Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader

Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader

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aramintai Dec 24, 2023 @ 4:40am
Why aren't there repercussion for Theodora's killer
Aside from the reveal in chapter 3, which I'm not sure would have even happened if a certain companion wasn't taken to party at the start of said chapter, nothing ever comes out of it. No talking about it, no trial, no nothing. Is it a bug or a narrative oversight?
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Showing 121-135 of 239 comments
kotor_fan Dec 25, 2023 @ 12:18pm 
My only problem with the reveal wasn't not having trial (for what? Executing a heretic?).

It was not being able to release companion AFTER the Act 3.
Like, I'd have to be a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ moron to tell that companion to tell that companion to get lost right before potentially deadly fight (was supposed to be impossible to win).
Now, after we're back to safety of a ship, off you go love. Get ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ lost. I don't trust you. Out of my ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ vessel.

Sure, I can go to that person and use standard "go away" conversation option, but that's just lazy.
Would much prefer to have had proper conversation.
I Denizen I Dec 25, 2023 @ 1:38pm 
I strongly disagree.

If Argenta felt strongly enough to go against the personal representative of the Emperor of Mankind and execute them for heresy she would not conceal it, she is a zealot, a zealot of the worst stripe, she'd be proud and she would not see any reason to conceal it, she just executed one of the most powerful members of the Imperium for heresy (as far as she's concerned) it's not something a zealot would conceal or feel guilt or second guess her actions over.

Yet when we go and find Theodora, with Argenta she says nothing, no statement of the removal of a dangerous heretical person who could have done incalculable damage to the Imperium from her lofty position, and how justified she was in doing so.

No warning to the PC about picking up the shards, or what would happen if they did not follow the straight and narrow.

I had zero expectations Argenta was responsible, she just would not have done it, not ever. And she would have most definitely used her boltgun for it, she wouldn't try concealing her actions, shes a zealot, one who believes the Emperor is everything, a RT is his personal agent, it would be a monumental thing for a sister to turn on a RT, like a sanity shattering event. I did not take Argenta in my party when I got ambushed and taken to Commoragh, so I missed the reveal.

I was expecting to find out the Lord Inquisitor had used an Imperial Assassin to remove her, because she wasn't pliable to his requests, and thought you would be as a complete greenhorn RT, it's all sorts of lame they went with a lowly sister of battle breaking faith with the GE to kill Theodora.

Disappointing writing.
Voodoo Dec 25, 2023 @ 2:13pm 
Originally posted by TaKo:
cause she executed the head of a rogue trader dynasty, while justified as far as imperial law goes, we could have easily decided that she acted wrongly/without enough evidence and kill her for it while she still had her mission

again im not saying the whole deal was done well but it makes sense for her to initially want to hide what happened
Dont have quote on hand, but none of the adeptus is subject to imperial law.

If not for that exemption they would all have to be arrested, for either being psykers or having standing armies.
Last edited by Voodoo; Dec 25, 2023 @ 2:17pm
I Denizen I Dec 25, 2023 @ 2:19pm 
Originally posted by Voodoo:
Originally posted by TaKo:
cause she executed the head of a rogue trader dynasty, while justified as far as imperial law goes, we could have easily decided that she acted wrongly/without enough evidence and kill her for it while she still had her mission

again im not saying the whole deal was done well but it makes sense for her to initially want to hide what happened
Dont have quote on hand, but none of the adeptus is subject to imperial law.

Lex Imperialis applies to everyone, apart from maybe the Adeptus Custodes.

Its like claiming our laws don't apply to our police, and while some individual police officers may behave like this is true it's not in fact true, our laws apply to our law enforcers.

I mean you think Arbities dont have to follow the law, or the Imperial military? you know what commissars are right? not just political enforcers but military police.

Even inquisitors have to follow Imperial law, or have a legitimate reason for not doing so, or they get accused of being heretics, just like everyone else.
Voodoo Dec 25, 2023 @ 2:42pm 
Originally posted by I Denizen I:
Originally posted by Voodoo:
Dont have quote on hand, but none of the adeptus is subject to imperial law.

Lex Imperialis applies to everyone, apart from maybe the Adeptus Custodes.

Its like claiming our laws don't apply to our police, and while some individual police officers may behave like this is true it's not in fact true, our laws apply to our law enforcers.

I mean you think Arbities dont have to follow the law, or the Imperial military? you know what commissars are right? not just political enforcers but military police.

