heresy is way too unrealistic. No way you could get away with it

[VladK02]

During the electro-priest monastery, one of the dialogue lines is...
(heresy +3 or whatever) Back away from the console Aurora, im our new masters' favorite !!!

And Inquisitor's acolyte goes "Interesting choice of words"

Bruh. Thats not an "interesting choice of words". That's a bolt pistol to the temple right then and there. From the inquisitor boy, from the sister, from the not one but TWO psykers that can see literally everything youre doing, like stealing sword shards, making pacts with the warp... What kind of Emperor's servants are you lot?? Im balls-deep in chaos, right in plain sight!

I fully expected to have to kill the inquisitor boy in the temple. But no, he let it go. (At least, for now).

I feel that heresy in the game is too obvious, at least in chapter 1.

The Dogmatic choices of comedic 'execute everything and everyone for any slight whatsoever just because - then execute some more" - thats 40k staple, sure. Thats well done.

But heresy? Meh...

And if the Theodora or whatever, the original captain, was also a heretic - which she was, according to the xenos loot stash in her ship - then why are her (and now mine) companions not heretics?? Irida is just cool with witnessing chaos corruption everywhere and not speaking up? And same with the navigator chick?

[NixAhmose]

Originally posted by Voodoo:

Originally posted by NixAhmose:

Yeah, I wish there was more of a gradual descent into heresy. The game already locks off dialogue morality options based on how much you committed to them, so I feel like it was entirely possible for them to write heresy 0/1 as more reasonable than it is currently.

There kinda is, its called iconoclast.

Iconoclast is mostly just your typical good guy persona who rarely if ever openly goes against the status quo. They’ll defy tradition sure, but everything iconoclast is still for the good of the Imperium.

What I was hoping for was for heretical options where you gradually become jaded with the Imperium before transitioning into open rebellion against the Imperium to finally becoming a full on chaos worshipper.

[Voodoo]

Originally posted by NixAhmose:

Originally posted by Voodoo:

There kinda is, its called iconoclast.

Iconoclast is mostly just your typical good guy persona who rarely if ever openly goes against the status quo. They’ll defy tradition sure, but everything iconoclast is still for the good of the Imperium.

What I was hoping for was for heretical options where you gradually become jaded with the Imperium before transitioning into open rebellion against the Imperium to finally becoming a full on chaos worshipper.

Youre right but look up, both iconoclast and heretic push you on radical scale.

And iconoclast is not just good guy, it have option to denounce emperor as a god, you can tell priest you dont believe in his stuff, you side with xenos, you help cold trader, its non chaos traitor deeper into game.

[I Denizen I]

The Warrant also elevates the recipient to the HIGHEST of ranks to which a servant may rise.

Granting him EQUIVALENT status with such men and women as Imperial Commanders, Inquisitors, and Space Marine Chapter Masters.

Why are you asking if the Imperial Commanders are low rank? it states it pretty clearly that Imperial Commanders are of the highest of ranks, and equivalent to Rogue Traders, Inquisitors, and Chapter Masters.

If I remember correctly Imperial Commanders were something like Planetary rulers/Governors.

It's not vague, or worded funny, or even really open to interpretation.
"The Bearer of the Warrant is elevated to the highest ranks to which a servant may rise." IE you cannot go any higher, you're at the top of of the Imperial structure with the other luminaries.

Another quote for you to ignore.

"The Warrant of Trade is not just a title and its associated rights and responsibilities--It is an actual document, and perhaps the single most prised piece of parchment in the Imperium.
Much like the rosette carried by an Inquisitor, the Warrant is proof incontrovertible of a Rogue Trader's authority."

[Steel]

Interesting argument, I just wanna add that Argenta is the one who killed Theodora, she walked in on her, saw the crystals, and shot her almost instinctually

That being said, would the characters be in the right to kill you for saying stuff like that? Legally speaking. Maybe? Maybe not. But in all likelyhood they would.

[Solomon Kane]

Originally posted by I Denizen I:

The Warrant also elevates the recipient to the HIGHEST of ranks to which a servant may rise.

Granting him EQUIVALENT status with such men and women as Imperial Commanders, Inquisitors, and Space Marine Chapter Masters.

Why are you asking if the Imperial Commanders are low rank? it states it pretty clearly that Imperial Commanders are of the highest of ranks, and equivalent to Rogue Traders, Inquisitors, and Chapter Masters.

