Install Steam
login
|
language
简体中文 (Simplified Chinese)
繁體中文 (Traditional Chinese)
日本語 (Japanese)
한국어 (Korean)
ไทย (Thai)
Български (Bulgarian)
Čeština (Czech)
Dansk (Danish)
Deutsch (German)
Español - España (Spanish - Spain)
Español - Latinoamérica (Spanish - Latin America)
Ελληνικά (Greek)
Français (French)
Italiano (Italian)
Bahasa Indonesia (Indonesian)
Magyar (Hungarian)
Nederlands (Dutch)
Norsk (Norwegian)
Polski (Polish)
Português (Portuguese - Portugal)
Português - Brasil (Portuguese - Brazil)
Română (Romanian)
Русский (Russian)
Suomi (Finnish)
Svenska (Swedish)
Türkçe (Turkish)
Tiếng Việt (Vietnamese)
Українська (Ukrainian)
Report a translation problem
am i missing something?
gold trim is 2nd company
IV is 6th squad
oh, sorry, i didnt see that you said the champion skin. still, thats just proof the people making the game have no idea what theyre doing with heraldry. all of them have a terminator honor shoulder, all of them have a deathwatch shoulder, all of them have a commander pauldron. i dont think any of those are meant to indicate what that character is. in the story they are all 2nd company, 6th squad
And slight correction, IV is 4, VI is 6.
Also in lore, the captain of the 4th is a fellow named Uriel Ventris. So cannonicly heavy cannot be a captain. But i think it looks cool anyway.
Tis a small error brother, not worth committing sudoku over.
And its also interesting that of all the 'base' astartes we encounter, only the first 3 have any kind of distinguishing armour differences. (Elios, Lyreos and the other dude i forget) they have stylised chapter symbols and/or other elements like the veterancy colours on their right kneepad.
Shoulder emblem, it is the mark of command, or captain, also found on the leg, the skull with wings. As the codex astartes says.
The Codex Astartes does not list that icon as a captain icon, it is merely often seen on captains (perhaps it's just a "wow you're super high rank" emblem), and they copy the same pauldron example for many of them. Captain Acheran is not a captain by this logic, he has a skull with wreath. The only markings the Codices list for an Ultramarines Captain is a blue helmet with gold skull, optionally the two-tone heraldry on a piece of their armour, in this case the yellow stripe of 2nd company. Uriel Ventris also lacks any of these markings, yet he is the current captain and has official artwork and a miniature.
Using markings from the codices is hit or miss, some contradict each other or are inconsistent. The Iron Skull is a common issue, for a time GW was insistent on using the Iron Skull for sergeants only, and this game seems to have adopted that forcibly now for many helmets, while in many codices the Ultramarines use gold skulls for sergeants, the Iron Skull was, in my interpretation, for those who have shown leadership qualities with the ability to be in a leading role like a sergeant, but are currently not. Similar to the Crux Terminatus that a number of marines wear to show they have Terminator Honours but are not currently wearing the tactical dreadnought armour.
Moving back to the original topic, the champion skin has a number of interesting markings, which could be considered a company champion except he lacks the gold helmet that is typical for champions.
The presence of a Raptor implies veteran status, seen on Suzerain of the 30K era.
The laurels of victory are present, implying great feats accomplished.
A Decurion-style crest is present, typical of lower echelon command staff during the 30K era, a less common feature in 40K but still used.
The skull on the helmet is adorned with an Iron Halo, the skull looks silver with a gold halo but I may be mistaken. This is yet another veteran marking.
He carries a reliquary, inconsistent in the lore but typically only seen by more experienced troops.
His actual Iron Halo features the Ultima glyph, as does many other pieces of armour.
The heraldry on his pauldron - the vertically halved section - is white, which implies it's personal heraldry not marking him as the captain. The 4th company uses a horizontally halved section with green. This pattern matches the 7th company, if it were painted purple.
The gold skull on the armourial is new to me, but if sergeants have a red skull and red helmet, and a champion usually has a gold helmet, perhaps this is the champion marking?
Skulls are one of the confusing elements when it comes to space marine insignia - Command personnel often use it, on its own, as a 'squad' signifier.
A solitary 'plain metal' skull is usually the honour badge of a Iron Skull recipient, as seen worn by sergeants in most codex compliant chapters. Ultramarines go one step further and incorporate the skull, now red, into their chapter symbol for sergeants - they may also use a plain red skull on other areas of the armour (much like we see on some of the powerpacks in game)
Skull on the champions helmet is gold, along with the halo; its not specifically a veteran marking since the Iron Halo itself is basically the next step up from the Iron Skull, so the recipient combining both awards into the one we see wouldnt be out of the ordinary.
The 'actual iron halo' may not even be an Iron Halo - If this fella is a Captain (Uriel or not) then it would likely be an Iron Halo *but* the halo icon is only used the once on the armour, that being the helmet, so this could well be a simple 'back banner' of sorts, something that sergeants and command personnel tend to have. With is being the Ultima symbol, its possible its an 'Eternium Ultra' honour badge, a revered relic of the Ultramarines of which there are very few.
Also, i think when it comes to Ultramarine colours/markings, there are usually a lot more discrepancies than other chapters. Take the Bladeguard for example, he should have white shoulder trim since they are veterans and of first company, but here, and on the miniatures themselves, they get gold trim instead; so theres a small lack of continuity here and there; probably oversight from the GW painters etc, but obviously something that 'catches on' when people use the box art to go by on what a unit would look like as an Ultramarine etc
Going back to the Iron Skull for a moment, i too also like to think that a marine showing leadership qualities would have the skull on his helmet, sergeant or not. An astartes doesnt have to become a sergeant to start earning honour badges, as you can see via the rest of Gadriels squad in the campaign, they have veterancy markings on their kneepad, likely indicating long serving members and/or one of the foremost squads in the company (which could also explain why Gadriels squad was put under Titus' command.
