So, this game is "be a fascist or go home?"

[Gamer de esquerda]

Despite being a colonial fascist officer for a religious-fascist empire, I'm trying to be as nice as I can on the game. And the game punishes you for that with negative narrative consequences and even permanent debuffs on your character if you try to be MINIMALLY good. Algo being good brought no positive consequences at all until now. The game never shows the consequences of my "good boy" decisions, unless they are bad consequences.

Seriously, the creators of this game and/or this universe have serious issues.

[Gamer de esquerda]

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

Originally posted by Gamer de esquerda:

Oh, it's very common to see capitalist westerners depictions of communism in games, I find them actually amusing. The ones I like more are the qunari from Dragon Age.

I don't know anything about the T'Au, but I imagine them to be something like that.

… you’re the first person I’ve ever seen call the Qunari communists

I didn't say they were communists. I say they are how westerners capitalists would kinda depict something akin to communism

"You know they are bad dictators, they brainwash people, but they have some good points"

[Waa7g8]

cry about it

[His Divine Shadow]

Originally posted by Gamer de esquerda:

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

… you’re the first person I’ve ever seen call the Qunari communists

I didn't say they were communists. I say they are how westerners capitalists would kinda depict something akin to communism

"You know they are bad dictators, they brainwash people, but they have some good points"

I mean you’re the one doing that though. And historical examples of nations at least claiming to be communist are pretty much entirely that.

[His Divine Shadow]

Originally posted by Waa7g8:

cry about it

That’s a healthy and measured response.

[Horus Blackheart]

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

Originally posted by Horus Blackheart:

i'll be-leave that when i see it, the tabletopgame has sucked hard since 4th ed in 40k's case. that was when the rot stated lots of streamlining so little Timmy rich parents with more money than sense can pay for his plastic crack habit. The novels used to be good till around 2014 ish then the "messaging" started. To much to hope for to be allowed to enjoy anything with out being lectured at. and I am aware that's ironic considering the thread.

It was always little timmy with rich parents. And “messaging”?

not in the rogue traider (1987 days to 3rd ed back then it was an rpg that morphed in to a solid tactical war game. sure the fluff had some commentary but it was not shoved in your face. Now its very much a caricature of what it once was. "game to hard?" we cant have that lets strip out all your options and charge you tripple the price to refresh all your minis again. Don't forget the overpriced codexes that we will cut to leaflet sizes and make you by 12 when one would do. thats gw today. Also lets enable gluts of mobile port trash.

[His Divine Shadow]

Originally posted by Horus Blackheart:

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

It was always little timmy with rich parents. And “messaging”?

not in the rogue traider (1987 days to 3rd ed back then it was an rpg that morphed in to a solid tactical war game. sure the fluff had some commentary but it was not shoved in your face. Now its very much a caricature of what it once was. "game to hard?" we cant have that lets strip out all your options and charge you tripple the price to refresh all your minis again. Don't forget the overpriced codexes that we will cut to leaflet sizes and make you by 12 when one would do. thats gw today. Also lets enable gluts of mobile port trash.

And about that “messaging”?

[Gamer de esquerda]

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

Originally posted by Gamer de esquerda:

I didn't say they were communists. I say they are how westerners capitalists would kinda depict something akin to communism

"You know they are bad dictators, they brainwash people, but they have some good points"

I mean you’re the one doing that though. And historical examples of nations at least claiming to be communist are pretty much entirely that.

Yeah, I'm sure you are a great student/specialist of the history of countries who ran/run socialist experiments. That's the most common kind of specialist I find on the internet.

[His Divine Shadow]

Originally posted by Gamer de esquerda:

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

I mean you’re the one doing that though. And historical examples of nations at least claiming to be communist are pretty much entirely that.

Yeah, I'm sure you are a great student/specialist of the history of countries who ran/run socialist experiments. That's the most common kind of specialist I find on the internet.

Socialism isn’t communism, I at least know that much.

[Gamer de esquerda]

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

Originally posted by Gamer de esquerda:

Yeah, I'm sure you are a great student/specialist of the history of countries who ran/run socialist experiments. That's the most common kind of specialist I find on the internet.

