nProtect Gameguard = Rootkit Heads up.

[UnkindledThuum]

I did a little digging and found the nProtect Gameguard to be rootkit material. A rootkit is a program that gives someone privilaged access to your computer. Windows repair techs use this same kind of technology when you have them repair your computer over the phone. AKA the owners of this game can access your files and your operating system at will. Not cool. Buyer beware.

[ein]

Originally posted by Chrono:

Tinfoil hats everywhere.

We did away with the tin foil hats at the start of the thread. Did you even look at the link Tactical Wombat provided? We are now talking about intrusiveness and disruption. No one cares if they're peeking at the contents of your hard drive. Leave that to Microsoft and Symantec.

[Andrius227]

Wow you guys are so paranoid its crazy. Rootkits can't do anything to your pc, specially if you have a good antivirus that scans and protects rootkits, like Norton 360.

[Pvtchaos]

Originally posted by Andrius227:

Wow you guys are so paranoid its crazy. Rootkits can't do anything to your pc, specially if you have a good antivirus that scans and protects rootkits, like Norton 360.

I sincerely question if you even know what a rootkit is and does,probably not.

[Andrius227]

Originally posted by Pvtchaos:

Originally posted by Andrius227:

Wow you guys are so paranoid its crazy. Rootkits can't do anything to your pc, specially if you have a good antivirus that scans and protects rootkits, like Norton 360.

I sincerely question if you even know what a rootkit is and does,probably not.

Ofc i know, i have google... Lol

[Xjph]

Started the game, saw the nProtect splash screen. Immediately uninstalled.

[CyberDown]

Everyone has known for a LONG time what korean anti-hack programs are and do.

Its technically a rootkit because the program will scan and access files attempting to locate hack software on your computer. it basically gives premission for the owners of game guard or whatever to access anything they want on your pc (not suggesting there is evil things being done...but they do collect a TON of data on...you?..your PC? ...your pc settings and hardware?)

I think they were all outed a long time ago as basically being data mining programs first anti cheat programs second. Ive never seen a game that uses these programs that isnt totally over run by hacks.

It only catches the really stupid cheaters who either use old cheat programs, free cheat programs or really obvious cheat programs.

[ein]

Originally posted by Andrius227:

Wow you guys are so paranoid its crazy. Rootkits can't do anything to your pc, specially if you have a good antivirus that scans and protects rootkits, like Norton 360.

Why would Norton 360 do anything about a rootkit you willingly install? Probably after agreeing to a EULA.

As for whether they can do anything to your PC, rootkits have been known to mess with optical drives, create security holes, and drain resources. But you knew that...[en.wikipedia.org] right?[en.wikipedia.org]

The question isn't whether it's a rootkit. Many anti-malware suites use rootkits to protect themselves from attack. Nor is the question whether nProtect can be trusted, but whether their software is obnoxious and potentially dangerous. Ymmv, but I imagine a rootkit with a reputation for being easily circumvented might be just a teensy bit dangerous.

As for whether you can trust Microsoft and Symantec, you would have to have lived under a rock for the past several months not to have your doubts. At least we know we can trust avast.[i.imgur.com]

[Pvtchaos]

Originally posted by einexile:

Originally posted by Andrius227:

At least we know we can trust avast.[i.imgur.com]

lol

[Andrius227]

Originally posted by einexile:

Originally posted by Andrius227:

Wow you guys are so paranoid its crazy. Rootkits can't do anything to your pc, specially if you have a good antivirus that scans and protects rootkits, like Norton 360.

Why would Norton 360 do anything about a rootkit you willingly install? Probably after agreeing to a EULA.

As for whether they can do anything to your PC, rootkits have been known to mess with optical drives, create security holes, and drain resources. But you knew that...[en.wikipedia.org] right?[en.wikipedia.org]

The question isn't whether it's a rootkit. Many anti-malware suites use rootkits to protect themselves from attack. The question is not whether nProtect can be trusted but whether their software is obnoxious and potentially dangerous. Ymmv, but I imagine a rootkit with a reputation for being easily circumvented might be just a teensy bit dangerous.

