What are your thoughts on Murders at Karlov Manor?

[Mirror]

While I dont care one way or another. Seems like just a gimmick set, even though it is a standard set. But what are your thoughts? Is it good, is it bad, or is it just more garbage being spewed out by Wizard/Hasbro?

[Winter Wolf]

Individually there are worthwhile cards but much of the top down theme (the gimmicky thing you mention) is not done in a way that allows for good competitive play. Disguise and Cloak (the first more than the latter) in particular are somewhat weak because 3 years of Standard makes 2/2 morph creatures not very good especially with the plethora of wraths and good removal.

Investigate adds to the types of artifact tokens so maybe there is some synergy deck out there that can lean on that to get near tier 1. The best impact I've seen so far is in Boros Agrgo where a number of MKM cards have helped make a 55-56% win capable archetype. Not a clear winner but also not the worst by a long shot.

I think there are some ways in which it will turn out to be a good set in the longrun but I'd forget about leaning too heavily into it to make Standard playable decks.

[Mirror]

Originally posted by Winter Wolf:

Individually there are worthwhile cards but much of the top down theme (the gimmicky thing you mention) is not done in a way that allows for good competitive play. Disguise and Cloak (the first more than the latter) in particular are somewhat weak because 3 years of Standard makes 2/2 morph creatures not very good especially with the plethora of wraths and good removal.

Investigate adds to the types of artifact tokens so maybe there is some synergy deck out there that can lean on that to get near tier 1. The best impact I've seen so far is in Boros Agrgo where a number of MKM cards have helped make a 55-56% win capable archetype. Not a clear winner but also not the worst by a long shot.

I think there are some ways in which it will turn out to be a good set in the longrun but I'd forget about leaning too heavily into it to make Standard playable decks.

Morph was good when it first released but bringing it back in a standard that has so much control and removal makes the feature/gimmick so pointless. Unless the morph ability has protection from removal would it be worthwhile but that would probably make it broken.

and you are right, there are some standout cards but the rest of the set is mostly pointless. I saw very few cards that made me want to invest any money or time on making a new deck. I looked and just said "meh"

[mwesthoff]

I haven't decided on getting the mastery pass yet. The card covers are better than normal. Still get a lot of standard packs ... even though I couldn't care less about any Alchemy set.

I may still get the Mastery pass, it is usually worth it... I will have to do the math.

[Winter Wolf]

Originally posted by Judy:

Originally posted by Winter Wolf:

Individually there are worthwhile cards but much of the top down theme (the gimmicky thing you mention) is not done in a way that allows for good competitive play. Disguise and Cloak (the first more than the latter) in particular are somewhat weak because 3 years of Standard makes 2/2 morph creatures not very good especially with the plethora of wraths and good removal.

Investigate adds to the types of artifact tokens so maybe there is some synergy deck out there that can lean on that to get near tier 1. The best impact I've seen so far is in Boros Agrgo where a number of MKM cards have helped make a 55-56% win capable archetype. Not a clear winner but also not the worst by a long shot.

I think there are some ways in which it will turn out to be a good set in the longrun but I'd forget about leaning too heavily into it to make Standard playable decks.

Morph was good when it first released but bringing it back in a standard that has so much control and removal makes the feature/gimmick so pointless. Unless the morph ability has protection from removal would it be worthwhile but that would probably make it broken.

and you are right, there are some standout cards but the rest of the set is mostly pointless. I saw very few cards that made me want to invest any money or time on making a new deck. I looked and just said "meh"

It's mostly the prevalence of RDW running Brotherhood's End on the aggro side and the control decks running control so the ward 2 of disguise is basically worthless despite being intended to be a foil against a removal heavy meta. And if a disguised creature ends up being flipped the odds are it might do something good (the 2 cost blink one for example, or the angel that removes things from the graveyard) but to get there you have to pay 3 mana and then play Hope MTG till you can afford the flip cost.

And there is an excellent pay off in the form of the RG Centaur legend BUT you have to get there and the fact is the 4/4 does not self protect so IT dies to doomblade (if you know the meme) in addition to not protecting the morphs even though Brotherhood's end does not deal with it.

And Cloak is little better with idea that you just don't care about what gets morphed because you are gonna get value from draws and wacky facedown shenanigans that don't pay attention to the face up part. OK but the cards that do that are slow and torturous and also are easily removed.

It isn't that the set is bad by itself but it does not synergize well with a 3 year Standard Rotation, where as the 2 previous sets maybe do it a little better.

[Soji]

Standard has so many cards in it right now these gimmick themes in the new set just get overshadowed by good stuff piles. Extending rotation has backfired on what they intended to happen, in them helping synergies out. Because of that its hard to say how much I really like the new set. I wasn't very impressed with WoE or Caverns so i was already kinda burnt out of the game before Manor started getting spoiled and now that I seen the whole thing my opinion still hasn't changed. Meh

[ode2dave]

Some of the cards I really like the Fairie Lord (UBx4) and Massacre Girl (Bx4) -- they fit in just about any deck I can come up with. I really like the idea of Disguise and think it has potential, but the cost is too high -- it should just be 2 to mask it, making it 3 causes it to be too slow to get out. And then the unmask costs are just too high as well. So great mechanic, but the costs basically make it unplayable for me.

[ʍolɟ ǝɥʇ ǝsɹǝʌǝɹ]

It's not for standard. It's for commander and to a lesser extent limited. 0 meta decks. I don't think meta is even affected tbh except for mole god

[Berserkr]

Originally posted by ode2dave:

Some of the cards I really like the Fairie Lord (UBx4) and Massacre Girl (Bx4) -- they fit in just about any deck I can come up with. I really like the idea of Disguise and think it has potential, but the cost is too high -- it should just be 2 to mask it, making it 3 causes it to be too slow to get out. And then the unmask costs are just too high as well. So great mechanic, but the costs basically make it unplayable for me.

Yeah but 2 cost without the ward 2 vs 3 cost with ward 2 is just not even comparable

[Terran Ghost]

Archdruid's charm looks like it could come in handy (I'm a green player) but haven't found a deck to put it in yet :(