too many or not enough land

[Keyser Söze]

Every draw is either not enough land or all land no cards. It happens so so often to me, same with two of the same cards in a row. In paper games I've never had this happen so often. Anyone else have this problem? Are the cards actually randomized of shuffles? Seems like a weird algorithm and not a random generator. Maybe just bad luck, but holy crap.

[Vesper9603]

Originally posted by Keyser Söze:

Every draw is either not enough land or all land no cards. It happens so so often to me, same with two of the same cards in a row. In paper games I've never had this happen so often. Anyone else have this problem? Are the cards actually randomized of shuffles? Seems like a weird algorithm and not a random generator. Maybe just bad luck, but holy crap.

Yeah, been happening to me non-stop/ I have a traditional mana curve deck with 24 lands and always get 2 mana and never draw a land. even when i pumped the land to 26 it still happens or i get flooded. I thought it was just bad luck, but alter a month of the same thing keeping me from hitting diamond, I'm getting pretty pissed off. I see why pp only play mono red and blue now

[Vesper9603]

Originally posted by Pressure Cooker:

Originally posted by Keyser Söze:

Every draw is either not enough land or all land no cards. It happens so so often to me, same with two of the same cards in a row. In paper games I've never had this happen so often. Anyone else have this problem? Are the cards actually randomized of shuffles? Seems like a weird algorithm and not a random generator. Maybe just bad luck, but holy crap.

Are you new to MTG arena? because it is common knowledge that the scrambler is corrupt. There's nothing that can be done. Thousands of people have complained about this for years and nothing has been fixed.

I think they do it on purpose to offset the skill and deck advantage.

[Ravenns24]

Yeah I love pulling nothing but lands in 17 land mono red deck or no lands in 26 mono black deck.

[Dewguru]

Originally posted by GarbageCollector:

It's not noticeably bad for everyone there's just 3 or 4 trolls that hang around here and repeatedly claim it's broken. Nobody ever provides any proof whatsoever. 99% of the time they won't even give you their decklist when you ask and see if maybe that's the reason they don't draw enough lands.

It's more than 3 or 4 people, and proof has been provided. Nice try.

I've run tests myself using the default MTG Arena decks.

You can even open a ticket with MTG Arena and they acknowledge that it's not a true random shuffler, but that the one they use, they're satisfied with.

They're fine with it, others are like yourself clearly, while other folks wish it was different.

[mwesthoff]

Originally posted by Keyser Söze:

Every draw is either not enough land or all land no cards. It happens so so often to me, same with two of the same cards in a row. In paper games I've never had this happen so often. Anyone else have this problem? Are the cards actually randomized of shuffles? Seems like a weird algorithm and not a random generator. Maybe just bad luck, but holy crap.

Yes, I have absolutely noticed it. Today I drew 4 lands in my opening hand for the first time in several months in an 18 land deck.

They've cranked up the land rape simulator. Everybody pray for a reach around while we endure this painful sodomization of our land!!!

[Big_Beaver]

I often play with the recommended number of lands the game tells me to use, and I often find myself having 4-5 games in a row where I draw cards and don't get any lands for 5-6 turns. The algorithm is broken. I can't possibly have such bad luck all the time and I'm literally playing with what this game recommends me to use.

[The_Dybbuk_King]

Originally posted by Lich Necromancer:

Originally posted by GarbageCollector:

It's not noticeably bad for everyone there's just 3 or 4 trolls that hang around here and repeatedly claim it's broken. Nobody ever provides any proof whatsoever. 99% of the time they won't even give you their decklist when you ask and see if maybe that's the reason they don't draw enough lands.

Care to share your decklist? How many lands and how many cards are you running?

4 or 5 trolls lol
in every MTG arena community there are players complaining about the shuffler. On Reddit a player tested more than 1000 plays with detailed data that the shuffler is broken. Even the OP who is a new MTG arena player noticed that the shuffler is strange. How much more proof do you want that the shuffler is broken and corrupt? I think the troll here is you.

That isn't "Proof" lmao

People with no credibility making claims with absolutely 0 data is called "♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥" and you are eating it up.

[Doctor Zalgo]

Originally posted by Big_Beaver:

I often play with the recommended number of lands the game tells me to use, and I often find myself having 4-5 games in a row where I draw cards and don't get any lands for 5-6 turns. The algorithm is broken. I can't possibly have such bad luck all the time and I'm literally playing with what this game recommends me to use.

So you're saying that for the shuffler to be random it has to be coded so that after 5 non-lands it forces a land? Because that's the opposite of what random is.