As for whether you can trust Microsoft and Symantec, you would have to have lived under a rock for the past several months not to have your doubts. At least we know we can trust avast.[i.imgur.com]

Lol anything is better than Avast... I had it before, paid version even, failed to protect against simple skype spam virus...

[sköldpadda]

People crying about rootkits, I guess same people doesnt use any antivirus software either, or even a OS.

[Andrius227]

Yup, it's stupid how many ppl complain about this... If hacks and viruses use rootkits, then the game and anti-virus programs need rootkits to fight it. They give more control that's all.

[MCpl Green]

My complaint isn't the nature of the program, it's the intentional ill-effect it's having on legitimate, completely unrelated programs. Add to this, the only programs that I've ever had any kind of trouble with since developpers started to make an effort in combating security threats, are MMOs popular in eastern countries.

So to run this, I have to close other programs that I don't want to close, for a security suite that's somewhat less than effective, for a program coming from a market flooded by users that get ahead by screwing with accounts, and it uses one of, if not the most expensive business models in games?

Now, if you don't use any of the programs that this thing ♥♥♥♥♥ with, then yeah, have at 'er. It's forcing me to make a choice between what I already have, and what it has to offer, and I'm not willing to make that switch for a free to play.

[Godeke]

For me it is the support headache it causes and the ineffective nature of such programs. Eve Online does just fine with a client with exposed Python code because the server doesn't send anything other than what the user needs and legitimately can use. Eve is full of some of the most exploitive players online, yet they are limited in the ways they can "cheat" due to the system's design.

GameGuard is a bandage over the gushing wound of trusting the client with far more than needed and not validating inputs. Then it interferes with your day job if you are a programmer, because the same tools you use to make a living are "cheaters" tools. Meh, this isn't a conspiracy, it is just sloppy workmanship and a crappy attempt to fix something that shouldn't have been broken in the first place.

Learn to code secure games, don't put some incompatibility generating (and ineffective) patch on later.

[[LUE] Miles Prower]

Originally posted by Godeke:

For me it is the support headache it causes and the ineffective nature of such programs. Eve Online does just fine with a client with exposed Python code because the server doesn't send anything other than what the user needs and legitimately can use. Eve is full of some of the most exploitive players online, yet they are limited in the ways they can "cheat" due to the system's design.

GameGuard is a bandage over the gushing wound of trusting the client with far more than needed and not validating inputs. Then it interferes with your day job if you are a programmer, because the same tools you use to make a living are "cheaters" tools. Meh, this isn't a conspiracy, it is just sloppy workmanship and a crappy attempt to fix something that shouldn't have been broken in the first place.

Learn to code secure games, don't put some incompatibility generating (and ineffective) patch on later.

This. ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ this. I don't do it professionally, but I had to do tech support for virtually an entire domitory last semester. Out of the 20 computers I had to look over and fix software wise through that semester, 12 out of the 20 were from GameGuard, nProtect, and other anti-hacking rootkits screwing with other program and even system files. The problem everyone seems to be missing is when the rootkits start blocking legitimate programs and files and start fussing with things it really shouldn't need to, or are things that are far and away from a hack as they can be, and these things can be a real problem to restore the blocked/damaged files and remove the rootkit completely.

[Pantsu]

Originally posted by LUE Miles Prower:

This. ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ this. I don't do it professionally, but I had to do tech support for virtually an entire domitory last semester. Out of the 20 computers I had to look over and fix software wise through that semester, 12 out of the 20 were from GameGuard, nProtect, and other anti-hacking rootkits screwing with other program and even system files. The problem everyone seems to be missing is when the rootkits start blocking legitimate programs and files and start fussing with things it really shouldn't need to, or are things that are far and away from a hack as they can be, and these things can be a real problem to restore the blocked/damaged files and remove the rootkit completely.

Funny, I _do_ do it professionally, and this is a complete fabrication. First and foremost, programs such as nProtect don't actively run, or have services that run unless the game itself is running. Unless these people are leaving their games open 100% of the time, it's realistically impossible for that to have happened. Having actually worked with nProtect, they hook in and terminate unless the game they are memory scanning is actively running.