Want to love the game, but the skills/talents etc are too many and too specific

[Aurite]

I am struggling with the skills/talents. There are too many to pick from. The ones that sound good have a formula I need to work out and seem to be too specific.

I cant remember all the passives and multipliers and things I have selected for 9 different characters. Please, please reduce the amount of skills and make them more meaningful.

Does every different class need to generate stacks of different resources? Does every class need 6 ways to generate the stacks of resource and then have 9 different ways to expend those stacks? Can some of the 0 AP cost skills just be passives or an aura or something? There has to be a meaningful way to cull the skill bloat.

The ones that add straight + to skills or stats are great, easy to understand and easy to use and easy to plan ahead and think, well I want that extra 15% parry bonus, and I will add more Strength so I can get Heavy Armour. Great, makes sense.

But...."on the first turn after the character uses a stack of random-name-here, the following something will be % of X - 4(per stack of something-or-other)PER/2 within 2 squares of the character but only if no enemies are withing 3 squares or wearing brown underpants"

[Schutzengel]

Fully agree. Talents and Abilities need a rework.

I picked maybe 2 understandable "Class" Talents for each character and then went to pick Common Talents instead when I could pick Class Talents. Stat +5 is understandable, almost all of the Class Talents are not.

Adding to this, ALL Abilities are restricted to 1 Round. Rather, Abilities should last several Rounds and Cooldowns should be many Rounds too. This way, each time you click on something, that click did something meaningful. The current game is a clickfest and I hate it.

Ideally, Talents should come with Ranks, so half the # of Talents but with 2x the Ranks immediately leads to half the clutter we have now.

[tempest.of.emptiness]

For good for bad, that level of complexity is going to remain. It is too integral to the game system to remove now. They could have made a much simpler system from the beginning, but they didn't, and if they were going to change to a simpler system now they'd have to rework and rebalance the entire game.

That's just not going to happen.

[dolby]

nah talents are fine problem is the tooltips... and the fact that 1/3 of talent are bugged....

[katzenkrimis]

It's not that bad.

Pick all of the standard, simple and basic stuff first, like you've been doing.

When you've exhausted the obvious, take a quick look at the recommended ones at the top.

Then scroll down to the very bottom and look at those.

That's it.

The middle I only look at if I want to specialize in something. Like a melta gun or something.

[dolby]

Originally posted by tempest.of.emptiness:

that level of complexity

the complexity is low just explanation and presentation of the talents is bad.

If every talent /skill would have a video of what it does and have good tooltip the complexity wouldn't even exist...

[Phy]

Originally posted by tempest.of.emptiness:

For good for bad, that level of complexity is going to remain. It is too integral to the game system to remove now. They could have made a much simpler system from the beginning, but they didn't, and if they were going to change to a simpler system now they'd have to rework and rebalance the entire game.

That's just not going to happen.

I got good news to you then, cause it isn't balanced to begin with. Not crying over difficulty or anything, just saying balancing is not something that was done in the first place so THAT in particular definitely won't be the reason a rework is out of the question.

[mallard1313]

I think the complexity is really difficult to deal with because of the way it's presented: scrolling through hundreds of options nine times for every level with no way to see everything on a single screen. Leveling up is exhausting in this game.

[ferreirajc87]

It's really not that complicated at all, when you realize the vast majority of talents can be ignored. I'm talking about the base skill talents for example.

[Vielo]

I don't really understand why +skill and +ability talents couldn't just have been numbers. They should have divided level ups into two parts: spending points to improve abilities/skills and then taking actually meaningful talents.

It seems like a non issue but I really dislike the fact that because of this I have to scroll through a LONG list to find and either pick a new talent or check an existing one in battle in case I forget what my characters can do.

Also: why the hell are tooltips for base skills not updated with new effect info once they get upgraded on level ups? Why do I have to either remember or check which particular talent in a very fast growing list is beneficial to a skill I'm using? It's absurd.

I was managing more or less OK until level 16 but with the tier 2 archetypes ♥♥♥♥ is getting bonkers. It's just too much to keep track of. I tink they are needlessly overcomplicated and force you to waste too much time to buff/set up zones/distribute exploits/whatever, especially considering how much combat there is in the game.

This could have been much simpler and enjoyable without losing any of the depth. Is it how the tabletop Rouge Trader works too? Were they forced to keep all those systems because of licensing or someting?

[tainawoman]

Well, I love Owlcat games for their complexity at level up. It's the best game feature for me, because in RPGs I like the most to think about how to improve my characters. Trying to play BG3, I learnt this thing about me.

After you read several times the list of features (skills and talents), you kinda learn them and their dependencies. And then think about on what path you want to send your characters.

I love the versatility of builds, even though RT has a complex system and it seems that not all of them are viable (yet). If the system would be simpler, then we would have fewer ways to build them, and then all the same it could be automatic. I hope with all my heart that their games will remain complex and a big part of playing their games will be to think a lot before finding a way to build your optimal party of heroes with their synergies and combat strategy.

[Tozobi]

Originally posted by dolby:

nah talents are fine problem is the tooltips... and the fact that 1/3 of talent are bugged....

This. Pathfinder was far worse with its min maxing and various requirements. You can even plan ahead far more easily in this game. But tooltips on this are horrid, and several talents do not work at all.

[Mack]

Just google for a character build and follow the first 15 skills. After that point you probably have most of what a character needs, and I only bothered doing two types of build (cassia & my MC sniper) and after that I knew enough I could pick the rest on my own.

That said, I do think the skill system could have been portrayed to the user in a better manner.

[Neonivek]

Once you learn what those skills are and remember them... it becomes a LOT easier.

[Coldhands]

Yeah, there’s definitely talent bloat and the tool tips should definitely also provided the numbers derived from the formulae.

[Johnny 5]

These things were all mentioned to owl at during beta testing, but they didn't change them and instead decided to release Dev diaries saying the opposite. It was bizarre. That and add multiplayer