[[DbT]Kenny]

Originally posted by Keyser Söze:

Every draw is either not enough land or all land no cards. It happens so so often to me, same with two of the same cards in a row. In paper games I've never had this happen so often. Anyone else have this problem? Are the cards actually randomized of shuffles? Seems like a weird algorithm and not a random generator. Maybe just bad luck, but holy crap.

yep it duff. the Mrs and myself get a lot of it onetime when i was player her I got 20 land in a row and she no land at all.

[[DbT]Kenny]

Originally posted by Doctor Zalgo:

Originally posted by Big_Beaver:

I often play with the recommended number of lands the game tells me to use, and I often find myself having 4-5 games in a row where I draw cards and don't get any lands for 5-6 turns. The algorithm is broken. I can't possibly have such bad luck all the time and I'm literally playing with what this game recommends me to use.

So you're saying that for the shuffler to be random it has to be coded so that after 5 non-lands it forces a land? Because that's the opposite of what random is.

ok rule -1 computers suck and randomising anything. many test have proven this. play the lottery and get 5 random line. odds are all number with 3 of each other within two set on a line. I think a study was done on this as well. so 5 line of almost the two set of numbers.
in a card game this you do need a check put to stop long run of land or no land. play real cards i never seen more 5 lands in a row. not like we see the pack before we play so the computer pull card from the bottom then middle then top. to stop runs like this is fair.

[anaris]

1: the shuffler is indistinguishable from random. Two large datasets, one of over a million games and the other of over a billion games, have proved this.

2: literally everything in this paragraph is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥:

ok rule -1 computers suck and randomising anything. many test have proven this. play the lottery and get 5 random line. odds are all number with 3 of each other within two set on a line. I think a study was done on this as well. so 5 line of almost the two set of numbers.
in a card game this you do need a check put to stop long run of land or no land. play real cards i never seen more 5 lands in a row. not like we see the pack before we play so the computer pull card from the bottom then middle then top. to stop runs like this is fair.

most lotteries aren't even computer generated lol

[anaris]

oh and 3: True random datasets produce *exactly this reaction* from laypeople when they've been studied. There are a series of statistical biases that make humans expect the exact opposite outcomes from "random data". So there's also literally scientific proof that if the shuffler was random, we'd see lots of people who are convinced it isn't.

so, to reiterate:

the shuffler is definitely random
people who think it isn't don't understand randomness
if the shuffler truly was random, seeing a bunch of people complaining about how it isn't random is *exactly what we would expect*.

So we have multiple different strands of evidence, all of which are consistent with randomness and none of which disagree with randomness. One of them even makes a testable prediction, which we test by looking to see if people post threads like this (which they do).

On the other side, against this extensive statistical and scientific evidence, we have:

12 extremely angry idiots on this forum who are already provably wrong about several of the things they think.

[Doctor Zalgo]

How much scry/surveil/explore are you running? How much land are you running? Have you actually run the maths to see what your percentage chance of getting land is on any given draw?

Both ChatGPT and Claude can write and run a python script to calculate the answers for you if you need it.

[Doctor Zalgo]

Originally posted by DbTKenny:

in a card game this you do need a check put to stop long run of land or no land.

This is the opposite of random.

[Doctor Zalgo]

Originally posted by Big_Beaver:

I often play with the recommended number of lands the game tells me to use, and I often find myself having 4-5 games in a row where I draw cards and don't get any lands for 5-6 turns. The algorithm is broken. I can't possibly have such bad luck all the time and I'm literally playing with what this game recommends me to use.

Probability of Drawing a Land on Each Turn Given Previous Draws:
P(Land)
Turn 2 3 4 5
Previous Draws
None 41.509434 NaN NaN NaN
L 40.384615 40.384615 NaN NaN
L L 39.285714 39.285714 39.285714 NaN
L L L 38.211382 38.211382 38.211382 38.211382
L L N 38.461538 38.461538 38.461538 38.461538
L N 41.176471 41.176471 NaN NaN
L N L 40.000000 40.000000 40.000000 40.000000
L N N 42.105263 42.105263 42.105263 42.105263
N 41.935484 41.935484 NaN NaN
N L 40.816327 40.816327 40.816327 NaN
N L L 39.722222 39.722222 39.722222 39.722222
N L N 39.975082 39.975082 39.975082 39.975082
N N 42.735043 42.735043 NaN NaN
N N L 41.666667 41.666667 41.666667 41.666667
N N N 43.478261 43.478261 43.478261 43.478261

OK, cut and paste it into notepad or something, but the TLDR is even if you get to turn 5 without drawing land, your chance of getting land is still a coin flip (unless you're using surveil, scry, explore, or similar to juice your odds.