I prefer RTwP but heres why it cant happen...

[Fast]

Because the reality is, the majority of people who buy games that require even the most basic understanding of math, and strategy, are generally adults.

And the older you get, the less dexterous you become.
Turn based removes all of the requirements for dexterity that come with shooters, or RTwP or RTS titles etc etc, and allow people to enjoy the game at a slower pace that suits their ability.

To simplify.
Older people buy these types of games, and on average, the older you get the less dexterous you are in video games and subsequently turn based simply applies to a wider audience nowadays.
As soon as you have RTwP you instantly alienate a large portion of your potential audience that simply dont have the ability or dexterity to play.

Do I think RTwP would suit and actually be better for games like this personally, yes.
Do I think it is a financially viable option , no.

Could they add both? Yes, but quite frankly its the equivalent of building two different games within the same space, which is unlikely to offer financial success anymore so than simply just offering the more popular platform that the wider audience would be more likely to accept.

[puksone]

You need that 18 dex to hit that pause button.

[Fast]

Originally posted by puksone:

You need that 18 dex to hit that pause button.

hehehe exactly.
Consider the difference between say a starcraft 2 player and a baldurs gate 3 player , i mean watch a video of even a low elo starcraft 2 player and then compare this to the pace of a bg3 encounter.
Night and day. And the reason is simply because the audience is wider and the financial viability is better.

[Fuzzyballs01 ꦙ]

no offense, but insulting everyone who's a bit older and calling them slow isn't very realistic or nice

[Tozobi]

Originally posted by Fuzzyballs01:

no offense, but insulting everyone who's a bit older and calling them slow isn't very realistic or nice

It is not an insult. I am one of those people and I disliked RTWP even back when I played the Infinity Engine games on release. I much preferred Fallout and Darksun: Wake of the Ravager. But two and half decades ago, apart from dexterity, me and many other like me I'll wager, had the patience to wade through RTWP even though they disliked it.
Not so today, when the idea of pausing every 3 seconds to avoid a crapfest makes it less fun than work for us. The first Pillars of Eternity and Tyranny were manageable as they were built from the ground up to work in RTWP, with encounter based cooldowns, and were the last games with RTWP that I bothered with. Whether it is dexterity or ability to deal with things you don't really like, the original post's assessment is not without merit.

If anything, the post might be more offensive for teenagers, as it implies they cannot have basic understanding of math. You could easily argue against that, as those of us who played tabletop RPGs back then had to deal with the nonsense of THAC0 and its like.

[Bruxae]

I do not agree at all.

The fact is that RTWP is tedious, you achieve the same goal as turn-based by manually pausing whenever you need to take a significant action (such as positioning or casting a spell). Turn-based save you the hassle at the expense of the option to go full real-time, for most that is a fair trade because the only people who don't frequently pause regardless are impatient people who most likely aren't deep into the CRPG genre to begin with.

The main reason I see actual old-school CRPG fans argue for RTWP is nostalgia and nothing else.

[Necrosian]

I very much prefer turn based for few reason, those being better encounter design, no need to pause every 5 seconds to micro characters and in general being more challenging that blob v blob rtwp.

[Dryden]

I much prefer turn based when a game is isometric and focused around a small group of people. For something like company of heroes, real time is however a perfect fit.

[Tomatokek]

I mean while it is easier to focus on, I think the gameplay is simply better with turnbased. Having to pause every 2 seconds to make proper moves is just annoying. A game being build for turnbased works way better with strategy along with the game environment. I dont know if its really an age thing, I think its just more so a better strategy gameplay thing.

[=DeadShot=]

For example the newest version some youtubers got on unfair even with best gear and talent and near perfect play it still took several tries to pass some encounters. When even tanks die to 1-2-3 hits from normal mooks if you don't micro and the rest from 1 hit if you don't micro.
And how punishing are injuries. The game trash mobs on unfair aren't forgiving to your characters and you are at best glass cannons.
You need turn base. Even pro RTS gamers would struggle to not make a mistake. And in boss battles or tougher fights you will be in turn base, with turn base responsibility being yourself and not the system.

[REhorror]

Guilty as charged.
Consider me too old and annoyed to press the pause button every 6 second to apply buff while watching my guys whack the enemy in repetitive animation for minutes.

Hell, we should have RTwP CRPG esport for those who have the APM for it.

[Ye Old Salt Potato]

If you can't reasonably play a game in real time, there's no reason it should play out in real time. Either focus it on the action, or make it about the strategy.

Something that works well in real time with multiple characters is going to be something with much simpler characters and does well to frankly not focus on combat. Something as detailed and combat focused as this looks is much better served by having time to actually appreciate those details built in, rather than constantly pressing pause.

[Nightmarian]

I just don't understand what you get from RTwP that isn't already done far better than ARPG/RTS or full turn-based systems.

Not to mention you get better balancing for them too. WoTR's turn-based mode was atrocious outside of bosses because it was plainly evident the game wasn't balanced nor designed around it.

That is not the case with Rogue Trader.

You also get much more enjoyable action economy to me too, as though I love my CRPG have and played all the classics, too often it feels like you optimize for the party to basically play the game for you and only react to spam a long tedious list of buffs or react to a very specific thing.

Dunno, played a lot of RTS made RPG via mods, actual ARPGs, and turn-based games and I've just never told myself "man I wish the gameloop slowed down to six second intervals in between which I can't use my abilities or auto attack."

I guess turn-based is subjective, but as someone who likes turned-based games, the last thing I ever also say is "boy I wish there was a six second timer on all my characters' turns and if I miss giving them a command whelp I suck for not pausing the game and turning it into.... a turn-based game anyway."

[Motivia]

Turn-based is fine by me. RTwP always seems to mess me up and my APS for twitch RTS games. So this is one person in their fifties that’s happy it is turn-based.

[[Heretic]Rivga]

Originally posted by Fast:

Because the reality is, the majority of people who buy games that require even the most basic understanding of math, and strategy, are generally adults.

And the older you get, the less dexterous you become.
Turn based removes all of the requirements for dexterity that come with shooters, or RTwP or RTS titles etc etc, and allow people to enjoy the game at a slower pace that suits their ability.

To simplify.
Older people buy these types of games, and on average, the older you get the less dexterous you are in video games and subsequently turn based simply applies to a wider audience nowadays.
As soon as you have RTwP you instantly alienate a large portion of your potential audience that simply dont have the ability or dexterity to play.

Do I think RTwP would suit and actually be better for games like this personally, yes.
Do I think it is a financially viable option , no.

Could they add both? Yes, but quite frankly its the equivalent of building two different games within the same space, which is unlikely to offer financial success anymore so than simply just offering the more popular platform that the wider audience would be more likely to accept.

Lol where did you come up with this gem of information?

I still play FPS PvP reasonably well, not amazing but I have never been amazing at them but I own and play more turn based games.

If you think you need a good level of dexterity to manage a RtwP game then all this tells me is YOU have a AWFUL level of manual dexterity.

People just have preferences and the current preference is turn based, these games sell to the youth too. BG3 for instance did not just sell to the over 30s.

[Kegbelly]

i must be odd but i like it when a character in my party does something stupid and i have limited control lol
but yea as a guy in his 50s now i should prolly learn to embrace turn based combat =)