If I remember correctly Imperial Commanders were something like Planetary rulers/Governors.

It's not vague, or worded funny, or even really open to interpretation.
"The Bearer of the Warrant is elevated to the highest ranks to which a servant may rise." IE you cannot go any higher, you're at the top of of the Imperial structure with the other luminaries.

Another quote for you to ignore.

"The Warrant of Trade is not just a title and its associated rights and responsibilities--It is an actual document, and perhaps the single most prised piece of parchment in the Imperium.
Much like the rosette carried by an Inquisitor, the Warrant is proof incontrovertible of a Rogue Trader's authority."

Like the Legendary Commissar Holt, who held the Rank of Imperial Commander, he did command not only the Imperial Army in his Campaign against the Orcs on Augustgrad but also the Ultramarines along with the Iron Legion.

And he did not miss to slap the Planetary Gouvernor and held him under gunpoint for incompetence once he arrived, until he surrendered his planetary Troops and General also to Holts Command.

[I Denizen I]

Yes it's very questionable, a Rogue trader who had carefully weeded his/her followers out to be absolutely sure of their loyalty I could maybe see doing some of the things here (ingame).

But a newly raised RT, in the middle of an uprising, with people who he/she doesn't really know, or have complete loyalty from, it would be madness itself.

I have read Dan Abnett's Eisenhorn and Ravenor series, and they have some very interesting bad guys (Molocht/Orfeo) and some very subtle chaos shenanigans going on, masquerading as Imperial Authority doing it's thing.

Eisenhorn has the Glaws and a situation somewhat like what happens ingame, they are all hidden until it flips to mad anarchy and chaos space marines and xenos.

Here I just honestly couldn't see any Imperial personage behaving the way you do on the Heretic path, because you're just pretty much openly going "I <3 Chaos, sign me up." which is suicide for anyone who was not planning on instantly absconding / taking over, but here we keep doing the Imp stuff.

I'd love some more subtlety in the writing, I mean they make good use of your private quarters on the ship, they could easily have put hidden options in the chat so your char says one thing publicly (but secretly orders your seneschal to do the opposite for example.)
And had more scenes where you're up to no good in private.

[Voodoo]

Originally posted by I Denizen I:

The Warrant also elevates the recipient to the HIGHEST of ranks to which a servant may rise.

Granting him EQUIVALENT status with such men and women as Imperial Commanders, Inquisitors, and Space Marine Chapter Masters.

Why are you asking if the Imperial Commanders are low rank? it states it pretty clearly that Imperial Commanders are of the highest of ranks, and equivalent to Rogue Traders, Inquisitors, and Chapter Masters.

If I remember correctly Imperial Commanders were something like Planetary rulers/Governors.

It's not vague, or worded funny, or even really open to interpretation.
"The Bearer of the Warrant is elevated to the highest ranks to which a servant may rise." IE you cannot go any higher, you're at the top of of the Imperial structure with the other luminaries.

Another quote for you to ignore.

"The Warrant of Trade is not just a title and its associated rights and responsibilities--It is an actual document, and perhaps the single most prised piece of parchment in the Imperium.
Much like the rosette carried by an Inquisitor, the Warrant is proof incontrovertible of a Rogue Trader's authority."

Well if imperial commander truly just means planetary governor(and going over the rogue trader rpg that appears who they mean) then thats a bit problem, normal planterary governors can be replaced at any time by administratum.

Chapter master is planetary governor so redundant to mention it.

But list will include
1)Fabricator General
2)High Ecclesiarch
3)Chapter masters
4)Militarum Commander
5)Head judge(blinking on name now)
6)Navy Admirals
7)Lord Comissar.

It literally will include anyone but scholastica psykana, navis nobilite and sororitas as far as factions are concerned.

How is inquisition doing anything if they apparently cant touch anyone and all of those people are equal rank to one who answers only to god emperor.

Next sentence of that quote though says

"The Warrant also elevates the recipient to the highest of ranks to
which a servant may rise, granting him equivalent status with
such men and women as Imperial Commanders, Inquisitors and
Space Marine Chapter Masters. They are granted the power to
deal with such peers of the Imperium as equals, and the Warrant
allowing them to call upon what aid they can negotiate."

So either they have the power of a inquisitor or it simply means they have right to bear armies and commence trade on planetary level.

