*Spoilers* Anybody else feel this way about Shinjiro?

[Ｐｏｐａｇａｎｄａ ！]

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Okay. Is anybody else frustrated with Shinjiro's death? Maybe I'm missing something but this felt so incredibly forced.
For starters in the scene itself Takeba doesn't even bother to try healing him. There's literally no reason that she wouldn't think to try. The entire scene I was just yelling at her to do something.

I would've been content with it if they made up some reason why she couldn't do it. Like if she tried but it didn't work for some reason. I would've been fine with that, because at least they would've acknowledged it. But no, we're just forced to accept it.

That's not even considering just how unbelievable it is for the situation to happen in the first place. There is just no way that Mitsuru and Sanada wouldn't have realized the date coming up and what it would mean.

* They literally keep track of dates for full moons
* Shinji's whole reason for joining was after Sanada talked about Amada
* Amada had been with us for weeks at this point. With how smart Mitsuru is I refuse to believe this didn't at least cross her mind. Sanada isn't dumb either. The fact neither of them considered it is absurd.
* Sanada literally talked to Shinji for days constantly acknowleding how he's beating himself up

I really, really liked Shinji. He was best boy to me in the little I knew him. I would've been completely okay with him dying. In fact I would've actually enjoyed it if it was done correctly, it would've hit harder for me and made me more invested since I liked Shinji so much.

But no, they did it in a way that just feels so narratively forced. It just left me more frustrated than sad and now having to go through watching the character grieve is just making me groan.

Does anybody else feel this way? Maybe there's something I'm missing? Maybe some details I'm not considering?

[Stormy Dawn]

Yeah. i really enjoy Shinji, too. It's one of the reasons that I always preferred P3P compared to FES, since you could save him if you played FeMC and pursued a relationship with him, though admittedly it doesn't effect much of anything since the story still has to play out more or less the same as if you chose the male protagonist.

I'm both a little sad and glad they didn't alter his fate for Reload. I liked that it was a unique, if somewhat unimportant, mechanic of the FeMC route, but I also like Shinji enough as a character that I would have liked it to be rewritten in a way that even the male protagonist could save him in Reloaded, but oh well. All the more reason to still play P3P from time-to-time.

[Chopsteak]

Ever since the first time I had witnessed this scene in the game, it always irritated me that it was not Ken who actually does the deed, but Takaya instead. As much as I love Shinji and wished he could pull through somehow, I have always wanted to see Ken actually carry though with his revenge plan and see the aftermath of him being the one to do it. Or at the very least, have it where if the player does the link episodes correctly you are able to prevent Shinji from dying, if the player does not, then Ken is the one who kills Shinji. To this day I still feel that letting Takaya be the one to kill Shinji was really a wasted opportunity and pretty lame. The game is dark, let the kid truly fight whether to embrace his darkness and carry out his revenge or not and deal with aftermath of whatever choice he made.

[mutantbeth]

both his and chidori feel forced and the creators must have realized this at some point cause both of them have been given an alternative option of staying alive. I wish at least like what was said before ken doing the deed would make it more impactful but atm both still feel meh.

[Jester]

Revolver Jesus had better chances of winning just going to their dorms in broad daylight and start blasting.

And yeah it's always been a problem even back in the original. It actually was worst back then because I didn't use him once and just died immediately a month later lol.
I like what they tried with his character but boy was it executed badly in retrospective. Kinda hoped they fixed some of that 2006 writing and pacing in the remake. They just dumped three characters on you in a short time.

[Queen Nothing]

Originally posted by i don't know:

For starters in the scene itself Takeba doesn't even bother to try healing him. There's literally no reason that she wouldn't think to try. The entire scene I was just yelling at her to do something.

In fairness, Takaya shot Shinjirō with a Smith & Wesson Model 500, firing the .500 S&W cartridge. In the anime movies, we also see that he's using hollow-point bullets. Realistically, when Shinji's shot with this, a tremendous amount of energy is transferred into his body. There would be enough hydrostatic shock that his ribs and organs would be subject to rapid expansion, breaks, tearing, and lots of it would blast out of the other side of him like high-pressure meat confetti. In short, Shinji would be effectively dead in an instant. His last words are a gracious formality on behalf of anime tropes, but he was a dead man even without Takaya shooting him a second time.

(As an aside, I want to know how Takaya managed to get a new ¥200,000 hand cannon in a country where guns aren't for sale. If it was the USA, I wouldn't even be curious how he got it, but there's a story involved in getting that gun in Japan.)

[Ｐｏｐａｇａｎｄａ ！]

Originally posted by Queen Nothing:

Originally posted by i don't know:

For starters in the scene itself Takeba doesn't even bother to try healing him. There's literally no reason that she wouldn't think to try. The entire scene I was just yelling at her to do something.