For the Bladeguard, I disagree. White pauldron trim is for 1st company, and "veterans" (white helmet) can be in any company, hence why GW shows them with gold trim but white helmets, displaying 2nd company markings. In the Secret Level animation, one Bladeguard (Metaurus) is a 2nd company veteran sergeant, while the other two Bladeguard are 1st company Bladeguards. Another thing to note is the insistance on Bladeguard being "veteran" - which could just be veteran Bladeguards, implying less ornate Bladeguard can exist as melee-focused squads akin to Despoilers or Breachers. The Bladeguard ingame also lacks the Iron Halo typical of Bladeguard.
You likely know the story behind the red skull, but I was implying that the gold skull being present on the armourial alongside is akin to the sergeant's marking - how they have a red skull adorning their armourial. The colouring of the skull as gold instead of red, may indicate Champion status the same way the red skull on the amourial does, and in this case may be used as a fall-back as the helmet isn't painted like a typical champion.
As for personal heraldry in Gadriel's squad, getting to the 2nd company is usually a hard-earned career, going through all companies. Of course there are many examples where this isn't the case, and the Unnumbered Sons screwed that up a whole heap, but for many of the 2nd company marines they would definitely have a fair amount of experience by that point. GW killing half the company every time they appear kinda spoils that lol
Oh i meant the physical power pack iron halo too; i was just pointing out that, as you say, the heavy doesnt have an iron halo on tabletop etc so despite the ability of the class in game, the decorative aspect may jst be a back banner of sorts rather than an actual iron halo. (which i feel would further lend credence to your company champion theory - not to mention refractor fields are a thing and can take many shapes, one of which could be an Ultima)
On Bladeguards, i would have to disagree with your comments there; Bladeguard are written up as members of a chapters first company by GW themselves and as such should have the white trim. That being said, with a unit of bladeguard being attached to another company you could headcannon it to say that they adopt the colours of their temporary company.
Plus there the bit i mentioned before about oversight or marketing decision to just keep them blue and gold so that newer hobbyists werent overly confuzzled when it came to painting the poster boys.
As for the Bulwark not having the back piece, thats just an unfortunate thing really, much like the Instigator carbine should be on the Sniper class and the DMR carbine on the Vanguard, or the Tac marine not having a combat knife etc etc.
I consider the gold skull(s) on the other parts of the armour to be either part of a honour badge design (laurels of command) or just a generic skull that doesnt really mean anything and is just ornamental in nature. If they were stylised iconography then i'd pay them more attention based on their colours (and the chapter they were on)
The Secret Level episode: unfortunately it wouldnt really make sense for the chapter to pull a sergeant of one company (veteran or otherwise) from active duties and slap him in charge of 2 first company bladeguard veterans and a 2nd company lieutenant for such a delicate mission.
So either Metaurus has 'ornate/ceremonial' gold trim ala Calgar, Victrix Guard etc or a continuity error was made due to GW being GW.
(Also, if Metaurus was from 2nd company, i feel it would have been a missed opportunity to not have introduced him to us in SM2 or to at least name-dropped him during the story and had Titus inquire about him or something)
No argument on your last comment about Gadriels squad :)
Edit: watching the SL episode again now - if you pause when they slide down the hole or when they arrive at the statue, you'll see that the bladeguard vets seem to have both white and gold trims; white left trim and a gold right trim (with possible white accent or something) so it could well be another case of ornamental gold rather than company colouring (another reason why i favoured the yellow trim of old)
For the marketing of miniatures I agree, they do put a lot in 2nd company, but Sternguard and Vanguard Veterans are always with white trim, which goes against that. Even the Leviathan-era Sternguard have white trim. That's either inconsistency with Bladeguard, or implying they can operate in other companies - at the very least as veterans attached. Varellus is a Veteran Sergeant in the 2nd company (seen in this game), as it Metaurus (Secret Level), there is also artwork and older official "pict-captures" of white-helmeted troops inside tactical/intercessor squads alongside blue helmets, implying Veterans can attach to other companies. If there are no non-veteran Bladeguard, it may be a more permanent "company heroes" style attachment to a company, but I like to think there are non-veteran ones which match the lack of embellishment seen in the low level cosmetics for the Bladeguard ingame - blank shield with painted markings, less or no robes, etc.
I agree that the skulls anywhere else on the armour aren't indicitive of a Champion, I was only talking about the armourial and how there's a possibility that they were going for gold skull on Ultima = champion, like how red skull on Ultima = sergeant, in addition to the countless no-longer-used insignia that would adorn an Ultima for other positions from 1-3rd editions like "squad leader" (red iron halo on Ultima)
As for the Secret Level characters, the troops for that mission were specially picked. They assembled a kill-team, the OOB doesn't matter for that.
You're right in that HQ units get gold trim, that's a follow-over from their Legion days.
As I mentioned earlier, Varellus is shown ingame as a 2nd company veteran sergeant. Whether this means he was previously 1st company and moved back to 2nd to inspire the boys as it were, idk. Point is that it happens. I also don't know whether the a 2nd company veteran sergeant is "more veteran" than a 1st company veteran (non-sergeant).
Levantus and Icaron have white trim in the episode, with gold studs/rivets. The gold you saw as trim in the slide scene was a gold plate that would have text engraved on it - a more fancy scroll.
The intro scene where they introduce the names of the characters on the mission screen lists all four names and their roles. Icaron and Levantus are listed as "Bladeguard (Veteran)" and Metaurus is listed as "Bladeguard (Sergeant)". Do with that what you will lol