""The Warrant of Trade and a starship to enforce it—these are the
critical tools for a Rogue Trader. Without the former, he is merely
a renegade. Without the latter, he is a forsaken drifter doomed to an
anonymous death.”"

This basically confirms that only reason they can keep a ship is warrant, without permit individual citizen is not allowed to posses ship or army.

[Solomon Kane]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiaJldR39A8

[Innominatam]

A Space Marine Chapter master is far more then a planatory governor......how you keep saying such stupid things

[Voodoo]

Originally posted by E.:

A Space Marine Chapter master is far more then a planatory governor......how you keep saying such stupid things

both quotes from same book

"granting him equivalent status with
such men and women as Imperial Commanders, Inquisitors and
Space Marine Chapter Masters. "

"The worlds of the Imperium are governed by hereditary
rulers called Imperial Commanders or Planetary Governors.
The Imperial Commander holds his planet or system on
behalf of the Emperor. In return for his oath of loyalty and
regular planetary tithes, he controls the planet as his own.
The Imperial Commander is free to administrate and defend
his planet as he sees fit. "

mimick wording on warrant
"By the authority of the Senatorum Imperialis, this Warrant places the Bearer as a peer to the great powers of the Imperium, inter alia: Imperial Commanders, Chapter Masters of the Adeptus Astartes, and the masters of the Holy Orders of the Emperor’s Inquisition."

I mean thats what was being thrown at me over and over saying rogue trader is equal to chapter master, but if he is equal to chapter master and planetary governor then planetary governor is equal to to chapter master too.

[Innominatam]

Imperial commanders means ranks like Lord Commander Militant of the Imperial Guard Lord Commander etc the highest ranks of the Imperial Guard

[DaveDash]

Originally posted by E.:

Originally posted by Voodoo:

No it makes no difference whatsoever. The old ones are considered to be more prestigious but theres nothing stopping rogue trader with warrant signed in last 200 years to reach same level of prestige.

Its simply fact that if dynasty managed to survive 11-12k years they are usually doing good job, but amount of lost ones indicates its not common occurence.

Your horribly wrong but there is no reason to debate this, the lore doesn't agree with you nor does canon at all.

Lets end this here respectfully.

The Eisenhorn books disagree with you.

Inquisitors can do whatever the ♥♥♥♥ they want so long as they have the firepower and allies to back themselves up.

They may not mess with a RT because of that, but they’d absolutely execute one if they could get away with it.

They try and execute each other, don’t forget.

Eisenhorn would use his “friend” on a RT without hesitation and get away with it, if he thought he needed to. He wouldn’t give two ♥♥♥♥♥ about the writ.

[Voodoo]

Originally posted by E.:

Imperial commanders means ranks like Lord Commander Militant of the Imperial Guard Lord Commander etc the highest ranks of the Imperial Guard

I just provided quote from same book of what they mean, its not commander militant, its planetary governor.

"Ultimately, however, most Imperial worlds
are ruled by a planetary governor (sometimes known as an
Imperial Commander) who has final authority over the world
as the Imperium’s chosen representative. "

[Innominatam]

Yes they can do whatever they want.....but there is a difference between acting within legal means vs just doing whatever you wish.

This is what the inquisition is known for, they have gotten to insane they think they can just do whatever they want but the second they mess with the wrong people and they do not have the firepower they get executed. They can certianly F with lower status people no problem illegally because they know full well they will get away with it

We are not saying Inquisitors cannot act we are saying legally speaking they cannot just do whatever they want.

That is also canon in the Eisenhon books and you even justr said it yourself

"and get away with it"

Sure they can break the "law" or go past their legal "authority" but there is a difference between that and having a legal right.

You clearly did not read the discussion.

[Innominatam]

Originally posted by Voodoo:

Originally posted by E.:

Imperial commanders means ranks like Lord Commander Militant of the Imperial Guard Lord Commander etc the highest ranks of the Imperial Guard

I just provided quote from same book of what they mean, its not commander militant, its planetary governor.

"Ultimately, however, most Imperial worlds
are ruled by a planetary governor (sometimes known as an
Imperial Commander) who has final authority over the world
as the Imperium’s chosen representative. "

Dear god...Imperial Commander is an Umbrella Term

Like how for the russians. Spetsnaz isn't a particular military unit but rather general word to refer to all special forces within their military

etc a simple term used to describe multiple positions rather then be highly specific each time