In fairness, Takaya shot Shinjirō with a Smith & Wesson Model 500, firing the .500 S&W cartridge. In the anime movies, we also see that he's using hollow-point bullets. Realistically, when Shinji's shot with this, a tremendous amount of energy is transferred into his body. There would be enough hydrostatic shock that his ribs and organs would be subject to rapid expansion, breaks, tearing, and lots of it would blast out of the other side of him like high-pressure meat confetti. In short, Shinji would be effectively dead in an instant. His last words are a gracious formality on behalf of anime tropes, but he was a dead man even without Takaya shooting him a second time.

(As an aside, I want to know how Takaya managed to get a new ¥200,000 hand cannon in a country where guns aren't for sale. If it was the USA, I wouldn't even be curious how he got it, but there's a story involved in getting that gun in Japan.)

My gripe is that she didn’t even try. I would’ve been completely fine if she at least tried. They could’ve easily given a reason why it wouldn’t have worked. Like literally ANY reason. As long as she tried.

Like it’s not just like it’s a gameplay only thing. They literally acknowledge she has healing powers in the narrative itself. There’s a conversation between her and Fuuka where the characters straight up acknowledge her persona can heal.

But no she just stands there going; “;(“

edit: they censor green hair girl’s name???

[Queen Nothing]

Originally posted by i don't know:

But no she just stands there going; “;(“

Fair enough, fair enough. Reminds me of back when FF7 came out, and we asked, "Hey, has anyone tried a phoenix down on Aeris?"

[Ｐｏｐａｇａｎｄａ ！]

Originally posted by Queen Nothing:

Originally posted by i don't know:

But no she just stands there going; “;(“

Fair enough, fair enough. Reminds me of back when FF7 came out, and we asked, "Hey, has anyone tried a phoenix down on Aeris?"

I can’t really comment on that as I haven’t played the original FF7. I only played the remake. From what I remember though the characters don’t straight acknowledge that one of them can heal in narrative. (At least from what I’ve seen/remember in the remake)

So that’s acceptable to me.

[fender178]

Originally posted by i don't know:

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Okay. Is anybody else frustrated with Shinjiro's death? Maybe I'm missing something but this felt so incredibly forced.
For starters in the scene itself Takeba doesn't even bother to try healing him. There's literally no reason that she wouldn't think to try. The entire scene I was just yelling at her to do something.

I would've been content with it if they made up some reason why she couldn't do it. Like if she tried but it didn't work for some reason. I would've been fine with that, because at least they would've acknowledged it. But no, we're just forced to accept it.

That's not even considering just how unbelievable it is for the situation to happen in the first place. There is just no way that Mitsuru and Sanada wouldn't have realized the date coming up and what it would mean.

* They literally keep track of dates for full moons
* Shinji's whole reason for joining was after Sanada talked about Amada
* Amada had been with us for weeks at this point. With how smart Mitsuru is I refuse to believe this didn't at least cross her mind. Sanada isn't dumb either. The fact neither of them considered it is absurd.
* Sanada literally talked to Shinji for days constantly acknowleding how he's beating himself up

I really, really liked Shinji. He was best boy to me in the little I knew him. I would've been completely okay with him dying. In fact I would've actually enjoyed it if it was done correctly, it would've hit harder for me and made me more invested since I liked Shinji so much.

But no, they did it in a way that just feels so narratively forced. It just left me more frustrated than sad and now having to go through watching the character grieve is just making me groan.

Does anybody else feel this way? Maybe there's something I'm missing? Maybe some details I'm not considering?

Yeah It was a shock to see him die but I don't have a problem with it. Also with him being shot it was a mortal wound which means noting could have been done also with the current mindset of the characters I don't think there would have been a way for Yukari to summon her persona to even try to heal him.

[Koopa]

they give an explanation how it works in persona 2, being that persona healing abilities can only heal against attacks made by personas or some ♥♥♥♥, but they didn't bother for this game. Otherwise I agree yeah.

[Ｐｏｐａｇａｎｄａ ！]

Originally posted by fender178:

Originally posted by i don't know:

---------------------------------------SPOILER SHIELD--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
















Okay. Is anybody else frustrated with Shinjiro's death? Maybe I'm missing something but this felt so incredibly forced.
For starters in the scene itself Takeba doesn't even bother to try healing him. There's literally no reason that she wouldn't think to try. The entire scene I was just yelling at her to do something.

I would've been content with it if they made up some reason why she couldn't do it. Like if she tried but it didn't work for some reason. I would've been fine with that, because at least they would've acknowledged it. But no, we're just forced to accept it.

That's not even considering just how unbelievable it is for the situation to happen in the first place. There is just no way that Mitsuru and Sanada wouldn't have realized the date coming up and what it would mean.

* They literally keep track of dates for full moons
* Shinji's whole reason for joining was after Sanada talked about Amada
* Amada had been with us for weeks at this point. With how smart Mitsuru is I refuse to believe this didn't at least cross her mind. Sanada isn't dumb either. The fact neither of them considered it is absurd.
* Sanada literally talked to Shinji for days constantly acknowleding how he's beating himself up

I really, really liked Shinji. He was best boy to me in the little I knew him. I would've been completely okay with him dying. In fact I would've actually enjoyed it if it was done correctly, it would've hit harder for me and made me more invested since I liked Shinji so much.