Even inquisitors have to follow Imperial law, or have a legitimate reason for not doing so, or they get accused of being heretics, just like everyone else.
Theres problem with that, cause being a psyker is a crime in 40k, that would put adeptus astra telepathica in constant problems with judges, i wont mention how many laws existence of mechanicus breaks that are not merely their religious beliefs, then we have standing armies of sororitas and astartes either of which are illegal by even astra militarum standards.

They also cant apply to navis nobilite, because they are all mutants and thats punishable by death too.

But like i said on the above i do not have quote at hand, you dont have to just believe my word.

as for inquisitors
"An Inquisitor is subject to no one; the only censure he
might receive must come from his fellow Inquisitors, and
each is constantly examining the others for signs of heresy
or treachery."
Last edited by Voodoo; Dec 25, 2023 @ 3:03pm
I Denizen I Dec 25, 2023 @ 3:06pm 
Dude,

Adeptus Astra Telepathica is an enforcement system, they take unsanctioned psykers and sanction them, making them lawful, legal citizens and contributing members of imperial society, it's literally the point of the entire organisation to make psykers legal.

Navigators, and the Navis Nobilitle are directly empowered and created by the GEoM himself, they are so essential for the Imperium to function, but even they have to follow the rest of the rules of the Imperium, they have exemptions on mutation and anything else connected with it, but they certainly have to be law abiding with the rest of Lex Imperialis.
(read wolfblade for more info on this very subject.)

Inquisitors are empowered to root out people not following Lex Imperialis, they absolutely have to follow it themselves, they only get to ignore it for very specific reasons, (again like a police officer breaking the speeding limit when driving a vehicle attending an emergency.) they are held to Lex Imperialis, why do you think the Inquisition is at war with itself? why do you think there are so many factions of the Inquisition itself? because of interpretations over Lex Imperials itself and how it applies to them as Inquisitors, puritan inquisitors believe in it absolutely and use it absolutely. (read Eisenhorn for a great example.)


That quote you pasted has nothing to do with Lex Imperialis which is the Emperors Law for his empire, you think Inquisitors get to ignore the Emperor of Mankind? you're delusional.
Khloros Dec 25, 2023 @ 3:16pm 
Generally speaking she did nothing wrong. But also because the writing in the game falls off a cliff post chapter 3, and something that should be addressed is never brought up, ever again, once, ever.
Voodoo Dec 25, 2023 @ 3:23pm 
Originally posted by I Denizen I:
That quote you pasted has nothing to do with Lex Imperialis which is the Emperors Law for his empire, you think Inquisitors get to ignore the Emperor of Mankind? you're delusional.
Naturally theres no direct quote that inquisitors are not subject to imperial law when they are not subject to anything but themselves.

It is natural conclusion that if arbites enforce the imperial law and inquisitors are not subject to arbites they are not subject to imperial law.

"Inquisitors are empowered to ensure the survival of
the Imperium, however extreme the measures required, and no
matter the cost. They undertake any deed, no matter how vile
or underhanded it may be, to discharge their sacred trust."
that doesnt sound like description of imperial law to me, any law in fact.

As for imperial law itself every day hundred new tomes of laws are passed and by m41.999 its said that the building holding copy of imperial law is taking up miles(there was a rogue trader who sent entire transport ship just to get a copy of current law). Ruling are said to be contradictionary and entire thing is up to individual judge interpretation and in case it goes into trial its said that these cases take centuries or even millenia and judgement is laid out on descendants of offender.
Imperial law is impossible to follow, everyone breaks it.
Last edited by Voodoo; Dec 25, 2023 @ 3:28pm
Voodoo Dec 25, 2023 @ 3:34pm 
Originally posted by I Denizen I:
Adeptus Astra Telepathica is an enforcement system, they take unsanctioned psykers and sanction them, making them lawful, legal citizens and contributing members of imperial society, it's literally the point of the entire organisation to make psykers legal.
Another thing, you do not understand what my argument is.

Whether they are legal are not, they would be subject to arrest. They would be released eventually but that means they oculd be held for a long period of time with astropathic messages taking months or years to reach certain people.

People like that have to be above the law otherwise imperium would crumble waiting for beaurocracy to clear them.
Last edited by Voodoo; Dec 25, 2023 @ 3:34pm
JimmysTheBestCop Dec 25, 2023 @ 4:09pm 
Originally posted by Khloros:
Generally speaking she did nothing wrong. But also because the writing in the game falls off a cliff post chapter 3, and something that should be addressed is never brought up, ever again, once, ever.

See this is the thing. I could get over Argenta doing if it's out of character.

But literally it is never brought up again. Hell cassia makes a comment about Jae lying about her past. No crap Jae is rogue who cares.

