Tank - shotgun

[Rostig]

That shotgun needs some help. The tank is supposed to "shine" at late game, however getting there with this single/double shot reload simulator that fans out so much you miss targets nearly off the end of the barrel is a bit untenable.

Special consideration with there simply being better options in most of the other characters. Balance issues I suppose.

It would not be to hard to give this character a feel good pass, narrow the fire cone slightly. Add ammo to the magazine in respect to real life counterparts.. that being 4-8 rounds on a pump. Not 1-2. Then reduce damage to compensate for that.

[frankisvicky]

you need upgrade to minigun

[Rostig]

Why? When you can just use the swat for better effect, point investment and progression. The shotgun is the issue, bypassing it and ignoring it is really not the best concept.

[Inferius]

I don't think any of classes was planned to do endgame with basic gun. You are supposed to upgrade it

[Oddball]

Tank + shotgun + late game doesn't compute. Are you rank 2 yet to get minigun or rocket launcher? That's the late game.

[Adeptus Shmadeptus]

Pump shotgun is a very strong weapon. With SWAT lider and buffs to reload speed and fire rate i had 2.9 mil damage on it. Also damage not always shows efficiency. For example, i had 636k damage with rocket launcher, but it is really good at killing bosses on late game and i survived 42 min with that weapon (patch 0.2.1).

[Oddball]

Originally posted by uptime:

Pump shotgun is a very strong weapon. With SWAT lider and buffs to reload speed and fire rate i had 2.9 mil damage on it. Also damage not always shows efficiency. For example, i had 636k damage with rocket launcher, but it is really good at killing bosses on late game and i survived 42 min with that weapon (patch 0.2.1).

Have you compared the damage over time from when you say use the minigun or rocket launcher, vs just using the shotgun? I think the rank 2 weapons will outperform the shotgun over the time it's used.

[|||||||||||]

I think the OP means that it would be nice to have an option to improve existing gun without having to "evolve" it. As a good example atm there is 0 point uprgraiding pistol to syringe gun on medic until rank 2. And sometimes even beyond rank 2 to thin out the more preferred options. I used to ban syringe gun along with subsequent flasks upgrades very often. Because they are just not worth it for a 20 min run. At least that puny pistol deals SOME tiny damage, and capable of killing a zed or two.

As another example i would like to see a better tesla instead of being forced to evolve it to laser or that ball-pew-pew thing.

[Oddball]

Originally posted by |||||||||||:

I think the OP means that it would be nice to have an option to improve existing gun without having to "evolve" it. As a good example atm there is 0 point uprgraiding pistol to syringe gun on medic until rank 2. And sometimes even beyond rank 2 to thin out the more preferred options. I used to ban syringe gun along with subsequent flasks upgrades very often. Because they are just not worth it for a 20 min run. At least that puny pistol deals SOME tiny damage, and capable of killing a zed or two.

As another example i would like to see a better tesla instead of being forced to evolve it to laser or that ball-pew-pew thing.

Yeah I think we all agree the medic's weapon is poor, but she's a medic, and her strength is her buffs not weapon. It also seems that all weapons in general are meant to evolve to something better, though I'm not quite sure how much better the engineer's laser and blaster are vs the telsa gun, as it's easier to see the chain-lightening effect through the crowd. Need to pay attention to the damage summary more on that one.

It seems that the Tank's strength though is in it's bombs and better weapons, so it's a bit odd someone would want to hold on to the shotgun vs. a mini gun... but then again, just need more data to prove it out. Interesting thought thanks.

[Adeptus Shmadeptus]

Originally posted by Oddball:

Have you compared the damage over time from when you say use the minigun or rocket launcher, vs just using the shotgun? I think the rank 2 weapons will outperform the shotgun over the time it's used.

2.9 mil with pump shotgun is run without going to minigun.
Maximum i have with minigun was 2.6 mil (and 40k with pump shotgun) with only 33 min, but i am not sure what patch was that. Last runs i have maximum 1.7 mil with minigun (and about 150k on p-shotgun) in 38-39 min.

