonus. If this is the case, should I forego Intelligence and 'Be Smart' entirely and just keeping increasing Willpower & Fellowship?

[winter]

Originally posted by Kharneater:

As "Be smart" works with resolve, a voidborn can dump fellowship and focus on INT to boost his resolve and use INT bonus for Officer skills. It won't work for Commerce, Coercion and Persuasion. A Grand Strategist won't get (INT + INT) for their abilities so will still need a bit of Fellowship so I'd go for either Vanguard or Master Tactician depending on want/need.

Hope my quick summary will help. Best of luck and have fun gaming.

Are you sure be smart doesn't work for Grand Strategist? Because AFAIK it should, and it's honestly one of the few applications for be smart as it is.

If it doesn't that would be a bug, and I can see how that could happen given how Grand Strategist is somewhat unique in the way that attributes are shared among multiple characters is available.

[Balekai]

Originally posted by Boomer simpson:

Originally posted by Balekai:

Playing a Sanctic Voidborn Officer Grand Strategist and theory crafting it even before release, I never found the need in my research to take Be Smart. It just doesn't fit unless you respec late in the game. Early on I want to be getting other things before going into Grand Strategist, as Psrker is already talent/ability starved as it is.

The reason being is that there are caps to how much you can invest in a characteristic at various levels/archetypes anyways, meaning you have to switch to other characteristic to rank up regardless.

I find since Sanctic Psyker depends off resolve and Psy Rating, the need for Willpower isn't that huge and you can get away with whatever you invested during character creation + Officer levels. Could you take Be Smart early and bypass putting anything into Willpower? Sure but there's still some officer stuff that uses it if I remember correctly.

That doesn't change the fact that your Sanctic Officer GS is basically a 2 characteristic wonder: Intelligence and Fellowship, which is why Be Smart loses its lustre because the build is already super low on MAD (Multiple Ability (Score) Dependencies). You're almost always going to be pumping Fellowship, then Intelligence whenever you max out the former. Thus having high FELL and INT anyways.

Grand Strategists really only needs Fellowship OR Intelligence, but does benefit from having high bonuses in both, which also works against Be smart a bit when you already have high INT and FELL.

Lastly, Be Smart does nothing for moving over your Persuasion, Coercion and Commerce skills to Intelligence. To do that you would also need to be a Forge World character too (magically :p ). If you keep your Fellowship low you will have low skill in these skills, which are usually the bread and butter of Officer Main Characters, thus allowing other party members to focus on more important skills for them (Like Pascal with Tech use/Logic, Cassia on Warp, Jae on Imperium or Tech (but is easily the character to replace your own lacklustre fell skills if you go Be Smart, or Pascal with the Forge World talent) etc.

For what it's worth, I'll be going Voidborn Sanctic Psyker Officer into Master Tactician because I heard there are some combats you can't avoid where you only control your RT and I want to be able to do something other than only buff (even if that's all I'll be doing when I'm with my party).

Regardless, it sounds like I should neglect INT/Be Smart in favor of WP/Fellowship... I think? Not sure, as I'm still just staring at the Character Creation screen at the moment.

I do plan on using Cassia and Jae for some of my face skills, but I don't know if there are parts of the game where you don't have access to them and have to use your RT's face skills - this bit me big time in WotR where I thought I would always be able to rely on my companion's face skills.

There are some, but Sanctic Officer/GS RT won't have an issue. :)

Even as a GS, you're support Sanctic is going to be so tanky it doesn't matter. On top of that you have Sanctic staff that does tons of damage. A GS Officer Sanctic can just stand in their zone, stack buffs like Shield of the Emperor + Stronghold Strategem, have like 100%+ Armour, deflection in light armour (increasingly getting better), self heals etc etc. On top of that like in one partial "solo" encounter (the first one that pops up in the game), a GS Sanctic with Diversion Zone learned, won't even get attacked once the first ally shows up (and can be seen by enemy), because they become the lowest priority target. You just make a Rear Combat Zone, stand in it, cast something like Stronghold Stratagem on it, and you're no longer attacked once the ally shows up in that encounter. 100x easier than Beta. :p

It's much better, in my opinion, to be a full GS buffing Sanctic that uses GS for always acting first. You can also exploit Strategems to give you extra AP for your Word of the Emperor line of powers. :)

Edit: (Posted bfore I was done! lol)

Hmm like I said you can get away with just keeping your Willpower around 70-80ish imo. I could be wrong. If you go Master Tactician though, you won't need Intelligence so. :)

Also that's what i'm always afraid of in any RPG not making my main the face. Those solo skill checks yuck. :p

[Boomer simpson]

Interesting, so I've never gotten past the end of Act 1 due to a progress-halting bug, but would this long-term plan make sense:

Cassia GS: First Turn(s) to buff
RT Sanctic Psyker GS: First Turn(s) to buff
Jae Master Tactician: Buff and Bring It Down on carry of choice

EDIT: Actually this probably wouldn't work because Jae doesn't get Seize the Initiative

[Balekai]

Originally posted by Boomer simpson:

Interesting, so I've never gotten past the end of Act 1 due to a progress-halting bug, but would this long-term plan make sense:

Cassia GS: First Turn(s) to buff
RT Sanctic Psyker GS: First Turn(s) to buff
Jae Master Tactician: Buff and Bring It Down on carry of choice

EDIT: Actually this probably wouldn't work because Jae doesn't get Seize the Initiative

Jae makes a great Master Tactician actually she's built for it. A good standard build (I replace some of his picks with my own that i didn't think were good:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68S7_KOoqgs&t=1s

Your idea is how I play both of mine (I wish I updated my Main's text build so i could just copy/paste it right now, but it's still prerelease and theoretical in nature/outdated).