Argenta killing Theodora nah not important enough to discuss.

Argenta Abelard Pasqal Idira barely say anything or make comments about anything. I honestly never even cared about them because they barely felt like part of the story.

People are like the companions are good. They are very cardboard. WotR I felt companions way better even kingmaker.

Honestly I couldn't care less about about Kunrad or Theodora or the murder or the missing tech priest leader who we find out about it.

We aren't remotely connected to any of these events.

Maybe if we actually knew these people first the traitor and murder would actually mean something.

I think this game gets a lot of positive reviews cause most players don't make it out of act 2 or continually do rebuilds over and over.

I think it was Owlcats worst storytelling. The game has wh40k without that I would give the game 2 stars out of 4. It's very average
Hound Dec 25, 2023 @ 4:58pm 
Originally posted by JimmysTheBestCop:
Originally posted by Khloros:
Generally speaking she did nothing wrong. But also because the writing in the game falls off a cliff post chapter 3, and something that should be addressed is never brought up, ever again, once, ever.

See this is the thing. I could get over Argenta doing if it's out of character.

But literally it is never brought up again. Hell cassia makes a comment about Jae lying about her past. No crap Jae is rogue who cares.

Argenta killing Theodora nah not important enough to discuss.

Argenta Abelard Pasqal Idira barely say anything or make comments about anything. I honestly never even cared about them because they barely felt like part of the story.

People are like the companions are good. They are very cardboard. WotR I felt companions way better even kingmaker.

I feel I gotta disagree here. I really liked most of the companions in Rogue Trader, and none of them are as bad as the worst WOTR ones (IMHO)

I think they aren't super characterized but they also have good personalities they stick too. Sure it would be great if there were huge reveals they do, but I appreciate a well designed but not deep NPC.

Abelard is my boy and I'd do anything for my Space Butler.

I still can't believe thats who killed T and that there was no investigation or examination into it once the warp died down. If you had asked me at the end of act 2 what killed her I would have bet money it was either a rogue assassin from the Inquisition (or someone strong), an Eldar something, or a very skilled Chaos Imperial. I was absolutely stunned it wrapped up in such a quick and dumb way.

As I said before if she was blown away from rounds from the local holy sister using an extremely specific weapon, it should be so utterly obvious with even the most basic forensic investigation who dun it.
JimmysTheBestCop Dec 25, 2023 @ 5:00pm 
Abelard is the most boring character. It's liking watching paint dry
Paladin Dec 25, 2023 @ 5:03pm 
Originally posted by Alucard:
Not to mention that if it was X from the start - our characters would see that she was killed by Bolter becasue then both Theodora and her Arch-Militant would have characteristic BIG OPEN WOUNDS AFTER EXPLOSION OF BOLTER ROUND. It was clearly not meant to be X as X says later "I rised my bolter and killed her". Owlcat just knew there is no way they can finish Act 4 and 5 in time so they cut that plotline. There is zero mentioning that theodora is in pieces because of bolter round and whole party examines the bodies.


X has an autopistol as the 2nd weapon set. Evidence shows Theodors and Mort died from Autopistol fire.

That is the clue that was there since the very beginning.
Hound Dec 25, 2023 @ 5:17pm 
autopistol fire also makes even less sense. So the Sister saw something so heretical from her hero, she holstered her favored weapon, that she had out and ready, and pulled a pistol from her belt. But then also she did it from across the room? And managed to nail not just the RT behind a desk, but also a fully armored stormtrooper?

Amazing.

If she went in there with the intention to murder them both I understand that could happen. But thats not how she confesses. She says she snapped and went for her gun.
Last edited by Hound; Dec 25, 2023 @ 5:19pm
Paladin Dec 25, 2023 @ 6:43pm 
Originally posted by Old Man Hound:
autopistol fire also makes even less sense. So the Sister saw something so heretical from her hero, she holstered her favored weapon, that she had out and ready, and pulled a pistol from her belt. But then also she did it from across the room? And managed to nail not just the RT behind a desk, but also a fully armored stormtrooper?

Amazing.

If she went in there with the intention to murder them both I understand that could happen. But thats not how she confesses. She says she snapped and went for her gun.

Bolter is innacurate, specially the one she has. Autopistol deals less damage but is more accurate.

Since they didn't expect her to shoot, the autopistol is better to get the drop on both of them.

Say what you will about how they handled it, using the autopistol makes sense.

You don't use a hammer to kill a fly.
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Date Posted: Dec 24, 2023 @ 4:40am
Posts: 239