[NOTnNPC]

from what i have seen , tier 2 weapons (all of them apart medic one, even hers suposed to be - aoe version for mid game transition when horde density is bigger) even medic has aoe explosion but the gun isnt performing that well right now , maby bugged or low damage.

so if you want to stick to it till late game , its possible depending on the build ure using( skills damage/ outo crits) thats just an example
by that every tier 3 weapons have a single target, utility type, and a aoe type.
so no point sticking to a tier 2 gun just becouse ure roleplaying....

if not tier 2 shotgun its overpowered, i can 2/4 shot a boss if i rush its upgrades on close range

[NOTnNPC]

Originally posted by Oddball:

Originally posted by |||||||||||:

I think the OP means that it would be nice to have an option to improve existing gun without having to "evolve" it. As a good example atm there is 0 point uprgraiding pistol to syringe gun on medic until rank 2. And sometimes even beyond rank 2 to thin out the more preferred options. I used to ban syringe gun along with subsequent flasks upgrades very often. Because they are just not worth it for a 20 min run. At least that puny pistol deals SOME tiny damage, and capable of killing a zed or two.

As another example i would like to see a better tesla instead of being forced to evolve it to laser or that ball-pew-pew thing.

Yeah I think we all agree the medic's weapon is poor, but she's a medic, and her strength is her buffs not weapon. It also seems that all weapons in general are meant to evolve to something better, though I'm not quite sure how much better the engineer's laser and blaster are vs the telsa gun, as it's easier to see the chain-lightening effect through the crowd. Need to pay attention to the damage summary more on that one.

It seems that the Tank's strength though is in it's bombs and better weapons, so it's a bit odd someone would want to hold on to the shotgun vs. a mini gun... but then again, just need more data to prove it out. Interesting thought thanks.

tier 3 enegnier weapons are great , one with aoe blast+ small knock back( utility)
the other just melts bosses.
the thing is prob most ppl go skill damage build o him and laser doesnt shine that much or at least u dont notice that much of a diference becouse scaling, but trust me she does the damage, try to grab some weapon damage, crit damage( otake ghost or hunter)

[Oddball]

Originally posted by uptime:

Originally posted by Oddball:

Have you compared the damage over time from when you say use the minigun or rocket launcher, vs just using the shotgun? I think the rank 2 weapons will outperform the shotgun over the time it's used.

2.9 mil with pump shotgun is run without going to minigun.
Maximum i have with minigun was 2.6 mil (and 40k with pump shotgun) with only 33 min, but i am not sure what patch was that. Last runs i have maximum 1.7 mil with minigun (and about 150k on p-shotgun) in 38-39 min.

Sounds like that with late-game upgrades, the shotgun is essentially a steady cone of damage, which may be more effective than a stream from a mini gun.

Try running two 24 hr games, same team combination (Tank + SWAT + Medic perhaps, to max tank damage), one with shotgun, and the other with minigun, and see which weapon pans out for more damage by morning/daytime.

[Adeptus Shmadeptus]

Originally posted by Oddball:

Sounds like that with late-game upgrades, the shotgun is essentially a steady cone of damage, which may be more effective than a stream from a mini gun.

Try running two 24 hr games, same team combination (Tank + SWAT + Medic perhaps, to max tank damage), one with shotgun, and the other with minigun, and see which weapon pans out for more damage by morning/daytime.

You need different builds for shotgun and for minigun, to see their maximum potential. Shotgun benefits from SWAT leader with maximum reload time and firerate (what i did). Minigun should be better with Hunterss or Ghost with maximum crit chance and damage (i also did).

The fun fact, i just checked, i had 2.6 mil on minigun by playing with Tank as leader (+Hunterss and medic). It's good that I recorded the game, can compare now https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0z3x1Wy4D98&ab_channel=uptime

Need to retry and look closer.

[luchillo17]

Minigun feels lackluster, in most of my runs it lands in the same DPS range of the pump shotgun, also the rate of fire feels almost the same as the assault rifle, makes no sense that THE Minigun has the same rpm than an AR.

Originally posted by uptime:

Originally posted by Oddball:

Have you compared the damage over time from when you say use the minigun or rocket launcher, vs just using the shotgun? I think the rank 2 weapons will outperform the shotgun over the time it's used.

2.9 mil with pump shotgun is run without going to minigun.
Maximum i have with minigun was 2.6 mil (and 40k with pump shotgun) with only 33 min, but i am not sure what patch was that. Last runs i have maximum 1.7 mil with minigun (and about 150k on p-shotgun) in 38-39 min.

Are you using the DPS column to measure or the total damage? because that total will vary wildly based on RNG on the upgrades, I've had runs where the weapon upgrades just didn't want to drop 😭😭

[Adeptus Shmadeptus]

Originally posted by luchillo17:

Are you using the DPS column to measure or the total damage? because that total will vary wildly based on RNG on the upgrades, I've had runs where the weapon upgrades just didn't want to drop 😭😭

Column of course. This is the damage of a specific weapon, not a character with all his abilities.