However I take it even further:

- Cassia (Full Navigator Talents/Abilities) abusing GS first turn mechanics) + Officers Seize the Moment. Basically this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWJqfVJRPj0&t=1325s

- My main Voidborn Officer/GS also with Seize the Moment. Mostly full Sanctic Psyker buffer totem build, applying Shield, Light and/or Hammer of the Emperor every turn without increasing veil degradation much (if at all, abusing Inscribed Soul which is bugged atm/not working, but I supplement with Toy Box features to mimic its function when I would use it). Stronghold Stratagem, its talent upgrade + Diversion Zone. Then expanding into the talents that give you use of a random stratagem you don't know, free use of one that you do and +1 AP when you use 2 stratagems in one turn on one zone.

- Pascal GS Plasma Gun master who's the actual GS

Essentially 2 Seize the Moment Officer buffing turns, 2 First turns for my Nav Cassia and my Sanctic Main, then Pascal for extra buffing/debuffing/plasma shot. Combined with Argenta I can usually win battles, even boss battles, before a boss even gets a turn (so far lol).

[Cyroy]

You're on the road of becoming your team's main damage dealer! Grab the sanctic staff start buff stacking and see 5,000dmg numbers fly!

[Balekai]

My Sanctic Build in a nutshell and trying to keep it short:

Homeworld: Voidborn, Origin, Sanctioned Psyker (Sanctic), Triumph: Illustrious Glory, Darkest Hour: Shadow of Torment.

Starting Characteristics +10 INT, +10 WILL, +10 FELL.

Officer Levels:

Characteristics: Maxed Fellowship, then Willpower, rounded out Toughness as last investment.
Skills: Persuasion > Coercion > Commerce
Abilities in Order: Shield of the Emperor, Take Aim
Talents in Order: Focus!, Contagious Luck, Inspire Courage, Stabilising Factor, Lasting Impression, Finest Hour! Upgrade IV, Commanding Voice, Psy Rating 1, Seize the Initiative!. Destined (could put Psalms of Heroes here now that it works, but it's not needed until later anyways), Finest Hour! Upgrade II

Grand Strategist Levels:
Characteristics: Maxed Fellowship, then Intelligence, anything else in Willpower.
Skills: Persuasion > Coercion > Commerce
Abilities in Order: Stronghold Strategem, Light of the Emperor, Hammer of the Emperor
Talents in Order: Diversion Zone, Psy Rating 2, Inscribed Soul, Psalms of Heroes, Overcoming Zone, Take and Hold Upgrade didn't care, Improvised Strategy, Strongpoint, Psy rating 3, Enduring Zone or Opening Strategy, Sacred Rituals, Take and Hold upgrade, didn't care.

Exemplar:
- For common talents I pick up Psy Rating 4, Jinx (get those chances to everything around you up by 10%, Eternal Glory for extra main deflection etc. It will not die talent.
- Start looking at some officer talents again to pick up like +3 to resolve etc.
- Possibly pick up Biomancy and the talent that turns overhealing form Light of the Emperor into temporary wounds etc. If healing/sustain isn't an issue, continue to concentrate on filling out the rest of the Officer/GS portions of the build. Maybe focusing on increasing your own damage to buffer out your weakness, or up the damage of the entire team further.
- Pick Exemplar talents that help with support or increase characteristics. The one that heals a % of total wounds at the start of turn is good. This allows me to finally increase maximum wounds with It Will Not Die and still sustain Inscribed Soul use.

[=DeadShot=]

If your FEL is greater than INT don't take Be Smart.
Grand strategists have talents that scale FEL and INT and you will not scale on double INT.

Originally posted by winter:

Originally posted by Kharneater:

As "Be smart" works with resolve, a voidborn can dump fellowship and focus on INT to boost his resolve and use INT bonus for Officer skills. It won't work for Commerce, Coercion and Persuasion. A Grand Strategist won't get (INT + INT) for their abilities so will still need a bit of Fellowship so I'd go for either Vanguard or Master Tactician depending on want/need.

Hope my quick summary will help. Best of luck and have fun gaming.

Are you sure be smart doesn't work for Grand Strategist? Because AFAIK it should, and it's honestly one of the few applications for be smart as it is.

If it doesn't that would be a bug, and I can see how that could happen given how Grand Strategist is somewhat unique in the way that attributes are shared among multiple characters is available.