Socialism isn’t communism, I at least know that much.

Yep, there were nor are communist countries in the world (although they obviously use the word to describe the PARTY), but what we call "socialist experiments" (North Korea, Cuba, China [there's a huge debate here among marxists if China counts], Vietnam, etc)
But of course, we call them communists because we aren't entirely academic all the time (if I were, I wouldn't have called the Imperium "fascist" either, but it's so akin to it, it's easier to use the word).

Each differ from each other because obviously each country has its' own culture, problems to solve and classes and subclasses.

[Horus Blackheart]

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

Originally posted by Horus Blackheart:

not in the rogue traider (1987 days to 3rd ed back then it was an rpg that morphed in to a solid tactical war game. sure the fluff had some commentary but it was not shoved in your face. Now its very much a caricature of what it once was. "game to hard?" we cant have that lets strip out all your options and charge you tripple the price to refresh all your minis again. Don't forget the overpriced codexes that we will cut to leaflet sizes and make you by 12 when one would do. thats gw today. Also lets enable gluts of mobile port trash.

And about that “messaging”?

well there was none of this "the emperor needed a women to make the space marines or other stupid retcons in the name of current day bs. Now the writers think its cleaver to diminish the emperor for their on sensibility not because its a good story or helps the setting. it was crap when the last jedi did lazy deconstruction of sw and this is just as lazy. just gender/ swapping or making a character gay on its face does not a good story make. It's frankly insulting to those community because it has no depth beyond being token and adds nothing of substance thats what i mean by "messaging"

[His Divine Shadow]

Originally posted by Horus Blackheart:

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

And about that “messaging”?

well there was none of this "the emperor needed a women to make the space marines or other stupid retcons in the name of current day bs. Now the writers think its cleaver to diminish the emperor for their on sensibility not because its a good story or helps the setting. it was crap when the last jedi did lazy deconstruction of sw and this is just as lazy. just gender/ swapping or making a character gay on its face does not a good story make. It's frankly insulting to those community because it has no depth beyond being token and adds nothing of substance thats what i mean by "messaging"

Lmao. To all of that. So having the emperor not jack off into test tubes is current day bs? SW didn’t gender swap anything, the new movies are a continuation featuring new characters. And thank you for bravely speaking out for the lgbt community and telling us we need less representation. You’re just… So brave, it’s bringing a tear to my eye

The emperor is too manly and divine for a woman! Lmao

I always get a good chuckle out of hyper/toxic masculinity. It’s so ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ over the top homoerotic yet also hates gay people. It’s just absurd

[His Divine Shadow]

Originally posted by Gamer de esquerda:

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

Socialism isn’t communism, I at least know that much.

Yep, there were nor are communist countries in the world (although they obviously use the word to describe the PARTY), but what we call "socialist experiments" (North Korea, Cuba, China [there's a huge debate here among marxists if China counts], Vietnam, etc)
But of course, we call them communists because we aren't entirely academic all the time (if I were, I wouldn't have called the Imperium "fascist" either, but it's so akin to it, it's easier to use the word).

Each differ from each other because obviously each country has its' own culture, problems to solve and classes and subclasses.

Well I’ll agree with you there that there hasn’t actually been a by definition communist nation. That’s why I said “by nations that at least claim to be”

[Balekai]

Originally posted by Gamer de esquerda:

Originally posted by Horus Blackheart:

tau = space communists there now people can misuse another definition :P

Oh, it's very common to see capitalist westerners depictions of communism in games, I find them actually amusing. The ones I like more are the qunari from Dragon Age.

I don't know anything about the T'Au, but I imagine them to be something like that.

Tau are a race that used to be extremely violent and chaotic Tool/Bronze Age people. They were found by an Imperial vessel or fleet can't remember and were scheduled for Exterminatus. Then a Warp storm happened mysteriously as they were preparing and prevented access to Tau space for 4000 years or some such.

