Levelling is probably my least favourite part so far.....

[Flavalicious]

Dare i say the level ups are way too close apart? Feels like im picking 6 level up options after every fight and then even sometimes after doing chat interactions lol.

The game could really use some more "suggested picks" as well. Just to help with times where your not fully sure what you want to choose out of the listings.

[Steeb]

the game gives you suggested picks when you level up, you can see a little green thumb up icon on the option

[Drake]

The problem is that there are levels.

The pnp version of rogue trader doesn't have levels. It's a perk buy system. Every skill, ability and stat advancement has an xp cost and you pick whatever you want when you're on your ship by spending your XP.
The only limitation is that perks belong to a tier (which is your archetype rank) and you need to pick a certain number of perks of your current tier to be able to choose a perk of the next tier (so it's like a skill tree, to get the more powerful perks you need to get some lower ones).
And when you get to the highest rank of your archetype, you can choose a more advanced archetype.

So owlcat thought that would confuse players (I hate when devs think players too stupid to learn a mechanic and dumb it down, that exactly how you make stupid players) and instead has you pick the perks at a regular interval.

[Solvem Probler]

It feels like Pillars of Eternity where you're forced to pick the "least bad" options constantly.

[whrmi_]

Yeah plus the talents being boring and convoluted. They could have at least designed the tooltips so you could see just the effects, instead of this block of text.

It's as if they tried to make leveling as annoying as pssible.

[Mr.Hmm]

Originally posted by Drake:

The problem is that there are levels.

The pnp version of rogue trader doesn't have levels. It's a perk buy system. Every skill, ability and stat advancement has an xp cost and you pick whatever you want when you're on your ship by spending your XP.
The only limitation is that perks belong to a tier (which is your archetype rank) and you need to pick a certain number of perks of your current tier to be able to choose a perk of the next tier (so it's like a skill tree, to get the more powerful perks you need to get some lower ones).
And when you get to the highest rank of your archetype, you can choose a more advanced archetype.

So owlcat thought that would confuse players (I hate when devs think players too stupid to learn a mechanic and dumb it down, that exactly how you make stupid players) and instead has you pick the perks at a regular interval.

To be fair, people these days are very stupid.

[Dust]

Honestly, I'm alright with that. For me the annoying thing is how many skills/talents/perks are like "when the commander is adjacent to allies, allies are adjacent to enemies, and enemies are adjacent to Boss-branded dishwashers, reduce the targets' armor penetration by 5(+2x(WP bonus)/PER bonus)/WP bonus".

[Butcher]

Originally posted by Steeb:

the game gives you suggested picks when you level up, you can see a little green thumb up icon on the option

Suggested picks are not good, the best navigator skills are down there and they REALLY improve your power level.

[Jack Niggleson]

Level ups do seem really close together, lol. Sometimes they literally happen right next to each other, like with the chaos space marine spaceport fight in chapter 1. Really weird timing too, since you can't actually use it until after the fight is over.

I wonder if the game was originally supposed to be longer but got cut down, so they had to condense progression to compensate.

[Flavalicious]

Originally posted by Steeb:

the game gives you suggested picks when you level up, you can see a little green thumb up icon on the option

Oh really now? Gee i must be playinf a different game then you brcause every 3rd level or whatever it is where im picking lesser perks like weapon and armour unlocks there are no suggested options lol.

And then like every 10th level you get the same perk selection list but it has a bunch of options you dont normally see for the more common selection level ups. The entire system is a bit over complicated for little to no reason lol. I can follow the system, im not having troubles with the system....Im just moderately annoyed i have to stop the flow of the game for 10 minutes to choose perks....every 20 minutes of play. Lol

[Flavalicious]

Originally posted by Jack Niggleson:

Level ups do seem really close together, lol. Sometimes they literally happen right next to each other, like with the chaos space marine spaceport fight in chapter 1. Really weird timing too, since you can't actually use it until after the fight is over.

I wonder if the game was originally supposed to be longer but got cut down, so they had to condense progression to compensate.

I got 2 levels at once in that fight lol.

Naw i dont think they cut it down and condensed, i think someone just opted to not consolidate the options and pace it out better. You get 3 or 4 perks for a single ability sometimes, could probably of rolled them into 1 upgrade and dropped 1-3 of your level ups to spend. Upgrade a stat by 5 points? Why not by 10 points, half as often lol.

Almost a case of too much customization (which in itself is ironic because of the archtype overlaps lol)

Part of the problem is some options are insanely strong but many have almost no effect. So a level up can feel impactful or completely void of progress. Where as in most crpgs based around fantasy, the impact of your enhanced power is instantly obvious. I picked a single talent for my sister that boosted her per round dps by like 25%, which is massive. The level afted that she got 2 movement square more per round. Lol. Its a bit all over the place

[Little Strawberry]

Originally posted by Jack Niggleson:

Level ups do seem really close together, lol. Sometimes they literally happen right next to each other, like with the chaos space marine spaceport fight in chapter 1. Really weird timing too, since you can't actually use it until after the fight is over.

I wonder if the game was originally supposed to be longer but got cut down, so they had to condense progression to compensate.

The BBEG fight in chapter 1 is supposed to unlock the second tier archetype for you after earning it. Seems like a good reward to me to beating it.

[Dust]

Originally posted by Jack Niggleson:

fight in chapter 1

Great, thanks for the spoiler.

[Cat]

Level ups do slow down a lot more once you get further into the game, your 2nd archtype will not be gaining 6 levels in the span of half an hour like the first one, you are so insanely weak starting out that the faster progression is helpful to get your core build online.

[Khasym]

Originally posted by whrmi_:

Yeah plus the talents being boring and convoluted. They could have at least designed the tooltips so you could see just the effects, instead of this block of text.

It's as if they tried to make leveling as annoying as pssible.

I wouldn't say annoying but it IS a bit fiddly. I've played the 40k RPGs, and I was designing Excel documents for this same reason.

Now, having said that, there IS a flow to things. I found it on my second startup. My first had a bad Psyker build, until I picked up a talent that pretty much removed Veil increases, and stabilized their damage output without invoking Perils of the Warp. The hard part, is all the required reading. You need to read the talents, and then make sure to keep note of the keywords you want to work with for a character. If you wanna go bolter-crazy, anything with "Bolt" or "attacks" is a fairly safe bet. For defense, you want like Deflections and Dodge/Parry. The safest bets as far as leveling, deal with either removing any NEGATIVE effects from power or skill usages, before going into buffing. A Psyker who can only fire lightning two or three times, then has to sit out, is wayyyy less powerful than a psyker who maybe doens't blow out damage, but can KEEP hitting multiple targets across the whole fight.

[Jack Niggleson]

Originally posted by Dust:

Originally posted by Jack Niggleson:

fight in chapter 1

Great, thanks for the spoiler.

There are like half a dozen threads about it already and the game has been out for nearly a week. Sorry, lol