But no, they did it in a way that just feels so narratively forced. It just left me more frustrated than sad and now having to go through watching the character grieve is just making me groan.

Does anybody else feel this way? Maybe there's something I'm missing? Maybe some details I'm not considering?

Yeah It was a shock to see him die but I don't have a problem with it. Also with him being shot it was a mortal wound which means noting could have been done also with the current mindset of the characters I don't think there would have been a way for Yukari to summon her persona to even try to heal him.

Y’know that’s a good point I didn’t consider. Personas are such a mental thing it is definitely a possibility she wouldn’t have even been able to conjure it to try healing. They’ve been in stressful situations but not to this extent.

I think I would’ve liked that a lot more actually. To see her attempt to summon it with the evoker but it failing due to her panicked state of mind. Could’ve added more tension to the scene. Sanada and Mitsuru attempt to calm her down but she can’t take the pressure and he dies. Could’ve seen an arc of her fighting the guilt of being weak and finding new resolve to push forward. Would also be an added bonus of being a big contributing factor to her persona awakening/evolution or whatever you wanna call it.

[fender178]

Originally posted by i don't know:

Originally posted by fender178:

Yeah It was a shock to see him die but I don't have a problem with it. Also with him being shot it was a mortal wound which means noting could have been done also with the current mindset of the characters I don't think there would have been a way for Yukari to summon her persona to even try to heal him.

Y’know that’s a good point I didn’t consider. Personas are such a mental thing it is definitely a possibility she wouldn’t have even been able to conjure it to try healing. They’ve been in stressful situations but not to this extent.

I think I would’ve liked that a lot more actually. To see her attempt to summon it with the evoker but it failing due to her panicked state of mind. Could’ve added more tension to the scene. Sanada and Mitsuru attempt to calm her down but she can’t take the pressure and he dies. Could’ve seen an arc of her fighting the guilt of being weak and finding new resolve to push forward. Would also be an added bonus of being a big contributing factor to her persona awakening/evolution or whatever you wanna call it.

Yeah it would have been cool to see either Yukari or Akihiko try to summon their persona to try and save Shinji because both characters have access to healing.
Also remember Yukari had issues summoning her Persona during the beginning bits of the game on top of Akihiko questioning her and Junpei on whether or not they can summon their personas without difficulties during their first trip to Tartarus.

[Chopsteak]

Originally posted by fender178:

Originally posted by i don't know:

Y’know that’s a good point I didn’t consider. Personas are such a mental thing it is definitely a possibility she wouldn’t have even been able to conjure it to try healing. They’ve been in stressful situations but not to this extent.

I think I would’ve liked that a lot more actually. To see her attempt to summon it with the evoker but it failing due to her panicked state of mind. Could’ve added more tension to the scene. Sanada and Mitsuru attempt to calm her down but she can’t take the pressure and he dies. Could’ve seen an arc of her fighting the guilt of being weak and finding new resolve to push forward. Would also be an added bonus of being a big contributing factor to her persona awakening/evolution or whatever you wanna call it.

Yeah it would have been cool to see either Yukari or Akihiko try to summon their persona to try and save Shinji because both characters have access to healing.
Also remember Yukari had issues summoning her Persona during the beginning bits of the game on top of Akihiko questioning her and Junpei on whether or not they can summon their personas without difficulties during their first trip to Tartarus.

I always thought the way to make this scene more interesting was to have Ken be the one to actually kill Shinji. I never thought of the scenario where Yukari or Akihiko tried to heal Shinji's wounds, fail and deal with the guilt of that failure. That is an interesting alternative to think about.

[fender178]

Originally posted by Chopsteak:

Originally posted by fender178:

Yeah it would have been cool to see either Yukari or Akihiko try to summon their persona to try and save Shinji because both characters have access to healing.
Also remember Yukari had issues summoning her Persona during the beginning bits of the game on top of Akihiko questioning her and Junpei on whether or not they can summon their personas without difficulties during their first trip to Tartarus.

I always thought the way to make this scene more interesting was to have Ken be the one to actually kill Shinji. I never thought of the scenario where Yukari or Akihiko tried to heal Shinji's wounds, fail and deal with the guilt of that failure. That is an interesting alternative to think about.

Yeah I thought about Ken killing Shinji that would be interesting to see how the characters would react to him killing Shinji especially Akihiko. That's another interesting way to think about that scene.

[Ivas]

About trying to heal him. Let's take an anecdotal scenario and say you removed all healing from Yukari and Aki. And I definitely consider removing it from Aki. It would be a strange scene, wouldn't it? Yukari trying the move she doesn't have. So, you HAVE to either not try healing to avoid narrative/gameplay dissonance or make a different cutscene in case Yukari doesn't have a heal. The former is much easier