Anyways when the storms subsided the tool/bronze age race was super advanced with multiple colonial expansions, and technology on par with the Imperium (and in other ways more advanced). What happened in between was that a mysterious cast of Tau arrived out of no where during a siege of a City called the Ethereals, which immediate brought peace to the conflict and the planet. They basically have a special ability to control Tau (pheromones or something and it's suspected that they're the result of otherworldly interventions like the Harlequins making super T'au aka Ethereals because they near 0 Warp signature).

Anyways they united the Tau under a strict egalitarian governance and idealistic structure called "The Greater Good." Everyone is equal.. Except for the fact that everything is regimented into strict class structures called castes. Every citizen has a strict job and function with little to no deviation outside of it that they perform for life every day of every hour pretty much.

There is no true freedom. You do what the Ethereal and your Caste tell you to do. Even though everyone is equal and egalitarian, by default due to power structures the Ethereals are supreme and have all the power. Just like what eventually happens in Communist societies when the one Party system takes hold and the Premier and his buddies take all the power and resources of the state. Then the Military (Fire Caste) is second in power and maybe Water caste (Diplomats?).

The Tau get mistaken for space Communists because Communist states always devolve into the T'au form of government. A highly class based system where there's those with power at the top, then the military, then everyone else. The difference between a real world Communist State and the T'au is that Communist States ironically are trying to eliminate class structure through governance then do the opposite and reinforce it. T'au embrace it as a core to their ideology (The Greater Good).

Communism would be great if in reality Human nature and finite resources didn't get in the way.

This isn't even really a retcon. Tau have always been suspicious and basically enslave lesser races with things such as Mind control etc. Even to Gue’vesa (Human helpers), they do things like make them sterile or when Cadia fell and they started to all become warp sensitive or whatever, a Tau General started wiping Humans out. Mostly spooked spooked by the events of a failed expansion.

Tau tried to use Imperium like warp technology and their version of Gallar Fields failed. Most of the entire expansion fleet was lost and those that were saved was because the Gue’vesa on board the remaining ships, prayed hard enough to the Greater Good to create a huge Tau formed Warp entity that saved the survivors pulling the remaining fleet out of the warp. It was kind of cool because we don't see Tau vs Chaos in the Warp. Tau as a race having near 0 warp presence were able to fight well in the warp without corruption but still were getting massacred. But it was the Humans cowering and praying that saved the day lol.

[Horus Blackheart]

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

Originally posted by Horus Blackheart:

well there was none of this "the emperor needed a women to make the space marines or other stupid retcons in the name of current day bs. Now the writers think its cleaver to diminish the emperor for their on sensibility not because its a good story or helps the setting. it was crap when the last jedi did lazy deconstruction of sw and this is just as lazy. just gender/ swapping or making a character gay on its face does not a good story make. It's frankly insulting to those community because it has no depth beyond being token and adds nothing of substance thats what i mean by "messaging"

Lmao. To all of that. So having the emperor not jack off into test tubes is current day bs? SW didn’t gender swap anything, the new movies are a continuation featuring new characters. And thank you for bravely speaking out for the lgbt community and telling us we need less representation. You’re just… So brave, it’s bringing a tear to my eye

I never said they need less representation I said if they are going to make a character a minority they need give more narrative reasons to support that character change other than just "well they are a minority now look how progressive we are. Also please actually spend money instead of just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ on social media, oh and dont get mad when we work out its not profitable doing tokenism stuff like this and change it again "thanks - modern entertainment corps

[ChompyRiley]

Originally posted by Horus Blackheart:

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

And about that “messaging”?

well there was none of this "the emperor needed a women to make the space marines or other stupid retcons in the name of current day bs. Now the writers think its cleaver to diminish the emperor for their on sensibility not because its a good story or helps the setting. it was crap when the last jedi did lazy deconstruction of sw and this is just as lazy. just gender/ swapping or making a character gay on its face does not a good story make. It's frankly insulting to those community because it has no depth beyond being token and adds nothing of substance thats what i mean by "messaging"

Alright, take notes people it's now gay for...

*checks notes*

a heterosexual man to have sex with a woman for the purpose of procreation and breeding a race of super-soldiers to protect the galaxy.