Magic: The Gathering Arena

Magic: The Gathering Arena

lofi911 Dec 20, 2024 @ 8:23am
"Opponent goes first" 10th time in a row.
What is this crap ?
Do I ever get to cast my card first?
Last edited by lofi911; Dec 20, 2024 @ 8:39am
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Showing 1-15 of 15 comments
Kurt Angle's Neck Dec 20, 2024 @ 8:32am 
Nope, you have been singled out and the WotC staff follows you around ensuring that you never go first, and that your opponents always do. They all also either flood you with mana or cause a drought any time that you have a chance at winning, because they want you specifically to gain any wins.

Or, you know... streaks occur in random environments, and stuff...
Andrei Dec 20, 2024 @ 8:55am 
I've had more than 10 several times. This is something that could and should be fixed easily by changing the matchmaking algorithm so that every player alternates after every match, same as chess. In chess tournaments you play one match with white and the next with black.

This isn't a big deal and could save players a lot of frustration because going second all the time is very rage-inducing.
Last edited by Andrei; Dec 20, 2024 @ 8:57am
Kurt Angle's Neck Dec 20, 2024 @ 9:06am 
Originally posted by Andrei:
This is something that could and should be fixed easily by changing the matchmaking algorithm so that every player alternates after every match, same as chess. In chess tournaments you play one match with white and the next with black.
First of all, I have never been to a chess tournament where this was how things operated.
Second, that is not how the rules of MTG operate.
103.1. At the start of a game, the players determine which one of them will choose who takes the first turn. In the first game of a match (including a single-game match), the players may use any mutually agreeable method (flipping a coin, rolling dice, etc.) to do so. In a match of several games, the loser of the previous game chooses who takes the first turn. If the previous game was a draw, the player who made the choice in that game makes the choice in this game. The player chosen to take the first turn is the starting player. The game’s default turn order begins with the starting player and proceeds clockwise.
The player that gets to go first is determined randomly at the beginning of each match, with the losing player getting to choose who gets to go first in the next round of the same match. This isn't represented entirely accurately in Arena, since you don't actually get to choose as the loser, but in the vast majority of cases players will choose for themselves to go first, which is what Arena defaults to for Bo3 games.
Andrei Dec 20, 2024 @ 9:37am 
As far as I know in chess round robin tournaments you always alternate.

What you're talking about is best of 3. Who starts first isn't a huge issue in best of 3. In best of 1 though, starting first is massive.
Kurt Angle's Neck Dec 20, 2024 @ 9:39am 
Originally posted by Andrei:
What you're talking about is best of 3. Who starts first isn't a huge issue in best of 3. In best of 1 though, starting first is massive.
That rule applies to both Bo3 and Bo1.
https://mtg.fandom.com/wiki/Starting_the_game
Andrei Dec 20, 2024 @ 10:08am 
Originally posted by Kurt Angle's Neck:
That rule applies to both Bo3 and Bo1.
https://mtg.fandom.com/wiki/Starting_the_game

Well, in that case it's a bad rule and they should change it. Like in best of 3, it doesn't matter because it's like a 51-49 split, but best of 1 is like 55-45 at least, given how it's much faster. It's very unfair starting second so many times and can be very easily fixed.
Kurt Angle's Neck Dec 20, 2024 @ 10:48am 
Originally posted by Andrei:
It's very unfair starting second so many times and can be very easily fixed.
It's only unfair if you view it through the scope of a very small sample size. If you zoom out and keep track of like 1000 games in a row, everything will look much more fair. You will also get streaks where you go first many times in a row, but those are much less noticable unless you're keeping a tracker.
Andrei Dec 20, 2024 @ 1:04pm 
Originally posted by Kurt Angle's Neck:
It's only unfair if you view it through the scope of a very small sample size. If you zoom out and keep track of like 1000 games in a row, everything will look much more fair. You will also get streaks where you go first many times in a row, but those are much less noticable unless you're keeping a tracker.

Yeah, law of large numbers, but in the short run it's gratuitously annoying and very easy for Wizards to avoid.
Winter Wolf Dec 20, 2024 @ 3:29pm 
Is it weird that my win% goes up when I streak a bunch of "your opponent goes first"s?
Last edited by Winter Wolf; Dec 20, 2024 @ 3:29pm
Traumaturgy Dec 20, 2024 @ 3:54pm 
Because most of the time it doesnt matter. Yea you cant win against really good hand of mono red aggro, buts its no matter if you start or not. In chess there is difference ibetween black and white starting, but its visible only at highest level, where people are masters in game. Here its just annoying yelling of people who dont even know the rules.
But bad players like to accuse everything (shuffler, player order, matchmaking) instead of their low skill and bad cards.
Andrei Dec 20, 2024 @ 4:02pm 
Originally posted by Traumaturgy:
Because most of the time it doesnt matter. Yea you cant win against really good hand of mono red aggro, buts its no matter if you start or not. In chess there is difference ibetween black and white starting, but its visible only at highest level, where people are masters in game. Here its just annoying yelling of people who dont even know the rules.
But bad players like to accuse everything (shuffler, player order, matchmaking) instead of their low skill and bad cards.

You have no idea what you're talking about. Starting order matters more in MTG than in chess.
Traumaturgy Dec 20, 2024 @ 4:05pm 
Dont be ridiculous.
Andrei Dec 20, 2024 @ 4:07pm 
Originally posted by Traumaturgy:
Dont be ridiculous.

Look:

"The advantages of going first are often quite large, resulting in a much higher than 50/50 chance to win the game, if all other factors are equal. Being on the play offers a substantial tempo advantage that's typically well worth skipping your first draw step. For refreshers on tempo and its many important consequences, see "Tempo" and "Tempo & Card Advantage: A Delicate Balance.""

https://magic.wizards.com/en/news/feature/play-or-draw-2015-03-16

PS: i've read about decks with a 20% difference in win rate between going first and going second, though I don't remember the actual source. But it definitely seems plausible with my experience.
Last edited by Andrei; Dec 20, 2024 @ 4:13pm
Fox Dec 20, 2024 @ 4:21pm 
STOP PLAYING BEST OF ONE.
anaris Dec 20, 2024 @ 5:44pm 
the overal difference is something like 4% and it's because of RDW that it's that; control players prefer going second, but fast aggro is 60% of the overall meta
Last edited by anaris; Dec 20, 2024 @ 5:45pm
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Date Posted: Dec 20, 2024 @ 8:23am
Posts: 15